I’m into analogies lately.
I said: Money is to JP as Precioussss is to Gollum.
Now, I’m saying that “Tarzan” is to Dalmi as “sailing without a map” is to Dosan.
Those words are their “keywords.”
She was working on a Tarzan project and test-driving a Tarzan car.
And Dosan was sailing without a map on a beautiful calm sea.
Next, a lurker, @letsgetthisbread, wrote to ask me,
I’m so happy I found this blog because I have been pretty annoyed by the comments in social media about the two guys. They’ve been calling dosan a “manipulative sadboy” (someone who guilts people into thinking he did nothing wrong/uses sadness to manipulate people) and I would like to get your opinion regarding this. Because I really don’t think he is but I am worried that maybe I am just unable to recognize such behavior because I’m really whipped for dosan right now haha. Thanks!
My short answer is no.
My long answer will come later. As you should know by now, when I assert a particular point of view, I back my claim up with AT LEAST three occasions or scenes from the script. I don’t like to rely on “feels.” So, to refute their argument, I decided to look at ALL instances when Dosan cried. So far, I’ve listed:
two scenes from Episode 7: Burn Rate,
two scenes from Episode 8: Backup,
three from Episode 9: Risk,
two scenes from Episode 10: Demo Day,
one scene from Episode 11: Exit,
five scenes from Episode 12: Acquihiring
Those 15 scenes will comprise MY counterargument. I hope that will that be enough for you. lol.
Next, the love letters.
I’m sure this has been read by many Dosan fans already because I mentioned it in the comment section of “JP’s Growing Self-Awareness Thread.” Here’s what I wrote, with edits:
I find it interesting that Dalmi had to tell Dosan that he wasn’t the Dosan who wrote his letters. Her exact words were “You’re not the Dosan from the letters, and I’m not your dream.”
You see, Chulsan also mentioned something about Dosan’s writing. His CODEwriting, to be exact. Chulsan’s exact words were “I’ve reviewed your code for thousands of cases. Just one look in your eyes and I know what you’re thinking. Your eyes say you haven’t given up.”
I think Dosan was using a programming language called “Python.” It’s easy to learn and understand, and check and modify. But despite its “readability,” it can support the most complex application. I heard that it’s the simplicity of the language which allows the program to accomplish many great things.
In a way, Dosan’s feelings for Dalmi are like this python programming language; they’re easy enough to read.
After years of friendship, Chulsan could understand his feelings as easily as he could understand his codes. That’s what he meant when he said, that “Your eyes say that you haven’t given up. I can tell that you’ve made a decision. What is that decision?
So for me, ala-Cyrano again, Dosan’s codes were all an expression of her love for Dalmi. Do you see what I’m getting at? 😂
The codes were his LOVE LETTERS to Dalmi, Fern. The program he was writing on the plane was essentially his love letter, only written in codes. My guess is his letter was saying goodbye to Dalmi, while promising her great things.
Last, re Noongil and pride.
If my hunch is correct, Dosan is NOT going to let JP pay for Noongil. I know that he begged JP to help them save NoonGil. However, this wasn’t the FIRST time that Dosan had BEGGED for NoonGil to be saved.
He begged that bad guy, Chairman Won of Morning Glory — on his knees.
And now, he was begging “Good Boy” — on his back.
His actions indicate that he was more concerned about saving NoonGil than losing his pride.
He wasn’t any different from Dalmi, who in Episode 8, was going to beg Chairman Won for money. She even asked InJae for help her gain entry to her stepfather’s office.
From Episode 8, 1:03:51:
InJae: “Chairman Won”? Why are you referring to him so politely today.
Dalmi: I need to scrape up what little respect I have for him. Do you think I can meet him?
InJae: I doubt it. After making such a scene…he probably filed a restraining order.
Dalmi: Can you come with me then? I’m sure he’d let you in.
InJae: Me? Why should I?
Dalmi: Because I’m going to your father to beg for his forgiveness.
InJae: “Beg”? What’s this all about? Don’t you have any pride.
Dalmi: I’m on the edge of a precipice now. I couldn’t care less about my pride.
InJae: (Sigh)
Dalmi: Take me to him. Watch me make a complete fool of myself.
InJae: Follow me.
Three noteworthy things here:
1. InJae is a formidable CEO. Not only does she read her opponent’s next move, she plays her cards close to her chest.
2. Dalmi calls her “unnie.” Even though they’re mad at each other, Dalmi still acknowledges their big sister/younger sister relationship in private.
3. InJae pounces on that word “beg.”
For me, that’s InJae’s precioussssss: pride. Her pride. Her family’s pride. Her sister’s pride.
Money isn’t preciousssss to her, like it is for like JP. It’s pride in oneself or self-respect.
She heard her father beg her mother to allow him to quit his day job. She saw her father accept the beatings from the boss. I think she pitied her father but she didn’t like that he showed no pride. He allowed himself to be chewed up like a piece of bubblegum, then spat out.
Hence, her Sand Box goal. She wrote, “I don’t want to be seen as a chewed-up gum.”
So both Dosan and Dalmi were willing to swallow their pride when they were desperate. They didn’t mind begging to save NoonGil.
However, an important event in Episode 11 showed that Dalmi and Dosan’s understanding of pride was still evolving. The event was JP offering to be Dalmi’s Plan B.
Without consulting each other, both Dalmi and Dosan concluded that JP’s Plan B was an unacceptable option for their company.
Here’s Dalmi’s response when Saha informed her of JP’s Plan B for NoonGil.
From Episode 11 at 16:01:
Dalmi: I don’t want to do that. That plan B will put pressure on Mr. Han as well. And most importantly, accepting that will be like negating everything, including all the time and effort we put into Samsan Tech’s accomplishments. My pride won’t allow that.
Saha: “Pride”? Who’s the one that got down on her knees and begged me?
Dalmi: Who? Someone did that? I don’t remember.
Saha: Fine. I’ll say that I don’t remember either. Since you don’t want to take plan B.
Dalmi: Yes, we must win the upcoming Demo Day no matter what.
My take here is that she didn’t want to impose on JP. She didn’t want to rely on JP as a backup. She didn’t want him to personally invest in them. She was aware that JP did NOT fully support that NoonGil project, and was a very reluctant mentor to the group.
These are strong words coming from Dalmi: “…accepting (his offer) will NEGATE everything, including time and effort we put into Samsan Tech’s accomplishment.”
And it sounded like a deja-vu. Remember when she chose Dosan as keyman and ignored JP’s opinion? JP was stunned that she went against him. She denied it, saying, “No, I followed your advice. Whatever I choose, I can’t satisfy everyone. So I made a choice that I knew would be criticized by only one person.”
Here again, she was making a choice that she knew would be criticized by one person, JP, but she was doing it for the sake of what’s good for the company. She wouldn’t have JP as their Plan B.
Of course, I’m glad that she didn’t want to depend on JP. JP, like Alex Kwon, thought NoonGil was a drain. In Alex’s words, it was an “unnecessary service.” He said, “Any unnecessary services and personnel should go.
Meanwhile, in JP’s words, NoonGil was a “stew” as in “Why waste caviar in a stew?” By stew, he meant a pejorative metaphor to describe the anxiety of regular folks losing their vision.
Now, while Dalmi was rejecting JP’s plan B as an alternative, Dosan also was telling the guys that he was rejecting JP’s plan B. It was Youngsan who helped him voice his sentiments.
Dosan: Chulsan. You know, the Plan B Mr. Han offered? I don’t want it.
Chulsan: What? Why would you turn down such a great offer?
Youngsan: (arriving) I don’t want it either.
Chulsan: Where the heck have you been?
Youngsan: (ignoring Chulsan) Not just that. I no longer want anything to do with him.
Chulsan: What’s with both of you today? Why are you being so extreme?
Youngsan: He’s been helping us out because of Ms. Seo, not for Samsan Tech’s sake. Am I wrong? He’ll invest as if he’s giving alms? I’m sure it’d bother you the most.
Bravo! Give this Youngsan a beer! He got it right. lol. This is what JP’s fangirls miss bigtime. JP was only good to Dalmi, not to Samsan Tech. If Dalmi wasn’t with Samsan Tech, he wouldn’t be helping the guys out.
So, if JP’s offer to be Plan B made Dalmi and Dosan rethink their perspectives on pride, then it was Youngsan in Episode 12 who reminded Dosan about company pride.
After Dosan’s breakup with Dalmi, Youngsan revealed his real reason for wanting to go to Silicon Valley.
Youngsan: So you two broke up? I’m sorry. You must hate me by now.
Dosan: Don’t overreact. It’s not your fault. Youngsan. When you quit your job, and joined us, you said you were sick of being a cog in a machine. That’s why you quit. At this rate, we’ll go back to being a cog.
Youngsan: I know that.
Dosan: Is that how much money and career means to you? Enough to undo your decision?
Youngsan: Do you think I want to join 2STO because of money and my career?
Dosan: Then what’s the reason?
Youngsan: Dosan. I don’t want that jerk to remember us as a failure.
Dosan: That jerk? Did you mean Mr. Han?
Dosan seemed to be confused about the word “jerk.” How many jerks did he know? Two, right? JP and Alex. He called JP a rich greedy jerk before. But Alex was a bigger jerk for reneging on his word, acqhiring only the engineers, and dumping NoonGil.
Youngsan: Don’t you remember what he told us right here?
Flashback: JP was bragging, “Among the start-ups that I didn’t invest in, zero succeeded. None of them. I don’t want to lose the latter record.”
Youngsan: The record he was talking about includes my brother. That’s when I made up my mind. To enter Sand Box where Mr. Han is, and smash that personal record of his that he was proud of. And this is the moment. It’s not for money. But it’s for my brother.
And there we have Youngsan’s preciousssss: his dead Hyung. Avenging the wrongful death of his brother was something he wouldn’t give up.
Youngsan: So please, Dosan. Let’s not be remembered as a failure. Okay?
Dosan had teary eyes. This was Youngsan’s pitch to Dosan. Youngsan tried to convince him that:
a: they should see their employment at 2STO as an opportunity to prove JP’s estimation of them as failure wrong.
b. Dosan should show more pride.
That’s why I don’t think he would accept JP’s assistance to maintain NoonGil. He was going to work on a program himself which would expand NoonGil’s users and make it profitable and viable on its own. That’s why he went to 2STO office the following day to speak with Alex.
I see this as a window to their future.
Okay. That’s it for now. Gnight!
Brilliant as usual, @pm3.
Yes brilliant!! Love the connections you made @pm3
From Dalmi, Dosan and Yongsan’s rejection of Plan B it looks like JP is the main antagonist. Maybe not outright bad evil guy kind though he was the one who ‘murdered’ Yongsan’s brother with words.
I thought Chairman Won would be but he isn’t given enough screen time to be one.
Youngsan definitely thinks JP is the bad guy. Dosan? I think he considers Alex as bad guy. I think he’s willing (again!) to cut JP some slack because of Grandma.
I forgot to mention: the risky part about “acqhiring” is that the loyalty of the engineers hired away from the startups is always suspect.
You can never be sure if they’re staying only for the money and will leave you as soon as a better offer comes up. 😂 For instance, what if the founder of their original startup (like Dalmi) creates a new business and offers the engineers to work together again? Will the Acqhired engineer (like Samsan Tech guys) take the offer up? See that? 😂
@packmule3, My take on JP is that his self-interest comes first. I tend to suspect his “feelings” about Grandma and Dalmi. Dosan, Grandma and Dalmi, as well as the San guys all have seemed to sacrifice their own needs, goals for others. There doesn’t seem to be evidence that JP even has the ability to think along those lines. It just seems to me that this part of him is missing and/or that never had a chance to develop. We’ve seen so many lost chances of following through with help for grandma including buying her new sneakers now to a 15 year radio silence. And his “feelings” for Dalmi are complicated by his competition with Dosan. He doesn’t even remember the contents of the letters he wrote to her. You’d think that if this period was so significant to him, that he’d remember something more than the bird house/mailbox.
I also think that Dalmi has an abundance if empathy. She seeks to help Dosan, eventhough it breaks her heart. She aldo is not looking to hurt JP, although her sympathies towards him appear to be a mistaken sense ofbher grandmother’s relationship with him. She seems unaware ofvthe bumps in their road.
And whether he wanted to ir not, Dosancame cleanwith Dalmi. He told her the truth. And therein lie the building blocks for an eventual healthy relationship.
Thanks again @packmule3 for giving us so much to chew onwith your evidence based aporoach to viewing these dramas.
Regarding the risk of employee loyalty in an acquhire – I think it would depend on how tight knit the group is & terms of the compensation contracts. I’d imagine it’s fairly common for restructuring in any merger & acquistions & redundant personals laid off. Managers are just as vulnerable as production staff as you don’t really need multiple CEOs once an acquistion is folded in. Individuals probably will access based on both personal loyalty to ex-colleagues / bosses (there’s any) & personal circumstances at the time. IJ lost her developers at the start of the Hackathon despite their loyalty to her because they have familes to consider too.
Hi @Pia! I’ve been seeing your comments on previous Start Up posts and made me revisit them again. Like you, I found this blog late. I was probably on the last 4 eps and amidst all the fan wars and hubris, this was a sane and safe place to discuss characters, script, nuances and story arcs, and swoon worthy moments, too!
I also connect with the business aspect of the story. I’ve been through several divestitures/acquisitions. As employees, our choices are limited to accept or decline the new company offer with a 1 year contract clause. We can’t go back to the current company (until after 1 year) since “all headcount and resources” are part of the acquisition deal. The redundancies and re-org, in my experience, will come after the integration with new co. For the SST acquisition, since they are still small, it was probably an easy decision to weed out the unnecessary aspects early on. But There has to be something mentioned in the contract to this effect. Anyway, I’m letting that slide since the parting is needed for their growth story.
Pls join us on our rewatch this Saturday for ep2, if you can. That’s always fun.