@Hafunohane asks:
i personally have known it’s gonna be dodal endgame super early on, not bcoz of the posters leads etc (an inexperienced kdrama viewer here) but bcoz of that scene with the forrest gump-like cherry blossom petal trip from DM to DS.
just curious: which scene/ episode was your Dodal’s AHA moment?
Please share your answers. Thanks.
Gifs from @chanikang’s tumbr
I agree with @Hafunohane, for me it was the the floating cherry blossom petal scene which started its trip from Dalmi’s head to land on Dosan’s head.
For me, it’s an indication of a romantic fate between the two right from the beginning. The petal went through ups and downs, hesitating in its turns and shifts but eventually made its way to where it is destined to be.
End of Episode 1. Dosan acted on his own and showed up (all cleaned up and wearing a nice suit) to support Dalmi at the networking event. JP’s timing has never been right.
To paraphrase Jung Hwan from Reply 1988, “timing is everything.”
Wow I’m so excited to see all answers from the posters here 😊 nice thread as always! I’ve been discussed with my sister since the beginning, with the depth story on JP in pilot episode what will the writer do to make it all make sense for DoDal. And my aha moment is the same with @snow flower. When Dosan showed up to Dalmi because of his own decision (not because of JP promises or whatevs) .. this scene is one of my most memorable too. I mean, i didn’t see any scene where the teenage HJP is going to little Dalmi right?… after all the letters that have been exchanged between them. But Dosan, is different. I know maybe this imagination of mine is too far, but since I was a kid whenever I listened the song called “I knew I loved you before I met you” i’ve been thinking.. is it possible? And I kinda ask my self in that scene, did he already love the idea-of-Dalmi even before he meet her.
The cherry blossom petal scene gave me joy as it reminded me of The King in Love. I got to know packmule and friends and this blog because of this drama. In TKIL, there’s the scene of San (Im Yoona) balancing on the beams of the bridge and Won (Im Siwan) walked beside her just in case she would fall from the beam, and Rin walking behind them. While they’re doing this, there’s a cherry blossom petal floating and passing through from Rin, then went through Won, and finally to San, with San ending up blowing the petal to float away somewhere. This foreshadowing didn’t bode well, tho we know the feelings of the main leads are for each other.
As for the AHA! moment, I think there is none. I would like to say it’s the arrival of Dosan in the networking party and when they had the Tarzan conversation. But after many dramas and movies, I’ve come to realize that things wouldn’t work out even if you are fated or destined for each other if you don’t work for the relationship to happen and prosper. So I’d say it’s the memories Dosan and Dalmi created that sealed the deal for me. No amount of letters could break the affection that they built for each other. The foundation of their feelings is strong, with a bit of crack (the letters) but it is still standing.
The point when Dosan turned to walk back to Dalmi to ask her about the music box and give her his business card. That was the point I felt Dosan decided to open the door to know her more and let her know him more. If they hadn’t gotten lost, sat down to chat and eat, it could have been the end of the two. Though fate will keep pulling them together again and again. So I loved how the cherry blossom petal connected both together, in hindsight.
I love to see everyone’s answers here!
For me, the cherry blossom petal scene is a hint that dosan and dalmi is endgame, however their action confirms my suspicion that this is a sure thing! For Dosan, it’s how he came to the networking party to help Dalmi. For Dalmi, it’s how she is hesitant when she found out Dosan is not the one who wrote the letter.
In ep 6 she said at the beginning that she will choose the Dosan from the letter. If she still thinks the same way, she would drop Dosan and confront Jipyeong about it and be more interested with him. But i think at that point she realized Jipyeong was also not taking the letters at heart (because grandma also write it with him). Hence, she follows her feeling with Dosan because he is the real human being that has been through the ups and downs with her in sandbox, supporting her all the way. In a way, Dosan gave her the comfort that she used to long for in the childhood letters.
At this point i think it is honestly too late for them to make Jipyeong-Dalmi endgame but let’s see!!! 🤣🤣
I didn’t watch SU but from the casting news, I can guess it. NJH is in a main leading role position though this may change as I have seen how second male lead took over the main lead position when the drama was aired i.e. Queen of Reversal & How To Meet a Perfect Neighbour. Nevertheless, with regard to the SU story, the point when I am affirmed of Dosan-Dalmi = endgame was when I read that JP was made the writer of those letters with a tsundere attitude against another guy who is a low profile, humble, much kinder and understanding. JP can’t win over that. He has been established into that losing position since the very beginning. To make things worse, he maintain that negative attitude throughout half of the series. To me, he is not as sincere when writing to Dalmi. Because if he did, he will be understanding of her, Dalmi, the person and her dreams. He will remember all her writings, and not taking them for granted. Once he sees her, he will be her Daddy Long Leg figure, her shadow who is guiding her to her road to success. If this was the plot, then I would say JP has a good fighting chance against Dosan, i.e. a fight between the good guys. But as it stands now, the only thing remains is a sympathy from Dalmi to JP, and perhaps a bit of guilt. Her heart is set for Dosan. JP has lost his chance, for good. A guy can be a tsundere and still get the girl but there must be a turning point for the guy, to change for the better and start considering what is important for the girl, to understand her and listen to her. I also have to consider not everyone grew up having Dosan/Dalmi’s personality and/or mindset. Our surroundings one way or the other will influence us to be who we are. But whether we are willing to listen to others and improve ourselves, that is really up to us. In the case of JP, he refuses to listen and he is stuck where he is now.
The last episode (piggyback ride) is my final AHA moment. All the rest like the petal, baseball meet up, networking party, kiss, and bean bag scenes led to this. If the writer decides to do a 180 deg and make this a #JiDal endgame then the whole series is a joke!
I’m not sure if this is included in AHA moments or not.
But DoDal scenes that gave me strong impressions would be:
– Drunken Dalmi asked Dosan to come to her once again in his suit like their first meeting in networking party. She said it would help her regain her confidence back. Knowing fully that Dalmi was drunk and not in her best state and even though he could easily dismiss the request as drunk talk, he still tried his best to fulfill it only to make Dalmi feel better. I still remembered watching how he run fast as he could to borrow suit from two-Sans and somehow it just got me teary-eyed, lol. He truly loved the girl and thought of her well-being.
– When Dalmi first hearing Dosan’s voice after three years during Injae company’s malware case. Tears just rolled down her cheeks. She indeed loved him and through the scene i felt like even though she initiated their messy break up, it was also painful to her as it was to Dosan.
For me, I think these 3 scenes convince me the most that dodal is the endgame:
1. The flower petal: I agree with what other posters had already said about this scene. For me, it represents the destiny(?) like no matter how far it wanders it’ll eventually land on its destined place.
2. When dosan turned around and gave dalmi his business card. Dosan already made a choice to come to the party and then he made a choice that he wanted to know her better eventho jp strictly asked him to stop. He knew that something wonderful was going to happen if he did that.
3. When dalmi indirectly kissed dosan in the old samsan tech office. Dalmi was confused about who’s in her heart. She asked her self and when she saw dosan sleeping beside her she knew that he was the one, thus she gave him the indirect kiss
I would think most people going into the drama would be conditioned to a ML-FL endgame as this is mostly the selling point of the drama. But yes, it would be interesting to find the AHA moments if we went in blind to watch this drama.
From the happenings and interactions in the drama alone excluding symbolistic petals and whatnots, I will pick Dosan’s AHA moment as the time he decided to trust Dalmi to be the CEO with majority shares and to tell Dalmi the truth, as that would be the moment he decided to go for it as clearing the lie would right the foundation for a real relationship (a trust later proven right when Dalmi made him the majority shareholder instead).
That is his “putting his money where his mouth is” moment, so to speak. Prior to that he knew it was only a dream that could turn into a bug when the truth comes out. He wants to remove the bug and move forward.
I think Dalmi’s AHA moment will be the elevator scene in the just released preview for Ep. 15 where she will realise that what prompted Dosan to kiss her on the rooftop was when she told Dosan that they set sail without a map and develop Noongil – she finds out that Dosan knew of that letter and connected with her message so that her kiss with Dosan was not a product of a lie but that Dosan was so elated to know they were on the same page when she mentioned it that he kissed her.
After all, it was that message that made Dosan throw caution with the wind and embark on a wandering journey to get lost – but only if it’s with Dalmi, of(f?) course.
As to the writing of JP’s character, I sometimes picture PHR rubbing her hands with glee as I tend to think she set the trap to write an exteriorly perfect guy with a not so perfect interior to prove most girls fall for the wrong guy – the attractive bad boy type they want to mother forgiving all his flaws for all the suffering he’s been through. I’ve seen many girls irl take bad treatment from this type of guys and in fact they are happy to suffer such treatment as they understand where their boy is coming from. The icing on the cake is she audaciously labelled him “Good Boy”.
Also, seeing JP and IJ’s lifestyle, why can they not choose to go solo. Some people can also be happy without having a partner. I think JP is somewhat aware he’s not an ideal partner and having lived independently for so long, being with someone suddenly involved with all of your stuff can be a nuisance.
I came across the twitter account of a lady who identifies with In Jae as she has an engineering background working in the IT field and she says being CEO in a competitive field is so mentally and emotionally draining with people out to sabotage you at any moment that she has to be constantly on her toes. She is so stressed she chooses not to attend family gatherings so as not to let her family see her state and worry about her. Seems IJ is patterned after such a character.
She also makes interesting perspectives from an industry person on the technical side of Start Ups and writes simply and entertainingly, delving into the workings of an accelerator like Sandbox as it relates to Samsan Tech as well hidden social commentaries in the drama on the young people’s difficulties in Korea right now especially the plight of young women as Dalmi who was supposed to represent those who are classed as underprivileged – no college degree, no connections.
There is also information on the real life versions of In Jae’s AI Surveillance technology, Dalmi’s self driving cars and Dad’s baedal.com food delivery app. Highlighting that the impact of IJ’s surveillance project’s impact is more worrisome on privacy issues than manpower reduction, as in Korea the system is run by the Government.
Qualities of Venture Capitalists which explains some of JP’s traits, and interesting trivia from her : JP’s name is an anagram of Pyeonji = Letters.
Some mathematical computations on what each SST shareholder gets from the 3 billion won 2STO payout, and she provides references if you want to go deeper into the technical side.
Think she only opened the account for this drama. Lots of other interesting and entertaining stuff like her post on pros and cons of dating programmers.
Her post on the pictures of programmers was just posted in soompi (Start Up page 49 in enzek’s 2nd post the 5th twitter account he posts in hidden post).
Mild warning: she is Team JP but not the toxic kind – she calls herself a halmoni after all and has Dalmi’s halmoni (a glamorous Kim Hae Sook pic) as her profile pic.
I think most DoDal shippers would agree that “Aha!” is the flying petal from DM to DS symbolizing the fate connection. It’s the same for me too. It’s actually a beautiful image summary of the Start-Up.
To contribute, I re-watched that part to see if there are interesting details I missed the first time. And I realized now that it has been one wonderful foreshadowing for the whole drama.
Breakdown:
“Thank you for being there for me that spring.” Then, Dalmi put the letter to the bird house and turned her back on it. We saw the petal from her hair flew and the voiceover, “Thank you for the letters.”
= PHR really could’ve intended the “thank you” lines as an ending for JiDal’s childhood penpal relationship, and DM moving on (her back turned against the letter)
The scene switched to the city and we saw the petal going to Jipyeong, but it did not land to him, instead changed its course.
= DM, while thankful to JP, still chose not to be with JP. Even after finding out that the letter-writer was actually JP, she still did not choose him.
JP reconnected with grandma. And it is the character’s goal after all. Him growing and finding love from someone who he considers a family.
DM Voiceover:
“Back then, I believed that you existed. Now, I want to believe that you exist, Dosan…”
= First, let me say this: if this is just a simple narration, then it’s just redundant. Why say “back then” and “now” referring to the same thing? But we’re in episode 14 now, and one of the things I’ve appreciated on this show is the depth of the script. So yeah, this part was not just a narration, but a foreshadowing.
“Back then, I believed that you existed.”
The shot here is focused on JP. JP was the “Dosan” DM wished truly existed. Back then = JP was DM’s past.
The petal returns to the frame and flew with the voiceover, “Now, I want to believe that you exist, Dosan. I miss you.” *plus Red Velvet’s Future played on the background*
= “I miss you” here was from the typical translation, but “보고싶다” can be directly translated as “I want to see (you)”. She wants to see the existing DS. Existing Dosan = Real Dosan.
Moving on, the petal continued to fly to SamSan Tech’s office, and we saw it pass by Chulsan and Yongsan—2 characters we saw early from the Sandbox scene (their slow reveal is quite amazing and highlights the fate connection). Then, it moved to the “Math Olympiad Dosan” (the origin) before it landed on Dosan’s head. I also have to emphasize that the petal just got in to Samsan Tech’s office when Red Velvet was singing the exact line, “You are my future, future…” Btw, this OST is also a giveaway, part of the chorus says, “I want to get through these hardships And hold your HAND” (Remember DM’s prayer for a companion on the journey? and HAND, duh?)
The music stopped and we saw Dosan finishing the code for their facial recognition tech. It might be irrelevant but a part of the code that they decided to include in the show says, “prime.” Dosan is a prime role. hahaha. He hit enter, then, we were switched to their tech’s point of view. The tech’s sensor focused on Dosan. He shouted victoriously and the 2 guys joined him. The 2Sans were chanting “Nam Dosan” when DM’s voiceover returned, “So I think it’s time for me to find you, Nam Dosan.” The way she said “Nam Dosan” there instead of the usual “Dosan-ah” kind of shows that the creative team meant DM longing for the real DS.
===
Oh! there’s also a little play on the shots right before the petal scene. When DM was writing her “last letter” to her penpal DS, the shot moved from the letter to the music box.
Letter = JP
music box = DS
@JM: Amazing breakdown of that simple but powerful scene. 💯
Permission to screencap and post this on twitter please? Let me know your handle if you don’t mind so I can tag you.
I intend to enlighten a few lost souls why Dosan is Dalmi’s endgame. LOL!
To me, it was when Dalmi found Dosan on her own & Dosan met her with the “follow your dream” ball on his hands.
There was a scene on Episode 2 when they were just looking at each other (E2, 36:24) as if time stopped, while everything around them was moving.
JP just intervened. However, it became clear to me that with or without him, that scene showed Dalmi & Dosan were destined to meet one another from the start. Dalmi will always find Dosan & Dosan will always follow his dream – which is her ❤️
Diane, don’t try to “enlighten” or fight them anymore. Leave them be. 🙂
@packmule3 Alright! I’ll control myself and won’t open twitter until the last episode. LOL!
I ignored the petal scene because I thought Jipyeong had a strong chance, Cyrano-style. @miracle23 said it best above when she said the guy can be Tsundere and still get the girl, but he has to show enough positive change to redeem himself. It was Jipyeong’s petty actions in the hair scrunchie scene that changed how I saw his potential. They say ‘All’s fair in love and war,’ but for me that was a damnable exercise.
@Diane, yeah, it’s better not to engage anymore. I only posted that here too and not on my profiles. But I’ll probably clean it and post it once the ocean becomes calm after the last episode.
@JM 👍🏻👍🏻👏👏 I see that now! Thanks for connecting all the dots, it really is something we can understand on hindsight. That was an awesome breakdown! Now it really makes so much sense and I also appreciate how the writer put so much thought into these details.
Piggyback scene is the most heart fluttering moment for me 💕
I don’t have particular ‘aha’ moment because going into the drama my pre-notion was Joo-hyuk and Suzy are the leads.
And as the story progresses I don’t see any love triangle set up on who’s the husband ala reply series or hospital playlist since i was actually play a guessing game on the latter, it’s the typical one sided love from the SL in k-drama, so when crazy toxic shipper war explosion happened i was quite baffled, any avid kdrama watchers should know better.
and i love writer-nim for flipping the table and give the SL childhood connection because that trope is overuse.
i have my favourites of DoSan DalMi moments, almost all of them actually lol but if i have to choose one then
DalMi peculiar answer to her prayer:
“And please lead me to find a companion for the journey.”
here is the keyword for me “companion”
I actually forgot that cherry blossom petal scene. But there are many instances when Do San overcame his shyness that stood out for me.
His having a haircut/makeover for the networking event. He didn’t even know this girl but empathized with her through the letters so he wanted to look sharp.
Him saying “It’s beautiful” not about the fireworks but about her beauty.
His realization of sailing without a map meaning and so turned around to ask Dal Mi about the music box.
Running after the bus and it was rewarded with the holding hands scene 🙂
Choosing Dal Mi as CEO and defending her against Chul-San’s worry over her not finishing college.
Smashing that nameplate of Mr. Won.
Telling her the truth about grandma’s vision. I think this was a game changer coz he was honest despite what grandma said. He wanted to be honest in the first place.
Telling Ji Pyeong not to join in their date going to the beach.
Saying sorry to Dal Mi in the bus station.
Acknowledging Dal MI’s efforts for Sam San Tech.
Helping Dal Mi with the ransomware project.
Do San was just the kind of guy that when he gets a crush on a girl and decides to go all-in, he does everything to make her happy, protects her and loves her always.
I’ve seen this type of love in real life so Do San is an ideal guy for me.
P.S.
I actually think Kim Seon Ho is cute but those smiles don’t make me side with Ji Pyeong.
Though I think Nam Joo Hyuk is a better actor. Very impressed with his acting on the bus station apology scene.
Dalmi’s AHA moment : when she woke up next to Dosan and stared at him and then she smiled.. before that, she was confused. She wasn’t sure who she really loved, so her friend said, keep on observing the two guys and one day, you will have an AHA moment.. That was her AHA moment. From there, I knew it was Dosan who she really loves. Then I watched episode one again (while the last 2 episodes were not out yet) and noticed the petal hint in episode 1.. And I was like.. It’s Dodal 100%. They were meant for each other 😊
I agree with Ella, the AHA moment for DoDal endgame was the “companion” : how Dalmi was okay knowing Dosan deceived her and how Dosan can recognize the difference between the choices of recruiting Dalmi or being recruited by Injae. The second time rewatching the series, I then picked up the flower petal scene and the music box references as explained beautifully by packmule3. Love the detailed insights into cinematography – which I missed the first time around.