I was going to delay writing about this but…
Ella asked:
@grace yes the first time when she came to the rooftop apartment was because of InJae pushing her but after the talk with DoSan, she apologized and she left almost immediately. Then jump to her going after DoSan in the country side but why though? She did say she’s not done yet, not done pitching her proposal at the expense of hurting DoSan more? or she cannot accept that she and DoSan are done? I don’t know haha.. this is where i need you all to help me get the context, her reasoning.
I get what you’re saying, Ella.
Dalmi left the SanSam Tech offices because Dosan told her that he didn’t want to see her again. She cried in the car. You would have expected her to honor Dosan’s wish and not show her pretty face again in front of him. But then she went chasing after him to the end of the world.
So why?
Here are some possible theories. I’ll limit myself to three.
1. She told InJae what happened, and InJae ordered her to go back again. She then went to Dosan’s house.
2. She went to church and prayed to God to forgive her for the shameless thing she was about to do. Fortified with prayer, she then went to Dosan’s house to brazen it out.
3. She met JP in the garage. JP finally had the brain lobotomy that he needed, and confessed to Dalmi what he had really told Dosan in the elevator.
Remember now: prior to meeting Dalmi in the garage, JP encountered Youngsan at the lobby of Sand Box. Youngsan wanted to rent an office because they were going to stay in Seoul and start a new business.
Then, JP took the elevator. He rubbed his forehead and said aloud, “They’re not just visiting?”
He was rubbing his head because he realized he made an error. A colossal error.
It wouldn’t be the first time for this jerk…errr…this “Good Boy” (roll eyes here) to make a colossal error.
But what was his error?
Let’s go back to the beginning, shall we? Let’s go back to the day of the ransomware attack. That was the day he finally realized that Dalmi was still in love with Dosan.
Dalmi: I feel so ashamed.
JP: Why? Even the Pentagon has been attacked by ransomware. It’s just bad luck.
Note: He’s changed here. In the olden days, he would have scolded Dalmi for being an inept CEO. Remember this? From Episode 6:
Dalmi: No. That kind of excuse doesn’t work. I’m so ashamed of myself. I should’ve made sure everything was backed up before the demonstration. A problem occurred, and I didn’t even know what to do. I couldn’t be more pathetic. Why now, of all times? (she glances at Dosan’s jacket) Why did he have to come now, of all times?
JP: (doesn’t say anything)
Dalmi: You know, right? I’m not usually this pathetic.
JP: You’ve never been pathetic.
Dalmi: Why is he on vacation now, of all times? When I’m in the worst possible situation? Couldn’t he have at least given me a heads-up? This is humiliating.
Let me spell it out: the reason Dalmi was crying was because she wanted to look her best when Dosan reappeared. The reason ANY GIRL would desperately want to look her best in front of an ex-boyfriend is because she STILL. had. feelings. for. him.
JP finally understood that Dalmi was still in love with Dosan.
Now, if JP was truly a “good boy,” he would have known to quit the game. He shouldn’t interfere anymore in the “course of true love” and instead, help Dalmi get back together again with Dosan.
While waiting for the elevator, he looked at the gift he’d planned to give Dalmi. He grimaced. Judging by his facial expression, I think it’s safe to say that he knew that a proposal from him to Dalmi would be met with a rejection.
It would be a “Strike Three! You’re out!!!”
But then the elevator doors opened, and Dosan came out. JP put a hand on his chest (Assaulttttttt!!! lol) and pushed him back inside.
Note: JP’s behavior might have changed with Dalmi, but his behavior with Dosan remained the same. He was still interfering in the love story of Dosan and Dalmi.
Remember this? From Episode 2, he dragged Dosan away from Dalmi just before their fateful encounter.
He was doing the same thing all over again. Rather than help the two get together, he drove them apart.
JP: Let’s talk.
Dosan: I have nothing to talk about with you.
JP: Aren’t you here to see Ms. Seo? If you are, find another time, not today.
Dosan: Do I need your permission to meet Dalmi, Director Han?
JP: Yes. (then motioning Dosan to get off the elevator)
Dosan: What gives you the right?
JP: I’m pretty sure I have the right.
Now, this clown JP might call this behavior “petty,” but let’s call a spade a spade. He lied.
Dosan: Don’t tell me…
JP: Yes, that’s right. Three years is a long time. Long enough for relationships to change.
Dosan: (swallowing)
JP: (motioning again for him to get off)
Question: Where have we seen this despicable behavior of JP before?
Answer: The scrunchie incident. JP’s crazy fangirls didn’t see anything wrong with that. But I said it was the pivotal point and it disqualified him as a possible hero.
To refresh our memories of the scrunchie incident:
JP: I’m glad I ran into you. Give this to Ms. Seo.
Dosan: Why do you have this?
JP: I found it while cleaning the car.
Dosan: Are you sure it’s Dalmi’s? Not another girl’s?
JP: (pausing to think about this) What? It can’t be another girl’s.
Dosan: (feigning surprise) You’ve never had a girlfriend?
JP: Why are you asking such a thing?
Dosan: (attacking again) You live close by. Consider riding a bike instead. For the environment and your health, okay?
JP: (bewildered, he nodded as if Dosan was the superior one. lol.)
Dosan: Bye.
JP: (still speechless)
Dosan: (tapping on the hood and smiling)
JP: What. Hey. Darn it. He’s so annoying.
This is what I said about it:
Look: I get that he’s jealous. But what he did was totally an asshole move.
Do you see what was wrong with it?
1. JP used Dalmi as a “spear” to attack Dosan’s “shield.” He was jealous and he wanted to strike at Dosan using a G.I.R.L.
2. He should have returned the scrunchie to the rightful owner, Dalmi. THIS was the right thing to do. THIS is what a gentleman would do. Instead, he gave it to Dosan with an innocent face.
3. He gave it to Dosan to make him jealous. He wanted Dosan to think that Dalmi was seeing him behind his back, and that something was going on between the two of them. This is an asshole move! If fangirls weren’t stupidly crushing on his face, then they’d see that his action was utterly despicable.
FACT: If a second female lead tried this on the heroine — that is, leave a tube of lipstick or an earring in the hero’s car to make it appear as if they had a hot date behind the heroine’s back — the fangirls would be up in arms. They’d know that the intention there was to wreak havoc.
4. He didn’t even darn think that he made Dalmi look like a two-timer, meeting with him SECRETLY. He didn’t care at all about Dalmi’s reputation.
5. He heard Dalmi’s request and he did EXACTLY what Dalmi requested him NOT to do.
Dalmi asked him. “Also, I have a favor to ask you. Please don’t tell Dosan about this (her search for the investors) I want him to focus on his work without worrying about money.” He replied, “That’s very touching.”
Notice how he twisted Dalmi’s words? Sure, he didn’t tell Dosan about her search for investors and he didn’t cause Dosan to worry about money. But he implied that Dalmi went out with him secretly and he made Dosan worry about a cheating girlfriend.
6. He deliberately set out to ruin her relationship with Dosan.
His trashy move tells me that he does NOT love Dalmi. Otherwise, he would have cared that:
a. Dalmi would have been upset by his action.
b. Dalmi was made to look like a cheater.
c. Dalmi’s wishes were flouted.No. He’s out. He’s not acceptable.
Now, do you see why the Elevator Speech was wrong? The same arguments applies.
1. JP was jealous of Dosan so he attacked Dosan by using Dalmi. JP used Dalmi as a spear to Dosan’s shield because JP knew that Dosan’s weak spot was Dalmi.
2. The scrunchie = JP’s lies
He said three lies in the elevator.
One, Dosan did NOT need his permission to meet Dalmi.
Two, JP had ZERO rights over Dalmi.
Three, the relationship between JP and Dalmi had NOT changed over three years. Dalmi was still uncomfortable around him.
3. He lied to make Dosan jealous. He wanted Dosan to think that Dalmi’s feelings have changed.
Fun fact: if the second female lead tried this on the heroine, e.g., pretend to leave the hero’s hotel room at night, viewers would be up in arms.
4. To get Dosan jealous, he made Dalmi seem like a cheat and a two-timer.
5. He knew that Dalmi still cared for Dosan but it didn’t stop him from putting a wedge between the two. He called his behavior “petty.” I call it “pathetic.”
6. He deliberately set to ruin Dalmi’s relationship with Dosan with a lie.
See that? The arguments are the same for the scrunchie and the Elevator Scene. JP intended the Elevator Speech Lie to damage the relationship between Dosan and Dalmi.
Nasty guy. Ugh!
As soon as the elevator doors closed on Dosan, JP leaned against the wall. He KNEW that he did a terrible thing…to Dalmi. I don’t think he’d acknowledge that he did Dosan dirty here. He didn’t care for Dosan’s feelings, only Dalmi’s.
So he called up Dalmi to apologize.
JP the ASS: What have I done? (calls up Dalmi) I just ran into Mr Nam in the elevator. I said something to stop him from going to see you, and he might have gotten the wrong idea about us. I apologize.
Dalmi: Well, that’s fine.
JP: You can still catch up with him.
Dalmi: That’s unnecessary. He’s going back to the US anyway. Also, our relationship ended three years ago.
JP: Thanks for saying that. Okay, then.
lol. So many viewers immediately rejoiced because this time around, he apologized.
Wellll….that’s how low the standards have been set for JP when an apology from him is already a step-up. (rolls eyes)
Here are the facts:
Fact 1: This is a lie: “I said something to stop him from going to see you, and he might have gotten the wrong idea about us.” He just didn’t “say something.” He LIED so that Dosan would get the wrong idea that Dalmi was dating JP.
Fact 2: He didn’t apologize to the RIGHT person. He should apologize to Dosan.
Fact 3: An apology without penalty or restitution is just words. Hot air. He needs to make amends.
Note this, too: When JP said, “Thanks for saying that,” he was expressing relief that Dalmi wasn’t angry with him for doing what he did to Dosan in the elevator. He didn’t have to feel guilty! He’d been absolved!
JP would be like: “I didn’t do anything wrong.”
In his mind, he didn’t commit any foul because Dalmi said, she was fine because Dosan was leaving anyway. “No harm, no foul,” right?
Soooooo…that was JP’s error.
He thought he didn’t have to worry for lying to Dosan because he was leaving anyway. Since Dalmi said he was returning the US, he had no worries about Dosan’s feelings.
But as soon as he learned from Youngsan that the guys were staying, he knew he created a colossal mess. That was the reason for his headache.
His conscience should be bothering him. lol.
It didn’t help that the first person he saw in the garage was Dalmi. She was banging her head against the car window.
JP: Your hair almost looks like a bird’s nest. Is something bothering you?
Dalmi: No, nothing.
JP: Come on. Are you not telling me because I’m not your mentor anymore?
Dalmi: No, it’s not like that. Morning AI took our developers away. So we have to hire developers to fill C-level positions. We were thinking of Dosan and the guys. I just made an offer to him. But he flat-out turned it down.
JP: He finally did something I approved of.
Dalmi: Mr. Han!
JP: I should give you advice, but I’m too personally involved. So I won’t.
And we all know how he was “personally involved,” right? He did his “Elevator Speech” to Dosan before Dalmi was able to pitch her “Tarzan” project to Dosan.
That’s why the title of the Episode 14 was “Elevator Speech: A brief, persuasive speech during an elevator ride.” Now, don’t get me wrong. Obviously, ALL the characters had their own version of elevator speech, but THIS scene with Dosan and JP was the critical one in this episode.
Attention: To newcomers/lurkers who come on my blog telling me what to write and what to think: SHOVE OFF. That’s my Elevator Speech. lol.
Dalmi: This is why I wasn’t going to tell you. But you insisted that I tell you.
JP: Sorry. I guess I’m quite petty.
There. There’s your answer, Ella. 😊 That’s MY THEORY: Dalmi went after Dosan in the middle of nowhere because JP confessed his Elevator Lie to Dalmi.
I’m assuming that JP finally overcame his pettiness and admitted to Dalmi that he lied to Dosan and gave him the wrong idea about their relationship.
*If* JP admitted to his lies, everything would make sense to Dalmi. She would understand why Dosan told her that he didn’t want to see her again.
Dosan: Dalmi.
Dalmi: Yes?
Dosan: You said to me that we shouldn’t be unreasonable and hold on to an illusion.
Dalmi: I did.
Dosan: Back then, those words hurt me so deeply. But eventually, I realized that…you were right. The person that you loved wasn’t me. The person I loved was not you, either. I spent the last three years accepting that. I don’t want to be confused anymore. So I don’t want to see you again.
*IF* JP admitted the truth to Dalmi, she would go up to her office and retrieve Dosan’s jacket.
You do know the significance of the jacket, right?
The jacket SHOULD remind her of the time he came to the networking party in his suit. He looked “cool” to her. He also looked cool when he came to fix her ransomware problem.
In kdramas, “suavely” removing jacket is a trope. lol. Here, Dosan looked like he meant business.
But I’m sure the jacket would have another significance for Dalmi. Something like: she always believed in him. He thought that he was only suitable for sweatshirts and sweats, but she’d always known that suits would fit him best. In other words, she didn’t want to bog him down when he was given much potential so she had to let him go….and all that crap.
She was going to use his jacket as an excuse to talk to him again. She went to his house with the intention to have a heart-to-heart talk. But when she found out that Dosan had gone far away, she followed him there, too.
She was determined to follow Dosan because she knew he must be hurting from the lies that JP said.
lol. If I were Dosan, I would have been scared silly to see her coming out of the nowhere.
Dosan: Is that a person?
She was limping and her face was grimy. From the looks of it, she must have fallen down a ditch or two. I know she’s Suzy but hey, in the dark she looked like a swamp monster.
Dosan: I’m so hungry that I’m seeing things.
Dalmi: Dosan.
Dosan: Dalmi. What are you doing here?
Dalmi: Your parents told me that you’d be here.
Dosan: My parents? Why?
Dalmi: I begged them to tell me. (sitting down beside him) You left your jacket in my office. I came to return it to you and talk to you.
See here: I don’t think she begged his parents just to pitch the Tarzan project. She begged his parents because she knew what JP had told him in the elevator.
Dosan: I thought we were done. Why did you come all the way here?
Dalmi: (firmly) You may be done, but I’m not.
If my theory is correct that JP confessed to her, then she knew that Dosan was only saying these things to her because he believed the lies and he was hurting. He thought she loved JP, and not him. That’s why she behaved stoically. She wasn’t going to let anything he said, hurt her because she understood that he was only lashing out.
Dalmi: We need to talk.
Dosan: (standing up to get his bag)
Dalmi: Dosan.
Dosan: (walking away)
Dalmi: Where are you going? It’s late. Are you crazy?
Dosan: (looking around)
Dosan: Do you know how I came here? It took me five hours to bike here from Seoul. I had a long, painful journey, falling and rolling on the unpaved road. How could you show up here so easily? This is killing me. Why is it so easy for you?
She let his angry words roll off her.
That’s all Dosan said to her, but internally, he said a whole lot more. In his head, he was also telling her, “Why is this so hard? I’ve long forgotten the guys I’ve spent years together in the military. Out of my 30 years of life, we only spent a few months together. Why is it so hard to forget you? Trying to forget you, I ran away from you for three years. Why don’t you fade even a little? You forgot me so easily. So why can’t I?”
Dalmi led him have his outburst because she understood that he felt wronged and rejected.
Dalmi: It wasn’t easy for me, either. I, too, had quite a difficult journey. We need to talk.
But she had to correct his misconception that she didn’t suffer. By “difficult journey,” I think she wasn’t just talking about her trek to his place. Sure, it wasn’t easy to get there. She wasn’t wearing proper shoes for a hike, but she still followed him. She wasn’t going to tell him that she also tripped and fell.
However, by “difficult journey,” I think she was talking about their three-year separation.
And that’s what she wanted to talk about with Dosan.
I’m sure that she realized that this guy had been hurt twice already because of her. Once, because she sent him away. And another time, because JP lied to him.
She wanted to clear up the air with him, but to give him explanations, right there and then, when he was obviously nursing a grievance, wasn’t the right moment.
***************
I hope this explains your question, Ella. Again, this is my theory. We’ll have to wait and see next week what really happened to make her go after Dosan.
Hi packmule3,
Amazing analysis as always.
I was so happy that “I don’t want to see you again” scene didn’t happen at the end of 14th episode. We got to see a very romantic scene with Dosan & Dalmi at that small house. His internal monologue hit my romantic notes. I loved that Dalmi tried to patch things even though she was responsible for the breakup & heartbreak.
I hope we will get the wholesome 16 ep when both leads will get a chance to spend some time as a couple without lies,unsaid words and etc.
Dosan’s love for Dalmi is so perfect, unselfish & beautiful in the context that we see how hard it is for him to let her go. I liked that we see him try & do his best to make misunderstanding become a reality & when he realizes that she’s supposedly reunited with JP, his reactions are natural & suit a person who went through hurt. He doesn’t make a jealous scene or shout at her for choosing JP: he vanishes from her life, he tries to exhaust him to forget her. I can really personally relate to the method:)
I just wanted to highlight that it is hard to watch K-dramas where 1/2nd lead seems to be totally okay with a girl not choosing him: it is not natural, it takes time to heal if you had real feelings for smb and in real life no one likes to be rejected. I appreciate that Start-up does not picture Dosan too noble in this sense because I can actually believe that he is immensely in love with Dalmi.
With JP I just can’t believe in his feelings or heartbreak: he gave her up first. He waited too long. Until 7th episode he still had a chance to confess & win her back but he didn’t do a thing. I can’t bring myself to care why. Am I supposed to find it romantic yet tragical? K-dramas know 2nd leads that really did their best but they were just unfortunate as fate was not on their side (ex. heroine lost her memory & fell in love with 1nd lead “Lady and Thief”). Here it was his choice & strategic planning. But for some reason a coward character became very popular among viewers that I read comments that NJH is shadowed in his every drama with love triangle (School 2015 reference). Nope. Nope. Nope.
@packmule3 I remember you asking where Kim SeonHo mentioned about a twist in the end? I think it’s from this interview
https://thetalkingcupboard.com/2020/11/21/kim-seon-ho-esquire-december-2020-interview/
I don’t know if it’s lost in translation but I don’t see him actually verbalizing that we should wait for a twist? He said there could be one. He didn’t say there is one? I have copied and pasted the relevant segment
Reporter – Actually, when it comes to works with motifs from the play Cyrano de Bergerac, all won’t end happily for the character who ghostwrites for someone and then falling in love with the subject. But then, we are really clueless about this drama. If we are to follow the standard way of youth drama, then Dal-mi and Do-san seem to be the end game, but Ji-pyeong surely holds considerable amount of rights when it comes to feelings.
KSH- The writer once said that she doesn’t like writing something that points towards one single direction and giving certainty towards one person. After all, that isn’t the case in the real life we live in. When I look back at this, it’s such a relief that she chose to view it like that.
Reporter- Well, I am actually investing my whole stocks in Ji-pyeong. Is it okay to continue doing so?
KSH- Umm..that’s..one thing I’m sure of is that I do like Dal-mi.
Reporter- Everyone is aware of that. Except for Han Ji-pyeong himself.
KSH- (laughs) I don’t know the ending too. I don’t even have the chance to take a good look at episode 16’s script yet.
Reporter- Ey..it’s totally possible to grab the hints from episode 15.
KSH- No, that’s not it…perhaps, there is possibility to have another surprise twist in the final episode. Ah, right. Start-Up has something like this. There are parts which have taken me by surprise. There are twists along the way. I think it’s okay to say it like this.
thank you for the analysis packmule3. <3
I am so happy reading this really, eps 14 made me a little bit exhausted but reading your explanation somehow like lifted some weight on my shoulder..
thought the same too about who is the one that JP should apologize too. It should be Dosan, not Dalmi. But I guess, maybe JP feels so insecure that he use this unacceptable way. Oh and yes I agree too, if this kind of method (scrunchie and elevator talk with dosan) happened with 2nd lead female, everyone will be maaaad..
I also agree that Dalmi's reference to difficult journey means the time when they are separated. I'm trying to believe that Dalmi felt it wasn't the right moment to explain everything to Dosan, she want to explain but later. Because I think that Dosan deserves the truth from Dalmi's feeling too.
Thank you again!! When you explained the baseball metaphor you saved my day, now with this you saved my week!!
If your theory is right (I really hope it is) then we can assume that JP failed to swing the! For Dosan looking for Dalmi in that moment (she thinks that seh does not deserve DS and she hasn’t the right to cry for him) was like a ball, and if I did not got wrong, swing to a ball make it valide as strike??
Honestly, I am still a little worried about the triangle Because, even for the writer’s standard, there are to much of confusing hints in favor of JP.
I just hope that the consistency that has characterized the all plot will continue till the end! For sure I will be offended if there is a “aha moment” of Dalmi that find out that she can not be without JP
😂 You’re welcome Lespoir48. Don’t kill me if my theory turns out wrong next week.
However, that’s the only reason I could think of that would explain why Dalmi didn’t react, that is, PROTEST that Dosan was mean when he corrected her opinion on Tarzan.
Dalmi: The Tarzan story you told me was fascinating. It was supercool.
Dosan: What’s cool about it? It was childish. It was stupid.
Dalmi: (looking at him, then repeats herself) It was cool. Just how much could it learn? The possibilities were endless. That’s why I named it Tarzan.
I interpreted her passive acceptance of Dosan’s remark as understanding. She was patient with him because she knew he was hurt. He was disparaging his former, cheesy self. She then repeated herself, saying it was cool, NOT to argue with him, but to soothe him.
And yes, that “I don’t want to see you again!” line didn’t happen at the end. Timing is everything! 😂 😅 Phew!
I actually checked the other trailers to see that the editor jumbled up the voiceovers in the previews. When I saw that she/he did, then I didn’t worry about the line. I knew it was going to be a “troll.”
Yes. I actually like Dalmi in this scene. *If my theory is correct* then she was showing forbearance. Remember? She got pretty DEFENSIVE when people didn’t take her side (e.g., scene with mom and grandma taking Injae’s side, she walked out bec feelings were hurt) so when Dosan told her that he wanted her gone, I was expecting her to scream back or to leave in a huff.
But she stood her ground and just told him that she suffered too and they needed to talk.
I liked that moment.
And I agree. I want Ep 16 WITHOUT lies so I want JP the liar out of sight in Ep 16. 😈😈 This story was really a simple love story, rather wholesome, it was just Dosan and Dalmi. The clouds and storms (metaphor for turbulence and turmoil, lol) were brought in by JP’s non-stop intrusion and interference. 🙄 Of course, his fans think it’s all cool, but it gets annoying pretty quickly when he was always butting in.
For instance, that scene when Dosan got drunk. JP just had to invite himself over and sleep there, too. How can a guy woo a girl when there’s always an unwanted company, who can’t take a hint, hanging around? 🤪🤦♀️
Yes. I like the way Dosan expressed his hurt. Twice, right? In his office. He didn’t create an angry scene. He just said his piece.
Then in the hut. He told her how hard he tried to forget her. But he didn’t get angry at her loving somebody else.
So I was right, wasn’t I? I said he would accept her “choice” (it was a lie, though) even if it meant choosing JP over him, and that he would continue to love her. That’s why he wanted out. He was hurting so he wanted to be gone. But he didn’t beg her to take him instead. 🙂 He just begged her not to keep appearing in front of him.
As for JP, *if my theory is correct,* then he finally DID something good to atone for his BAD deed.
He should give it up already. Dalmi hadn’t shown one but that she cared for him in a romantic way; he should give it a rest.
Good analysis as usual. I have been a silent reader and thoroughly enjoying your posts.
There have been a few tweets going around that for the life of me I cannot fathom as to why people would think that way.
Scene 1: Ji-Pyeong preventing Do-San from seeing Dal-Mi
People celebrated and rejoiced since Ji-Pyeong’s main intention was actually protecting Dal-Mi from being seen crying. To me, it still doesn’t make it okay to lie to Do-San about being in a relationship to Dal-Mi. There were a million other excuses to stop him from going to her office, lying about their relationship wasn’t one of them.
Scene 2: Do-San telling Dal-Mi that he doesn’t want to see her again
People called Do-San out for being unprofessional during her pitch and showing little to zero character development since he was still letting his emotions control him. I mean, God forbid that he didn’t want to see and work with his ex-girlfriend who, to him, was dating Ji-Pyeong now. How unprofessional! If I was Do-San I would have run away too and show no interest in working with my ex who broke my heart on my birthday. I mean, who really would want to in real life? But since it’s Do-San, how unprofessional!
***Spoiler from Preview Ep. 15***
Scene 3: Ji-Pyeong telling Do-San to stop feeling inferior to him and go to Dal-Mi
Really, Ji-Pyeong? Hero of all heroes and bestest boy! People were worshipping him for apparently being the catalyst in bringing Do-San and Dal-Mi together. I’m just going to leave one tweet here: “Isn’t it funny how Jipyeong was willing to help Dalmi even if she ends up with Dosan but Dosan told Dalmi he didnt’s want to see her again because he thought she was dating Jipyeong.” I don’t see how one relates to the other but ok, fine, if that makes you sleep better at night. For real though. Someone please help me understand that mindset. I’m starting to question my values and morals.
Start-Up has been about people with flaws and imperfections. No one on this show is perfect. And that is exactly why it is so relatable to someone like me who is in her 20s. The superiority complex of some people on social media and the dragging of Do-San really confuses me.
I can somewhat understand DalMi didn’t want to give DoSan explanationg about her feelings while he was nursing a grievance but I think it would have been better for her to admit her feelings for DoSan that night by the cabin. But I don’t understand why was she trying to recruit him the next morning by offering him shares? It’s been stated several times in several ways that his dream is people (her,) does she really think he’s motivated by financial success?
Hi there, Ta-Mi. Welcome to the blog.
Judging from the posts of the newcomers here, a big part of the confusion among Dosan fans stems from the distortion or “alternate reality” created JP’s fans themselves, and NOT the character JP himself. (You’re only seeing the tip of the iceberg here. I’ve blocked many posts that were just rants about JP fangirls on social media.)
Like we get that JP is a not-so-good character, but he’s on his way to being rehabbed. We can see that he’s now “kinder” in words to Dalmi and openly solicitous to Dalmi. Like, he did close the blinds, didn’t he? In Episode 6, I pointed out that he DID turn down the AC because Dalmi was fanning herself, but his thoughtful act escaped Dalmi’s notice because he was criticizing her lack of professionalism in answering the feedbacks.
But he’s a flawed character.
Re. Scene 1. JP preventing Dosan from meeting Dalmi
Between the scrunchie and the elevator lie, he hadn’t changed his tactics, and he was still looking out for himself. If he really wanted to help out Dalmi (and not himself), he could have simply told Dosan the truth.
What’s the truth? Dalmi felt humiliated because Dosan saw her in a less-than-stellar moment and Dalmi needed time to regroup by herself.
There! Was that so hard to do?
Re. Scene 2: Dosan telling Dalmi that he doesn’t want to see her again
Welll….you can listen to the advice of a lawyer (hahaha. I meant Saha, of course. She’s a lawyer, too). There’s a reason why office dating is frowned upon. It’s legitimately a complicated issue.
I say that Dosan was actually being professional when he told Dalmi right from the start that he didn’t believe a working relationship would work out for them. He didn’t waste her time nor his. There were pre-existing conditions that act like virtual land mines between their personal and professional boundaries. It would be rather naive of him to think otherwise. It was the right call to make at that time.
Re. Scene 3: JP telling Dosan to stop feeling inferior
I’ll have to wait till I see this scene. But you know, “sour grapes” is something we should associate with JP’s personality, too. In Scene 14 for instance, he congratulated Youngsan on their decision to establish a business in Seoul. Youngsan said that he’d changed, he was nicer. JP said,”You know, I only say good things to companies I’m not interested in. Why bother to check and criticize the condition of a car if I’m not going to ride it?”
That’s faulty logic actually. There’s actually a good reason that he’s been criticizing a car EVEN when he didn’t intend to ride it.
I could think of THREE reasons:
His “crab mentality”
His “sour grapes” mentality.
His ego. lol. Remember: his record from three years ago: 30 companies succeeded out of 1000. He said this, “Among the start-ups that I didn’t invest in, zero succeeded. None of them. I don’t want to lose the latter record.”
Just saying.
@Ta-Mi,
Well, I have to say that personally I do not think that working in a company even with your soulmate aka current lover is the best choice. When the business evolves, there will be a conflict of interests.Since it’s a k-drama, I’ll give it a pass. The writer wants to empathize that Dalmi wants to create the better world as her father & sister while Dosan’s dream is Dalmi & he wants to help her kind soul to achieve better world.
But it’s funny that people call Dosan unprofessional for not wanting to work with his ex. First of all, Dalmi was uncomfortable herself, she told her sister that they broke up not on best terms & it will make her uneasy to work with him again. Okay, she overcame herself & wen to him, but it was her only choice to keep CEO position. If she had another option in the face of the C-level developers she would have come to them instead.
In Dosan’s case he has a whole line of investors in front of his office, it’s unbelievable to expect him to be eager to work with Dalmi right off the bat.
I think you need to be fully at ease at your company to perform at your best. To do so it is better to avoid romantic relationships at workplace. The only way that I feel okay about it is when peiple work in different functions with no overlapping. Just in case: I didn’t mean to offend anyone.
I just meant to say that in this drama teamwork, dreams, start-ups are indeed idealized. I didn’t rejoice when in ep 14 Dalmi & Dosan started working together again but it can’t be helped according to the writer’s style
LikesKdramas,
I’ll answer you on the blog. 🙂
I finally found some time to come back to this blog today and I’m reminded of why I used to start my mornings with TKEM analyses 😊 I’ve missed the mental stimulation from reading everyone’s views and am looking forward to hopefully catching up from episode 1 posts during winter break!
As always, really appreciate your interpretations as they add meaning to the show for me. I wonder if the writer-nims actually go as far as your depths of analysis 🧐 @packmule3
Thank you @packmule for giving a good theory about why Dalmi would be so persistent. I was thinking it was a combination of her wanting to not give up on trying to soothe DoSan’s heart, and her not wanting to let her sister and company down. I hadn’t considered that Jipyeong may have admitted the depth of his lie to her. I like your theory much better.
I could see DoSan’s breath when he spoke at the hut so it must’ve been cold. Will we learn if they really spent the whole night out on the bench?
If he carried her to her car, did he then put his bike in the back or did he ride it home? I.e., 90% or 100%? 😉 She looked pretty comfortable with him carrying her. I noticed that she adjusted her grip a bit closer to a hug.
👍 I like my theory too because it would be a redemption for JP. He needs to undo the damage he’s done. Apologies don’t cut it since it’s the final week.
That’s why I didn’t “settle” for the customary reasons like InJae or fate/faith. I was looking for a link to JP.
I don’t know where she parked her car but she looked pretty disheveled and completely exhausted.
Carrying her on his back should be worth bonus points. It meant he shouldered her burden. Despite everything, he still carried her.
Yes. I saw that too. She was hugging him.
The actor seems to be a laidback sort of person. I saw their YouTube clip together when they played the claw machine. He figured out that the pink balls (or was it blue?) contained the prizes so he told Suzy to aim for the pink ones.
I’ll have to look at that YouTube. Thank you.😎
Off topic: I knew Outlander as a book, not a drama but ask agdr03. I believe she mentioned it on TKEM or somewhere. I don’t think she’s watching Start-up so wouldn’t see your query.
Yes, it’s the same Outlander series. My bookclub ladies mentioned the romance books (and I’m sure they said Outlander, not Highlander). I’m not into them either, especially when they involve “heaving bosoms,” “bulging manhood” and anything “quivering.” 😂😂
Thanks, nrllee. Thanks for looking for this link:
“https://thetalkingcupboard.com/2020/11/21/kim-seon-ho-esquire-december-2020-interview/”
my comments:
1. KSH said this, “The writer once said that she doesn’t like writing something that points towards one single direction and giving certainty towards one person.”
— yes, I could see that. In “Dream High,” and “Start-Up,” she started with the second male lead’s story first, established his connection with the heroine, then she brought in the real hero last.
2. The reporter said, “Well, I am actually investing my whole stocks in Ji-pyeong. Is it okay to continue doing so?” and KSH quibbled, “Umm..that’s..one thing I’m sure of is that I do like Dal-mi.”
— he couldn’t outright say that JP wasn’t going to get the girl (bec he’d disappoint the interview/fangirls) so he fell back on the “safe” answer which is his character likes Dalmi.
— lol. That means the Injae match-up is not on?? Good.
3. KSH said, “I don’t know the ending too.”
— That’s possible. The actors don’t shoot the scenes sequentially, so he might now know where and how the dialogue would impact the story.
Take for instance a heroic/good prince is filming a scene with his tyrant father. His one line is, “Noooo! Don’t die!!”
If the director puts that scene in the beginning of the movie, then that line signifies the beginning of his problems. The good prince will take over his tyrant king who ruled over the kingdom with an iron fist (otherwise, he wouldn’t be a tyrant). He should expect uprising, rebellions, coup d’etat and so on.
If the director puts that scene in the middle of the movie, then that line can indicate that there’s a bigger problem, say a more evil person than his tyrant father about to seize the throne, and time’s running out for him.
If the director puts that scene at the end of the movie, then that line can demonstrate a son’s anguish because he failed to reform his own tyrant father.
So same thing here. It’s possible that KSH really didn’t know how the ending would turn out to be. (Besides, if you ask me, KSH isn’t the sharpest tool in the shed. Have you seen him on 2D1N? lol.)
4. Reporter chided him, “Ey..it’s totally possible to grab the hints from episode 15.” KSH replied, “No, that’s not it…perhaps, there is possibility to have another surprise twist in the final episode. Ah, right. Start-Up has something like this. There are parts which have taken me by surprise. There are twists along the way. I think it’s okay to say it like this.”
— I think he sees the scene like a jigsaw puzzle. He’s surprised to see how the parts come together at the end because he personally didn’t see it coming.
5. There’s another passage that I like from the interview:
Report: So, the production team and the staff played the biggest factor then.
KSH: Yes. There’s this faith I had for them. The faith that surely felt like it would be a good thing. As expected, it turned to be so beautiful. The directing is detailed and heart-fluttering, plus each and every line is like a painting. “Do-san, I’m still your voyage without a map.” Lines like this made me wonder, ’Wow, where does the writer quoted this from?’ ‘Or is it another creation of hers?’ Things like this made me excited for no reason. The director also plays the role of tuning the filming in order to deliver what is written on the script smoothly. There are just so many things to be experienced this time around.
— I must agree with this one. As I write some of the lines from the dialogues, I do end up thinking that the writer had nice metaphors and analogies. lol.
Thanks for looking up the link, nrllee.
I think the male lead is rather popular. My SIL in CT liked the show so I sent her an Outlander gif to add something spicy to her birthday greeting today; there were many to choose from. Not sure if she’ll mention it to my brother. 😇
@packmule3
*giving you the biggest virtual hug*
i saw your post yesterday but rl work got in the way and i don’t want to rush reading it.
your theory didn’t come across my mind at all, i’ve lost faith in jp because even after the time jump he’s just the same even he himself didn’t think that he’s changed but yes i’m all for his redemption arc if any.
i got so worked up when DalMi showed up in that mountain just like DoSan lol.. because by the end of ep 14 i feel like i went on that journey with DoSan and it’s extremely exhausting:
– DoSan didn’t want to go to SF not with the way it all went down
He ultimately went because of YongSan urging and in his own words running away from DalMi,
– After one look at DalMi video he decided to take the journey back why? i think because of that one word TARZAN
– He went to SandBox to look for DalMi probably to ask her why she called the project Tarzan got foiled by jp and decided to retreat, taking off that wish card in a way to close that chapter called SeoDalMi
– Got triggered by the ransomware and went with the avengers to help DalMi, this is the first time I saw him getting excited again and in DoSan words he spent the last 3 years half a world away trying to forget DalMi but it took 3 seconds with her to render it useless
– The elevator incident, he got hit again with jp lies but when DalMi rejected his call she pretty much unknowingly deliver the last blow
– Suddenly out of nowhere DalMi start calling him again and to found out that what she wants is his superpower programming skill lol.. so he point blank told her to stop confusing him and that he doesn’t want to see her again
Now up to this point I also understand why DalMi did what she did.
Then the mountain incident happened and I was like girl what are you doing to DoSan? and thanks to you I got some context to keep me going until next week where I hope we got more revelation on this front but just like DoSan I surrender, to his love for DalMi and to the believe that there will be a pay off in the finale.
After reading a lot of tweets on the imperfect mother’s relationship theory and the comment @Ella I had a “aha moment”.
The key point of the mother theory is the last move of Dosan. Three years ago he made the worst possible move, he didn’t hear Dalmi and he was obsessed by the idea to stay with her in SK.
Even if in the drama going abroad seems more like changing planet, I think that he should have discussed with her how to keep their relation and not freaking out.
Now, instead, he did it. He heard her and hopefully this gives us the 100%. Notice that he asked Dalmi to invest in the company and he convinced her without much difficulty (no pride between lovers) and then she hugged him.
I hope that the misunderstanding of the relationship between DALMI&JP will be solved at the beginning of the episode 15 (cross fingers XD)
@Illusyn love, love, love your take on Mom’s 30-50-70-100 theory! i like how this writer often reuses her own dialogues/analogies to make things full circle.
if we go back to ep12, in DS room, the mom actually told DS “I’LL LEAVE THE REST UP TO YOU” after telling him that he has a 70% chance if DM shows up extra pretty on his birthday. and the mom has actually also predicted that DS still has a long way to go back then =p back then and now, the point is the same, it’s exactly like you said.. DS has to do his part too.
the DS in 2016 was so adamant about staying with DM that he failed to notice DM’s efforts to celebrate his birthday that day. he didn’t do his 30%.
so like the mom said in the epilogue of ep14, “if he comes back alone, everything’s over” (in ep12, obviously we were shown that DS and DM left separately and DS walked alone, meaning it was indeed over back then).
her next line from the epilogue is very telling: “if they come back together, it’s 100% certain.” and by the end of ep14, we see that they did come back together, both from the hike and as business partners for Tarzan 🙂
Kicking myself because I only discovered your blog today. I had so much fun reading your insight and analysis because I thought I’m the weird one for liking Dosan’s character.
@packmule3 I just want to point out another thing which I noticed in the aftermath of the elevator scene when Jipyeong apologised to Dalmi and told her she can still catch up to him/Dosan.
That completely burned whatever good thoughts I used to have about Jipyeong because I couldn’t believe he left the responsibility of fixing the mess he created to Dalmi.
What’s your take on this?
Will answer you on the blog, moonriver272. Just give me time please. 🙂
I’m sorry, please don’t worry about it. I’m so glad to have found your blog and I truly enjoy reading your analysis and perspectives, as well as those from your friends here.
@packmule3
I’m circling back to this post since we don’t get a direct answer on why DalMi went up to chase after DoSan in the hut.
I have another theory after watching the last 2 episodes and what sparks me here is actually what DalMi said back in the hut:
DoSan: “I thought we were done.” “Why did you come all the way here?”
DalMi: “You may be done but I’m not.” “We need to talk.”
During the second office breakup “I don’t want to see you again.” the reason DalMi came looking for SamSan gang was because of Injae push. Recruit them or else. DoSan’s honest speech I think was the last thing she’s expected out of that meeting and he figuratively shut the door in her face.
And that became her trigger, the hopelessness of the situation. During the three years separation both parties namely DoSan and DalMi was holding on to hope that one day they will find their way back to each other (this was affirmed by DoSan declaration in Ep15 epilogue)
She lost her bearing at the office and she trying to fly out of the office lol but then I think once she got a grip of herself and no not with jp help, she weigh in the situation.
So what a girl like DalMi do? She hates regrets the most and she’s proven to be a fighter so she had to fight as not to lose DoSan, so in my new theory the answer is actually spelled out by DalMi “You maybe done but I’m not.” Tarzan prospectus was her heart on her sleeve.
Another thing is in Ep15 she told Injae that her priority is not to lose her whole team for the second time meaning *cough* DoSan *cough*
What do you think?
Hi
I loved your elevator talk!!!! You are an actual intellectual.
I definitely agree with all of your opinions. Quite sad how some people have double standards and just choose to hate on Dosan just because their guy won’t be dating or marrying dalmi.
Also, let the haters hate that’s the only thing they know.
Thank you for your blog! Truly appreciate it!
Ahhh! It was a really good scene.
Ok, JP was annoying throughout the drama, in addition to being unable to act despite 3 years of margin.
But there! There is THE scene where he becomes a total Jerk!!! Of a really incredible nerve!
So cheerful and funny.
We can note with that a usual cliché of dramas: strangely the leads are amazingly naive and always believe the lies of the bad ones.
With that, a bit of bad faith on the part of the scriptwriter: just at that moment, Dal Mi turns her phone off. This way, the misunderstanding can be perpetuated. The kind of trick used in hundreds of dramas, and often at the same stage of the story. Not very original, but in any case, the elevator scene was priceless! ^^