I’m reserving my energy. 🙂
Instead of writing a long commentary, I’ll repost the observations of some of our regulars and add my thoughts. I’ll let them express why we’re unhappy with Episode 7. Although to all intents and purposes, we were proven correct when we said the Winter Gardeners and IkSongers were prematurely rejoicing over the prospects of a marriage proposal and a camping trip, we still think this Episode 7 leaves much to be desired.
Let’s begin with @Sasa13’s post. She said:
I agree with everyone’s point here about the weird writing of s2. This ep is a filler that basically confirmed all that we already suspected:
-iksong is not going anywhere
-WG is physical and aren’t open with each other (what the hell was that message Jang said? It’s as if JW didn’t save her number lol). I don’t think anyone is buying his proposal. They aren’t at that stage yet.
-the patients stories do not even carry this ep. Everything was too rushed for us to feel anything.
– Isn’t it odd they placed Jang’s “lucky charm scene” before songhwa gave a bad news? I find Jang’s way of conveying the good news is like songhwa’s sad news. I thought the family said she exudes positive energy in a sarcastic wayWhat i find intriguing is how Songhwa said what JW said to IJ in the first season. Kids do not lie. I hope this means something, like songhwa pov soon?
They need to clean up the stories nicely soon and stop giving bigger ships “fan service scenes” that actually goes nowhere. If the writers intended for WG and Iksong to be endgame, they would not only be sharing the scenes together but have meaningful conversations and get to know each other better. That’s why i am still paddling on FG, because they’re the only dynamics that grew deeper in s2 (other than gomgom and junwan jaehak lol)
Yes, as it stands now, the script shows that Songhwa does NOT like IkJun as a husband/lover. She likes him as a twin brother/friend
However, now that we know how fickle this writer and director duo can be, who knows if they’ll turn Songhwa into a ditzy 41-year-old woman who doesn’t know her own mind.
/sarcasm
IJ: Cho Jung Hyun.
Songhwa: Right, Cho Jung Hyun.
IJ: It was my nickname back in school.
Songhwa: You practiced “Sad Sea” with your guitar all through our freshman year. Why did you want to play a piano song with the guitar?
This is interesting. It tells me that she noticed his little quirks about him before but she was never curious enough to ask him about them. This was probably the time when IJ found out that SH confessed to her and got rejected because she liked somebody else. He ditched the ring after that.
IJ: You have such a good memory. How do you remember that? Shall we listen to “Sad Sea”? I brought my Bluetooth speaker.
Songhwa: No.
IJ: Why not?
Songhwa: It’s bad manners to play music on a campground.
Huh? What is she talking about? Is this a special rule in that area? We always bring our guitar and sing songs around the campfire. And there was nobody around them who’ll be disturbed by their music-playing.
Seems to me that Songhwa told a white lie.
She lied because she didn’t want to have a sentimental moment with him. lol. If you’re a realistic like me, then this is proof that she friend-zoned him. But who knows? ShinLee/Iksongers could twist this around and say that she just didn’t know her own mind.
IJ: Then, what do we do?
Songhwa: We’ll listen to it another time. And it’s time.
IJ: Time for what?
Songhwa: Sleep. I’m about to fall asleep.
IJ: Hey, it’s still early. Why are you already sleepy? My gosh. It’s past 1 am.
Songhwa: Cho JungHyun-ssi. Goodnight.
IJ: Alright.
Songhwa: (stands up and enters tent)
IJ: Good night, Chae Songhwa-ssi.
So this was a troll.
And mental note to myself:
the neuralizer moment occurred here.
More notes about the camping:
1. Cho Jung Hung sang “Sad Sea.” I found an MV that was recently uploaded on Youtube. I don’t think we have somebody here who can translate Portuguese to English.
2. The theme of lying was introduced by IJ.
IJ: (speaking of Uju) He skipped kindergarten today because of a stomachache. But he’s fine now. He’s singing and dancing. Hold on. Was it a lie?
Songhwa: Kids don’t lie. Sick or not, they always tell it like it is.
IJ: I lied a lot when I was his age. I really hope he only got my good traits.
3. IJ really had NO plans to go camping with Uju. He could have pushed off preparing for his conference and gone camping with Uju that weekend had he wanted to. But he really wasn’t into camping.
Songhwa: What are you doing this weekend?
IJ: No plans, but I’m studying for a conference.
Songhwa: Too bad, forget it then.
IJ: What is it?
Songhwa: I’m going camping tomorrow and was wondering if you wanted to come. My favorite campsite is always fully booked. But I checked their website earlier just in case and saw that they had a cancelation. I totally lucked out. I booked it right away.
And then, IJ immediately called up Uju.
I don’t think Uju was expecting Songhwa to come along. He thought it was just going to be him and his dad.
IJ: We’re going camping tomorrow, Uju.
Uju: (excitedly talking) Are you serious, Dad? Are we really going camping? Hold on, the cicadas haven’t started molting yet.
IJ: There was an impatient cicada who couldn’t wait. I got a text from a cicada just now.
Uju: But we have no campfire tools or camping dishes. Let alone a tent. What should we do.
IJ: Right, we have nothing.
Songhwa: (nudging him) I have everything.
IJ: Don’t worry, Uju. My friend has everything. She’s a camping expert. She has everything. What do you want to do the most when we go camping?
Songhwa: (listening in) What did he say?
IJ: A campfire. Sit by the fire and relax.
Songhwa: (laughing) He sure is your son.
IJ: I know.
The following day, Uju wasn’t in the mood for camping. According to IJ, he and Mone had a fight.
Now, I suspect that Uju was telling a “white lie.” He might — or might not have a fight — with Mone, but the camping trip was something he’d been looking forward to for over a year. My experience with children at this age is that they’re easily distracted and amused.
If Songhwa hadn’t been there, Uju would have found an activity to do with his dad and distracted from his blue funk. But since Songhwa was there, he didn’t get the opportunity to talk to his dad in private about his “heartbreak” and the time he needed bond with him.
As it was, IJ left Uju to brood him by himself because he had Songhwa with him to keep company, Uju had nobody to talk to.
Two’s company, three’s a crowd.
Do you get what I mean?
Uju could have been sad about Mone but camping with his dad was a once-in-a-lifetime event for him. His dad’s attention on him would have been enough to distract him. But since IJ was otherwise preoccupied with Songhwa, Uju ended up being by himself again.
The camping trip was a dud for both father and son.
4. I found this camping trip disturbing because IJ wasn’t shown interacting with his own child.
Think about this for a minute. IJ stopped to chat with everybody in the hospital.
Director Shin painstakingly filmed IJ flitting from one person to another in the hospital. Director Shin made sure we saw IJ as this happy-go-lucky, well-loved, and benevolent character. He had a fun remark to say to everyone.
To his hair stylist: What? Your son is getting married already? He graduated from college this year….Send me the wedding invitation.
To the optometrist: This is a new model. It looks very light….I love the shape. Aren’t there different colors for the bridge?
To the custodian: What? Have you fully recovered from your disc surgery? Why are you already back at work?…No, don’t say bye. Take good care of yourself.
To the gardener: Ahjussi….Have you eaten?…What are you planting now?
To the EMS helicopter pilot: We should have dinner together soon. My gosh, it’s been too long….My goodness. I’ll call you soon. Let’s have dinner together.
But to his own child?
Nada.
During the camping trip, the director filmed not a single word exchanged between father and son. In fact, IJ told Songhwa to leave Uju alone.
See that contrast?
The difference in how IJ pays attention to acquaintances vs family and friends wasn’t accidental. That was Director’s point in that long stroll from Songhwa’s office to the cafeteria.
It also dawned upon me that the way IJ treated Uju during the camping trip wasn’t much different from the way he treated Songhwa on their walk to the cafeteria. He ignored them both when somebody new and exciting came within his sight.
IJ was very rude to leave Songhwa behind like that to chase after people in “his” circle group. Just like it was insensitive (not to mention, heartless) of him to leave his Uju alone when the trip was supposedly a father-and-son time.
So yeahhhhhhh… Ikjun+Songhwa is just #relationshipgoals.
5. The theme of lying was carried on by Jang. While Songhwa was lying about music in the campground, Jang talked about lying to her coworkers.
Jang: But you know I can’t keep lying to everyone. All the professors keep grilling me, “How’s your boyfriend? What does he do? When are you guys getting married?” I’m not a good liar.
She’d been lying to her colleagues for a year now, and she hadn’t been caught yet. I’d say she’s a darn pretty good liar.
Jang: Maybe…I should just tell them we broke up. That’d be easier. They’ll at least stop grilling me, you know?
JW: Well… I don’t know how I feel about that. I mean that’s also lying.
Jang: It’s a white lie.
Then, the following day, she again bragged that she wasn’t the kind to lie.
Jang: What’s that white stuff under your eyes? It looks like a pile of snow.
Minha: I accentuated my under-eye fat with makeup to look younger.
Jang: Unni, you already look so young. You don’t look like you’re in your mid-thirties.
Minha: Really?
Jang: You know that I can’t lie.
Minha: Right, I sure do. You always tell the truth.
Ha! We’ll discover in the end that she hadn’t been telling the whole truth to JW all along. She was good at lying, too.
As for the text that Jang sent JW, @nrllee kindly jotted it down for us because Netflix conveniently skipped Jang’s “term of endearment” for JW. hahaha. I like @nrllee’s alternative text better.
“gyosunim (professor), this is GU. I have to go to gwangju all of a sudden. I will tell you the detailed story later. It’s hard to talk on the phone right now… I will tell you everything later. I am really sorry.”
Why not “Hey babe. Something came up. My mom is sick and I have to be by her side. Can’t talk now. Will tell you everything later.” 🙄
What gf still calls her bf Professor? Especially since he actually expressed that he didn’t like her calling him that? Why would she have to say, “this is GU”? What? Wouldn’t he have her as GU on his phone? Or some term of endearment? Why would she need to even say that? As if he didn’t have her contact on his phone or something so she had to tell him who it was? 🙄. Their whole relationship makes zero sense. How can they be even thinking about a wedding? Unless it’s a marriage of convenience. 🙄. What’s in it for her? For him she satisfies all his lust (repressed priest blah blah blah…).
To me, it was critical to include the “gyosunim” in the translation because JW professed his dislike for that term THREE episodes ago.
Moreover, how could he possibly think of sharing his life with this woman when he only had a rudimentary knowledge of her?
🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸🌸
Okay, let me look for the next poster to highlight.
🤭🤭🤭 Thank you packmule3. I am giggling with the sarcasm. On point!
@packmule3, Could Jang be cal.kng him professor because she was with her hometown boyfriend who was loo,looking, over her text. Could she be two timing PaBo. This could be farfetched up it almost seems like she’s sending a work text.
Well his own fault for not checking beforehand isn’t it? Marrying a complete stranger. He’s in for RUDE AWAKENINGS if that’s the case. 🙄 There are skeletons in her closet. Stuff she doesn’t trust him enough to share. That seems to be where their story is heading. But her voicing the break up is a foreshadowing. Self fulfilling prophecy. Question is when. WG anthem my foot PaBo. More like a Requiem. RIP WG.
Completely agree!
Just a very random note: I think making too much noise during camping is sometimes prohibited in certain places?? I went up a tropical mountain one time (just one time and never again LOL) with a camping site somewhere near the peak, and during the pre-hike briefing, we were strictly advised not to make too much noise out of respect for the environment / culture of those living there.
Anyhoo, regardless. SHwa was still very much disinterested in IJ’s “Sad Sea” and preferred to sleep over further bonding with him.
On “Professor”, I noticed that, too. I also noticed that they still use honorifics with each other (please correct me if I’m wrong). It may be a cultural thing. In “Touch Your Heart”, the female lead still called the male lead (who was then already her boyfriend) the equivalent of “Attorney”, and the male lead still called her “Ms. [full name].” In one episode, though, the female lead called it out and requested the male lead if they could be more casual to each other. The very reserved and traditional male lead was uptight about it at first, but at the end of the episode, he called her by “First Name-ah” (IIRC) because it made her happy.
Anyway, it’s not the case here with WG. It cannot even be said that the formal “Professor” is a term of endearment (the same as the “Sir” equivalent in My Roommate is a Gumiho.) This is just… blah. Just another manifestation that Jang is still being reserved around JWon and keeping him at a distance — consistent with her not opening up to him about the more personal aspects of her life.
@pm3 “yeah okay” gif for Jang’s statement made me laugh like anything.
Regarding “sad sea” song ,I’m thinking that Shwa also had a heartbreak during freshman year and Ikjun playing this song all the time during that period made it unforgettable for her as well.
I was also wondering if the fight with Mone was a white lie. When Uju called, he was very excited about the camping trip. Was the video of Uju dancing the same day that IJ called him? If it is, Uju did not go to kindergarten that day. He did not meet up with Mone. But of course, they may have talked since technology is within reach even for kids nowadays. Regardless though, I just wished IJ took the effort to at least spend time with Uju. If he really fought with Mone, he can still at least lift his spirits up.
@pandamilktea Regarding honorifics, I also noticed that when a couple just started dating, they usually still use honorifics with each other. However, when they get closer, they would usually just agree on calling each other by name or term of endearment and talk casually. They may still address each other formally at work but when there’s only the two of them (such as in personal text messages), they go back to being casual. If JW was planning on proposing, they should at least be in that level of closeness right?
We had also seen JW request Jang not to call him professor and he expressed how he does not like it. But well, even after a year, we can see no progress on Jang’s part. I’m not too sure, correct me if I’m wrong, but I think JW calls Jang by her name? If so, I don’t get why she can’t do the same thing for JW. It seems to me like she keeps putting boundaries between them.
Well at least PaBo has “GU” as her contact name. Jang on the other hand, 🙄
https://i.ibb.co/WtXpBfj/39-F3-B8-D1-4436-4-ADF-A98-B-5802-CCC10928.jpg
I feel sad for uju 🥲🥲🥲🥲
I agree with you pm3 about how lonely shwa and lonely uju.
@felixthecat and @packmule3, I felt bad for Uju, too. It made me think of IJ in a different light; so self-centred. I wondered if Song-hwa felt the same? It was a huge opportunity for them to bond better and Song-hwa had gifted it to them. I’m probably projecting, but if I had invited a man friend and his child camping and the man ignored his child while concentrating on me, I would be both rather offended and turned-off. 😖😑🙅♀️
As to Song-hwa’s presence, I think without her there would have been no camping at all. With her, IJ was distracted from his son. I think it *could* have worked, even with Song-hwa there, if IJ had re-directed his attention.
@pm3 : Me (laughing so hard at the yeah-okay.GIF) 😀
You are right, director filmed that camping with uju looking gloomy meant something, in the same position looking gloomy/bored in almost every angles. There was part when Uju also shown/framed exactly in the middle of IJ and SHwa (right after Shwa mention Sirloin Steak) OMO poor uju.
@nrllee, I don’t think it’s an issue that he’s saved in her phone as Professor Ahn Jeong-won. He’ll likely have to also call her on work related matters, and it’d be a dead giveaway they were dating if other colleagues saw his name saved as an endearment. (My boyfriend’s also saved as his proper name in my contacts, and my parents saved each other under their first names also – no wifey, or hubby or such. Maybe we’re weird.)
I do agree that Jeong-won and Gyul-wool don’t know each other very well, and his desire to propose seemed script directed than organic. I also don’t think they have a sexual relationship aside from kissing and perhaps a little more. Not sure if he can go from being a devout priest wannabe to Mr Premarital Sex just like that.
Anyway, still keeping my fingers crossed for a coherent story. Looking forward to how Seok-hyung will handle his mum should he and Min-ha finally get together.
@pm3 Found a MV of Sad Sea with Eng/Jap/Spanish subtitles 🙂
https://youtu.be/dYTEfMPFzNg
Thinking back, we have been shown all sorts of problematic narratives since the beginning of S2. They keep piling up. Now look at Uju. How can no one in the fandom not see how bad his father has been neglecting him??? Didn’t they find issue with this? Is this ok in Korea? The boy is gloomy and his father takes the most simpleton solution i.e. let him be. That is lazy parenting. Dude, you have been letting him be since ages. The kid has no mom to do the j1ob for you. Aigoo… @Fern, if I were in Shwa’s shoes, I would naturally entertain the boy instead of the father. I am the host. I know the boy has been wanting to go camping. The least I could do is make him happy and enjoy it. I could care less about the social butterfly father. He can entertain himself with his games.
Hmm so shwa x ikjun shared stories about their moms. Rosa talks to Shwa about her illness. PG talks to Shwa about Rosa’s condition. Maybe maggot will opt to talk to Ikjun on her mom instead.
@Fern,
If this Writer Lee wanted to portray “love in the 40s” especially a divorced dad with a kid, then this is NOT it.
I would want to facilitate family time, instead of couple time. And I would feel awkward if the kid was sitting morosely by himself in front of the fire for hours on end.
But then it’s also the intent of the director. He filmed that whole “power walk” through the hospital to highlight IJ’s charisma and popularity. Then, he filmed IJ not talking even once to his son in this trip-of-a-lifetime. The commentary on IJ’s priorities is plain to see.
This father-son unrequited love has been a constant theme for IJ. I pointed it out last season, in one of the songs for the band practice. There was a montage shown. Capt Ahn had an unrequited love for Songhwa. Minha has an unrequited love for SH. Uju said he baked three cookies for his dad, then he said he ate TWO, and he was giving ONE to Mone. But he actually left the cookies for his Dad with a glass of milk and a note.
I said Uju was Ikjun’s real love story. He had an unrequited love for his father. 🙃
@L probably a cultural thing then. And like you said it makes sense to save it like that for work. I save hubby’s name as “My Beloved”. Ji JinHee saves his wife’s name as “Mine”. So sexy. 😂. To each his own. Who else can I call My Beloved? I guess it depends on your relationship and how comfortable you are to show the other person to the world and if the other person is happy for you to do that. My son has some pet name for his gf on his phone. But Jang’s text was definitely weird. Not like anyone else but him will read it.
@L,
Wait. We’re talking about a BUDDHIST director Shin and writer Lee. I’ve already said multiple times that they really don’t know, respect, nor care about what’s norm for Catholics, especially ex-wannabe-be-priest. JW’s Catholicity is just a plot device here. 🤪
That said, judging from Jang’s odd reaction when he offered her his open palm, and from Jang’s odd peck when she knocked on his window, they haven’t had premarital sex. I heard that some WGers were writing lurid tales of a shotgun wedding, but I think Jang has a mental block when it comes to the nitty-gritty sex.
Note when he offered to stay with her during her night duties. That was an innocent question but she froze up. She suspected that he wanted something more when nobody’s around.
Next, the kissing outside her apartment building. This kissing scene and the Christmas Day kiss were both JW’s move. He was the one who “deepened” the kiss. She was reluctant participant. (Lol. Don’t make me do a kiss analysis.)
Then the crab kiss. I know he was allergic to crab but I thought that was a convenient excuse for her to push him away though.
I think she isn’t ready for sex with him. This is a “Madonna-vs-whore” mental block. She holds him in such a high esteem (e.g., he’s such a saint, he’s so perfect) that she can’t imagine doing the “down and dirty” with him. 😂
Thanks, @Viva. How did you find it?!!
@Fern Shwa created momentum for Uju and his dad, but Ikjun just focus on Shwa. Shwa worried about Uju, she want to play with him because he look sad but ikjun said uju need time alone. Poor ujuu 😫😫
Maybe ikjun doesn’t want shwa focus on uju beside him?
😑😑😑
If shwa didn’t cut him to stop sing “Sad Sea”. I bet he will sing that song with his hidden feeling like karaoke scene after NS dinner. Fortunately, Shwa cut it.
@felix, shwa knows that sad song and she ain’t letting ikjun have his way with the awkwardness again. That is unrequited love song. I saw from the video viva shared, the album was unrequited love 😅.
Sigh, however way I think of this, how in hell are they even gonna make iksong a solid pair in the next 5 episodes if they keep showing this kind of Shwa whenever she is with him. She keeps him at arms length as well. There is an invisible line she ain’t willing to cross. If they want to build iksong, it should have started before ep. 7 but what we got is nothing despite them being together. No progress. By the end of it ikjun is still left alone mending his broken heart because she already said not to go into that territory with her. It is over a year after her rejection. And he is still hoping in silence. Ikjun and GU should realise they fit each other better than their current target. They both care for one another and listen to each other and they actually talk about everything.
Anyway, seeing how ikjun left his son alone to deal with his issue, I wonder if this is how he dealt with his ex-wife when she was in a similar situation? Instead of talking it out, he let her be. Like GU he backed out when things get tough. Hence, their marriage grew apart as she found comfort in another man who is more understanding.
@pm3,the whole U-ju IJ relationship of son and father is heartbreaking. It is even worse because IJ plays the good divorced daddy at the hospital when we are shown what a neglectful parent he actually is. His neglect would also merit s call to social services, even though he has competent child care. One of the loose ends I would have liked to see I’d how child custy was arranged in the divorce. We saw Unu:d m.and them she was gone and we saw I NJ: see jealousy of her boyfriend an do th Dr it dinner with.Uju where the boyfriend appeared to be the father,. It .either mom nor ng knew about Uku:d food allergy. No mention of mom this entire season. The I LL tate impression here is that U-ju was abandoned. Y both his parents, a horrible childhood fear
I also think iJ did not give Songhwa a chance to interact with U-ju
He wanted all her attention and was actually competing with his son. This is further proof that IK is really no bad at relationships but hides it well by showing superficial interest, all being self serving. Songhwa knows this and had relegated him to the friend/twin zone. Their shippers are unable or unwilling to see this dynamic.
I have to start singing the Sad Sea every thursday….ShinLee…
@felixthecat – IJ is a selfish psychotic person – he cannot share the limelight on anyone else but him. He thinks he is great in every aspect of life. So, his wife left him for another man. Can you imagine the amount of stress one would feel living with such an imbecile idiot. He is taking his son camping and all he can do is hang out with SHwa. She provided a great avenue for a father son bonding and he does not even know how to be a dad. IJ singing sad Sea during freshman year and getting over his heartbreak, would have the worldly knowledge on how to handle a breakup and Uju having a breakup with Mone would have been a great conversation to be had. But oh no.
A normal dad who did not know how to camp, would have made the effort to shop for everything with their child and even if they went camping together, would have put in enough effort to bond with out actually calling it a bonding. The best conversations I ever had with my children were in the car and shopping or in the walks that we would take. We know he is pretty caring when he took care of IS, but why not do the same for his son.
Oh, I forgot him showing off about himself. the walk to the cafeteria, running off to chat with everyone on the way ignoring the person next to him ( a friend who he wants to be lover ) that he is such a great catch. It was so off putting that his behavior is that of a child who craves for attention.
@packmule3 – I also think that JWon and Jang haven’t done the deed yet. I was so surprised at her reaction during the meal, when JWon held his hand and she is shaking his hand? And this being BF=GF for a year? But her running her mouth off about breaking up just to not be nagged by her colleagues, and putting thoughts of marriage in Jwon mind is very typical of women (especially asian) who wants something to be done without asking to be done. I don’t know how to explain this. I have seen lot of women doing this especially if they want their spouses to get them something without saying that I would like you to buy me this…. I think the methodology is the same. She wanted to get married (namesake) because her brother got married, or someone is asking if she is going to get married. And our doofus Jwon is doing everything SHwa asked him to do – fine a (nice – to be debated)girl and get married and settle down. Thank you GOD for intervening.
@nrllee – I did not care about how she saved his name on her phone, but for the fact that she was calling his personal cell phone and can’t leave a voice message on a day when he planned something important. Did we not see her dressing up in the taxi. Also, that she is calling him professor – as they are mentor / mentee . I understand that it might have been difficult to change – I have seen other dramas where they have done that, but the fact that she did not even talk about her family situation was alarming. She was able to do that when her brother got married. Isn’t her mom in the hospital more dire than the brother’s marriage to discuss with her BF who she wants to break up with, since she has to answer her colleagues about it.
With the changes that ShinLee did to their montage, I also think that it might be WG as the end game. Don’t like it. But I am only here for Shwa. I hope her old BF (not the twotimer)comes back and sweeps her off her feet.
@OAL – I liked your post about SHWa.
@angelwingssf
“I have to start singing the sad sea every thursday”
😂😂😂
Sigh… HP2 is really such a sad case. What a waste of production.
Hi everyone! First time commenting but long time lurker.
These last two episodes were really grueling! I think ShinLee was faced at the end of season 1 with a lot of support for two couples that are not endgame..so how to deal with their popularity? They have been shoving down our faces (in a manner almost exagerated) how wrong the interactions between the 2 couples are (Iksong couple only laugh and talk about food & WG is super awkward) but this backfired…the shippers don’t seem to notice that (I don’t know if they are blind or just in denial?!?!?!) and the other audience – that wants the interactions between the 5 friends and meaningful hospital cases – is sick of mismatched couples and lack of cohesion. They have digged a hole and it will be difficult to climb out of it… I think all of this could be solved if they had shown more interaction between FG and flashbacks but I think they want to save everything (the revelation) for the end :/
I can also sense their intentions in the scenes but they don´t seem natural and organic like season 1. For example, I think the scene in the ER with the doctor is to give some comfort and closure to Yun-bok. She was clearly sad and feeling down about her attitude towards the brother when her and Jang were by the elevator. Jang notices it but doesn’t do or say anything. So when Yun-bok sees the behaviour of the pediatric doctor she regains confidence in herself (she still can be a good doctor in the future despite of her behaviour before). This shows once again how bad of a mentor Jang is. We already now that but I think that they keep reenforcing it (and in a more obvious and annoying manner) because there is still people out there who love her.
The first 4 episodes I though that the interaction between the friends was missing but I gave it a pass, because maybe that meant that the glue – Song-hwa – was missing so they didn’t gather as much. But now I’m not sure because Song-hwa is back and they still don’t really talk much to each other or comfort each other…i’m really confused.
I also think that there was a serious conversation between Song-hwa and JW that was not shown to us. They were friendly and interacted before the time skip (DDL and the apartment), then she came back and he gave her flowers. That was the last meaningful interaction between the two…they have not been together since then, the flowers are no longer in her office and they did not sit together (for the first time) in the basement. Ikjun also said to Song-hwa: “You seem to get angry easily these days”. Maybe she called him out on not thinking/working toward his dreams anymore?
I also think that maybe JWan will be the one who calls out JW on his stupid behaviour of lately. In the last episode the mother/patient asked his opinion and he was not afraid of giving the true but hurtful answer. That’s JWan…he will not meddle in people affairs but if you ask him he will be direct. Maybe Pabo asks him…”why didn´t I noticed my mother was like this?” and he will say the things that all of us have been thinking.
Not sure. Maybe this is my wishful thinking??
Regarding the song “Sad sea”…the videoclip is very interesting. If we think about it, “Aloha” is JWan song and there are clues in its videoclip related to that (the coffee he shared with Iksung, his eye medical problem, the rings). “Sad sea” could be FG or Song-hwa song..there is the photography (an interest she and JW share), polaroid photos (JW had them near Min-yeong bed), a table with coffee, the sea that they both love, the female cutting her hair (in the flashbacks Song-hwa always has long hair – we know they associate the cutting of the hair with a new beggining because we were shown that with Iksung). Maybe she will sing this song in her birthday?
Sorry for my bad english. Let’s hope that the next episode will be a better one.
(I’m sending this again because I had a error..if it is duplicated don´t publish it)
Welcome to the blog, @Kattie R.
You’ve made good points. I’ll answer you later. I’m tending my flower garden now. The real one. 🙂 I hope to have pix later.
@packmule3 Thank you so much! Looking forward for your thoughts and pix 😀
Another thing I forgot to mention was Song-hwa comment “Kids don´t lie. They always tell it like it is” was probably a way of pointing out that we should be looking to JW patients since they are the “hidden messengers” of the season.
I don´t know if this was already discussed in protected threads but:
Episode 2 – Seung-won is the cry baby that needs to remove 7 stitches but doesn´t want to. We never see him remove the stitches, only the conversation with the mother in front of the painted wall with the rainbow <3 He symbolizes JW that doesn´t want to forget God or Song-hwa (?)
Episode 3 – Ha-yul who talks about strawberry (Song-hwa), orange (GU) and forgets the other flavour. She is Rosa (has the hairpin with the flower that looks like the flower that Rosa is watering in her next scene) – there is talk about vitamins, JW asks her if she is upset with him. I think Rosa will be ok in the end because the kid remembers the last flavor before she goes. I wonder if she will tell Song-hwa to keep her disease a secret because the kid doesn´t want her mother to tell JW that she has fever. If she does, I think Song-hwa will tell JW nevertheless.
Episode 4 – Ba-da is Song-hwa. It's been talked about in here. The hairpin, the pinky promise, the playing with the cars.
Episode 7 – Han-jun is the kid with the overbearing mother. He is SH. In the end, with help of JW (represents Min-Ha) he speaks for himself and faces his mother. It's like the symbolism of the umbilical cord been cut by Min-Ha and SH in the surgeries that they show us so much…Min-Ha will help SH cut ties with his mother.
Thanks for putting this post together, @pm3. I agree with a lot of comments that have been made here already. Just wanted to share some insights on the dating culture in Asia – yes, it is pretty common still for lovers to be formal with each other, especially if they have significant age (or, sometimes, status) difference. While mainstream TV is gradually veering away from these tropes, the values still remain old-fashioned when these elements drive the romance plots (throwback to the 19th century Jane and Mr. Rochester, anyone?). JGU has the added pressure of keeping her relationship a secret at work. So, yes, them still using honourifics with each other is not weird in Asian culture, although it sure is seeing an abating pattern in modern-day storytelling. What I condemn about JGU is her duplicity in keeping her love life under wraps while kissing her boyfriend in the mouth in the broad daylight, outside the busy hospital. Does she think people are blind or emotionally stunted like herself to not understand love language? She really is something else. It’s like she has never been taught etiquettes as a child.
As for UJu, I feel terrible for him. All that the poor lad has wanted since the past year has been to go camping with his dad. And how does his dad reward his patience? What impression will this leave on the child? I hope he shares his grievances with Ik-Sun at least, lest he goes mad. IJ is only a good surgeon. He has proved to be a bad friend, a bad brother, a bad husband, and a bad father. He may be a genius academically, but he is completely dense with emotions. IIRC, JWan had said that IJ’s wife had pursued him, which tells me that IJ may either subconsciously belong somewhere in the aromantic spectrum or be bipolar or something. We have discussed the lacking five becoming washed down versions of themselves in S2, and IJ is no exception here, because I sure don’t remember him being this ignorant in S1, or at least had some redeemable qualities. Now it seems like he’s just all over the place with no real depth of character. JJS’s charm helps to conceal a lot of IJ’s deficiencies to the fanbase, I guess. But whatever way you see it, IJ is simply not the same IJ from S1 (except for the phenomenal vocals).
The whole camping sequence was so long and unflattering, I’d be pissed if that were my ship sharing screen time. One may say that theirs is a longggg slow-burn, but the thing is that the spark in that relationship was only due to IJ constantly throwing cupid arrows at SHwa and now even that is gone, so their scenes are a complete waste of space. Either give them both new love interests or give us more lacking five/SH/JWan/flashback content instead.
Welcome @Kattie R 😊 and thank you for these new insights of yours. It makes me remember what nrllee asked before of why Jwan only deals with child patients this time. Apart of me was thinking of that Jwan now being possessed by PG hence he has many child patients. But now that you raised a new theory, it could very well be the more plausible one. The children are the answer. Same goes with Uju. Thanks again for sharing this. Great catch! 😉
Hey @Kattie R, Glad you’re not lurking and
You are commenting
I just want to say how much I enjoyed your comments about the children. Such a great connection. Thank you.
@Miracle23 Thank you! Yes, Uju response is very telling and important too. I think @packmule3 is right…he probably was upset because he expected alone time with his father. That camping scene was very sad indeed…and tiresome at the same time.
JWan also had many baby cases in S1…I think to highlight that he really wants a family and to be a father. I suspect that his family is poor but his father worked really hard to get him to college. The only 2 JWan cases that I remember in season 1 that did not involve children were the one with the poor farmer whose son needed a valve and asked for the most expensive one (JWan seemed touched) and the family with the wedding…the father had a son and a daughter (we know he has a sister). There is probably a special connection between him and his father…he is really upset that he forgot his birthday and the case that made him sob alone in the bathroom was one in which the patients reminded of him and his father. He is also very suspicious of rich people and despite making rich SH pay for his drinks and food, he is very generous to the students and residents.
It’s like Ikjun whose cases are all about the bonding between the children and the parent…he needs to go back to his universe!! Despite the clunky way in which the case was presented I found the case of the security guard that didn’t know it’s mother interesting…just one more case to try to awake Ikjun for the reality of his son. Sadly, he is still oblivious. I wonder what will be his wake up call?
The red flower hairpin is an intentional prop. This scene was initially filmed with a different child actress. Hers did not make the final cut. In her photos, she also wore this red flower hairpin while waiting to shoot. If this hairpin means nothing, they can always use a different one, no? So yeah, the red flower hairpin is intentional. What it means is subject to interpretation. 😊
@Old American Lady Thank you so much for the support.
I only got into HP during the break between seasons and when I finished it I was kinda confused with Song-hwa reactions so I went online to seek others opinions. I don´t usually follow kdramas so I wanted to know if I was reading it wrong..to me she didn´t seem interested in Ikjun but maybe her reservation was “normal” according to kdrama culture? That was when I found this blog and I have been lurking around since then.
I didn´t comment before because english is not my language and I make mistakes. However, I was so depressed after last episode and coming to this blog was so helpful that I decided to say something 😀
Thanks everyone for all your old comments and interactions.
Hi @dashman1010, I don”t think there is anything psychologically wrong with IJ, he’s just self centered. On his relationship with U-ju it:s all about the kid loving the Dad. Lady season we saw it at the sandwich shop and sadly with the milk and cookies. IJ seemed to look for reflected glory from U-ju
Same goes for his angry at his Ex’s boyfriend at the restaurant dinner
It was not douch his ordering good that was not good because of U-Ju’s allergies bit because the waiter mistook BF to be his father. Soodt times U-ju acts like IJ’s parent when the poor kid needs douch ft his Dad. IJ can provide the kid with custodial care. It fails at emotional support for his kid, who has already lost his Mom.
I hate those scenes with U-ju because U-ju’s pain is so raw
I just want to date at IJ to wake up and be the Dad that U-ju needs.
@packmule3, I agree that this is a poor representation of Love in the 40s featuring a divorced man with children. If it’s the director’s intent to show Ik-jun in a poor light this week, then he really succeeded with me. I guess I was putting myself in Song-hwa’s shoes. I would have been very turned off by his attitude towards his son, rather than attracted to him with his attentions and chatter. I can see that his heart is hurt because of Song-hwa, but the way to a good woman’s heart isn’t via neglecting one’s own child.
To the posters above who thought that Ik-jun may not have wanted Uju to get Song-hwa’s attention, I agree. IJ is more generous with strangers than with his own progeny. @Mircle23, yes, this may be the way he was with his wife as well. Good point. Emotionally stunted, perhaps? Could this be why he feels more at home in a city surrounded by strangers than in a small town where you must interact repeatedly with the community?
@kattie your English is 👍🏼. Have a 🍪
The kid comparisons are great particularly the Rosa flavor-very insightful.
Cut the cord!! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 I use that phrase a lot when referring people who are too dependent and I can’t believe I didn’t catch on to that symbolism because you’re right, they show that shot often. I think Minha and the mother will end up with a very fun-to-watch fairly healthy relationship . Too bad we probably won’t get to see much of it since apparently we’re to spend some time with jang’s mother and learn her sob story.
@miracle23 I didn´t know about the prop. That is very promising 🙂
@birdie007 Thank you 😀 Yes, cut the cord! I am really excited to watch the relationship between Minha, SH and his mother. Despite the lack of screentime, I think their relation has been evolving in a rather satisfactory rythm..having coffee and lunch 2 times just to be with her shows a great development in SH attitude (a person who would run from social interaction). I think he will only say yes to her when she finishes her residency (separate professional and personal life).
I’m hoping they don’t show Jang mother. Since it was in episode 8 season 1, that Jang messed up with her patient and she found comfort with Ikjun (JW ran to his patient), I’m expecting that she will also rely on Ikjun this time and will lie to JW. Please let this be the definitive ending of WG relationship!! I’m done with the manipulations of Jang (that marriage talk was a perfect example). Like @angelwingssf said, JW Pabo is doing what SHwa told him…find a girl and settle down. I also think he is influenced by the marriage of his parents…his mother has no problems saying in episode 1 that she married for convenience, that it was a loveless marriage but she was still happy in her own way (maybe that is what he thinks, he is kinda of conforming and doing what is expected). My question is “why doesn´t he think he has a shot with Shwa??”.
@KattieR you’re the breath of fresh air that we need! Thanks for de-lurking and adding your insights. Love the insights about the children 👍🥰
This is the second instalment of the “WISE LIVING” series, of which Prison Playbook was the first. S2 has thus far been about bad choices? The only consistently wise person so far has been SHwa? And JWan (to some extent, although he still has lapses – who asks to be allowed to live with a newly married couple? 🤷🏻♀️).
I am still holding out that FG will be end game because that’s the WISE choice for PaBo. A woman who is all about helping you fulfil your dreams? Risking her health in the process? She’s the keeper. Not the demanding gf 🙄.
And for those lurkers from other ships who think that Prison Playbook is all about happy endings for couples, look again. Looney (who made a cameo in HP2 as the Violist’s brother) didn’t have a happy ending. And his plot twist happened right at the end (and it caused a huge uproar). He was free to return to his bf after his incarceration for drug use (yes he was the gay figure in the series) – ironically the person playing his bf is the same actor who plays ChiHong in HP – but what does he do? Looney arranges a meeting with his drug supplier again and shoots up. 😢. So no happy ending for Looney (and his significant other). It’s not a given that “established” promoted couples like WG and IkSong will get their happy ending.
I think Dove couple will make up again. Just like WG will break up. Which would lead to fan girls holding out hope that just like Dove couple made up, WG will do the same. Already they are saying that the failed proposal is just following the usual KDrama formula of angst and trouble in the OTP which “has to happen” so as to “bring them closer” again. I am wondering if this angst will push Jang into the arms of the other man waiting in the wings for her (IJ). 😂. And when we do get FG at the end. Perhaps S3 will be something enraged WG and IkSong shippers would demand because they want FG to break up in S3 and WG and IkSong to sail once more. 😂. Who knows?
Also there are other diseases that mimic dementia/Alzheimer’s. Diseases that can be “cured”. Vitamin B12 deficiency is one. And if often happens with older people who don’t eat enough meat. I remember PaBo scolding his mom for eating just vegetables in S1? And she pointed to the vitamins? Does she take them though? She had been giving them to her plants? 😂. Like the daisies?
,,@Kattie R, I am hoping Jang gets minimal screen time in the next episode. She’s a piggy and has hogged the screen enough.Time for others to get a chance like our Bear couple and the all important revelation about Rosa’s health and Songhwa:s role in helping PaBo through the crisis.
Getting back to the WG couple, doesn’t it seem like Jang’s statement about God and defeating God by getting PaBo,means that both mothers’ dire health issues signify Divine Intervention. Does it mean that WG loses because God must win.I hope so. PaBo must return to being close to Andrea by way of being his DLL self. Only Songhwa can get him there. Perhaps that is the route Shin Lee must take to get to an FG conclusion and hoping they don’t get to mess with God
E
@nrllee Oh, thank you very much! 🥰 I agree with everything you said…FG is the wise decision! The Dove couple I expect it to be end game. I’m not really a fan of Iksun but I’m sick of seeing JWan sad (he is my favourite).
Love the idea of the vitamins…it makes total sense!! He scolded her in episode 1.5 and in this episode Rosa talked with Mr. Ju about vitamins. And the kid representing Rosa was taking vitamins for her jaundice.
@Old american lady Yes, I’m hoping that as well. Thank you for the divine intervention.
I just want to see them all together…the preview gave me some hope. They mentioned Gongnyong Ridge which I’ve been dying to hear about since Dr Bong mentioned it on episode 7 from season 1…”The first love. The old love”
@Kattie R, welcome and thank you for your refreshing comments! 🙂 (I personally am slowly turning into a pessimistic Eeyore thinking about the dismal writing of this Episode 7 😠😂, and thank you for your comment on the children — a dose of sunshine. 😊
On JWon not thinking why he doesn’t have a shot with SHwa, my baseless theory is that he and SHwa sort of had an almost/unsaid understanding/tension in the past.
– S1, there was that awkward scene where Ju asks the lacking 5 if they had anything romantic happened among them before, and SHwa was looking at JWon (or vice versa? I forget). SHwa also said that she liked someone else. (Could not be IJ, no? Otherwise she wouldn’t have shot down his current hypothetical proposal.)
– the awkward tension between JWon and SHwa in the “let’s get married” scene
– the awkward non-response of JWon when Rosa asked him during the Jeju trip talk– “No. Why doesn’t SHwa like my son?”
– SHwa’s comment this season “No, I made a lot of mistakes in the past”, which to me (though I may be biased) seemed to hold more meaning beyond mistakes as an intern
My theory is JWon and SHwa both knew they felt something for each other before, but they didn’t do anything about it. I think an opportunity presented itself, but they chickened out and didn’t grab it. Maybe because JWon knew SHwa was already in relationship in med school that time? And SHwa thought JWon wanted to be a priest someday?
Anyway, it’s theory that is not based on anything concrete. 🙂 The writers can still spin anything any other way they wish at this point, so who knows? 🤷♀️
Thank you for listing these down, @pandamilktea.
If you or somebody (@Bulmagoku?) can add the episodes, I’d make a separate thread for this.
There’s also something that JW said in Ep 1 this season that struck me as having an undercurrent of regret — same thing as Songhwa’s comment “No, I made a lot of mistakes in the past.” (S2,Ep6)
While counseling Jang on the mother who kept returning to the ward, he said, “No one keeps visiting forever. She, too, will stop eventually. Because we all have to forget and move on. So just until then, give her a warm welcome whenever you see her.” (S2,Ep1)
Where did that “we all have to forget and move on” pensive tone come from? 🤔 I thought that he was speaking from experience, and that he was saying it in retrospect.
@pandamilktea Thank you for the support 🥰
Yes, it’s been difficult not to be pessimistic. I have some baseless theories too but something tells me that JWon is not totally aware of SHwa interest in him.
I think that there were 2 moments: 1. freshman year of medicine (20s) during which JW chickened out (why? I have some ideas, could be because priesthood) so SHwa decided to move forward and she began the long relationship with the older student | 2. last year residency (30s) during which SHwa chickened out (i also think that comment you mentioned about mistakes was important); it was the time she had the case of the twins’ mother that impacted her so much and that motivated her to be an even better doctor (and the offer of the shoes).
Yes, they still can spin anything 😛 I hope they don’t invent too much.
I’m still mad about the wrong translation of the “let’s get married” 😛
@packmule3 The funeral talk with Director Ju is S01E02; The “let´s get married” is S01E10 and the Rosa talk about Jeju and flowers is S01E08. 😉
Yup @KattieR . We got all excited in Ep8 when Rosa seemed to be the FG matchmaker. She was even arranging white flowers (a wedding?) in a jar (from SHwa) for PaBo (btw that’s what I have called him (JeongWon) this season so far because he’s been acting like a fool). She mentioned how if they got together she would join the Lord in peace? Foreshadowing much? So here we have potentially Rosa’s condition which forces the 2 together (in support for each other).
What would be perfect in the end would be a wedding in Jeju. A garden wedding. 😂🌸🪴🌈❤️
Something is really off with this wg relationship. Compare them to bidulgi. The words of love have been spoken unlimitedly in their conversation as their grew deeper. Have we heard this coming from WG pair? The most they did is kiss and him looking at her like attending to his little patients. The kiss is like to shut out any attempts for talks of love. This is very much different than the bidulgi couple. I agree since ep 12 S1 it seems GU is PG’s last resort. She came to him to offer herself as a solution for his alternate life after priesthood. That double sighs, that delay to talk to her about him staying, that hand on her head like a priest giving blessing. Who the heck did that???… did he even plan to tell her actually? From nov to end of dec. That looks like he never did want to tell her anything.
Whatever ShinLee have in mind, I hope for the best ending for Shwa. She deserves it.
@packmule3, here’s the list of the scenes with their corresponding episodes 🙂
– the scene where Ju asks the lacking 5 if anything romantic happened among them before, and SHwa was looking at JWon (or vice versa?). SHWa also said that she liked someone else, which couldn’t have been IJ, otherwise she wouldn’t have shot down his present hypothetical proposal — S1, E2
– the awkward pause during the “let’s get married” scene — S1, E10
— the non-response of JWon when Rosa asked him during the Jeju talk, “No. Why doesn’t SHwa like my son?” — S1, E8
— SHWa’s comment “No. I made a lot of mistakes in the past”, which seemed to hold more meaning beyond mistakes as an intern. — S2, E6
🙂
Thanks, @pandamilktea.
@miracle23 I said so in the Alfresco thread. The dream theme is still running consistently in the WG dynamic. Their anthem has Childhood dreams in it. And his latest addendum also talks about GU and he creating the dream of another life. It’s escapism. Both are trying to escape so they’ve created this love dreamscape to escape. It’s unrealistic. PaBo I think is running away from “love” (SHwa) because as he stated on his bed, he’s “given up on love”. So he’s settling for a fling with Jang. Jang has skeletons in her closet (to be revealed) but she’s using the relationship as an escape too? In the preview it sounds like Jang saying, “I like it because it helps me escape reality”. So they’ve created this make believe cartoonish world of love (like Oliver and Claire) as a form of escapism. But reality came knocking at the end of Ep7. God intervened. A reality check. It’s not something that will survive the hard knocks of life. So it’s inevitable that they will break up.
Howdy!
Can I just say that I love HPS1 OST as I. The whole album than this season. I’ve been listening to it since this season started and I prefer the songs in season 1.
@agdr03, i agree with you. I prefer ost of S1 too. S2 is just… not engaging enough. The only i like is the fast track I Like You from Shwa’s I like you episode. Even the latest ost feels so weird because we never did see any depth being explored in wg and suddenly this song? He coming to him with all his dreams in her hands? Since when did she involve in DLL and the shelter house. She is only involved in fulfilling their desire to hugs and kiss 24/7 🙄 … geezzz PG, you gotta be kidding me. Who is the girl you handover your dreams and she works on them like crazy, eh? 🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
@miracle23, I didn’t realise my post wasn’t as clear. I loved the whole album and the songs were awesome, you can’t fault it at all.
You’re right, it’s about how we connect the songs to what’s happening in the drama but we can’t do anything about it and it is sad to see a great season 1 to a very disappointing season 2.
@nrllee, I’m with you too! I just love Jwan this season than Pabo. Pabo is still pabo. 🤦🏻♀️
Whilst we’re at parallels. Remember Prof Cheon (mean CS Prof)? The one who we thought would be a perfect match for Jang? Didn’t he try to marry for money (the wrong reasons)? This was the same conversation that mentioned “villain”. This was in S1E9
PaBo – JWan did you hear the news? Prof Cheon and the CEO of JinYong Credit Union are getting married.
JWan – who is he marrying?
PaBo – Jin MinJu. The CEO of JinYong Credit Union (wait…isn’t Pink Piggie also a giveaway toy for a credit Union 🤔😂?). The self made entrepreneur. She’s loaded.
SHwa – she’s one of the Foundation’s Board Members. (PaBo kinda is isn’t he? Because of his dad?)
PaBo – yes she’s close to the Chairman. She’s very capable and she’s an all round wonderful person (sound familiar? 😂). And that’s why the Chairman is very concerned at the moment.
SH – why is he concerned?
IJ – I am sure he’s very worried. She’s a competent business woman and has a great personality. But she has low standards for men (😂😂😂). Prof Cheon is obviously after her money, so I bet the Chairman is torn as to whether to intervene or not. (Looking at JWan) Is he really NOT a good person?
JWan – that’s right. He’s a total jerk. He’s really horrible. I’d describe him as a villain.
SHwa – what is a Villain?
IJ – it’s a compliment. Runs to get and pay bills. It means a hardworking person who always does his best.
SHwa – really? Okay I have to do my rounds. See you guys later.
I always wondered why Prof Cheon was added to the mix. Maybe this is why. He had that strange ER incident as well in an early ep this season. And everyone was watching on. Just like everyone was watching on when Jang did her maggotting.
Not sure if that means we have to endure a bit longer because PaBo would be like the CEO. Totally clueless. IJ would be the Chairman equivalent, knowing her real reason for marrying PaBo but torn as to whether to say anything or not.
I didn’t pay that much attention to his story. I know he was busted and the marriage never happened. Her mother was sick wasn’t it? And she was in hospital? And Cheon was rude to the mother and the granddaughter. And that ended the relationship.
@nrllee, the daughter was the one who told her mother the real face of the doctor. She joined her mom at the dinner date. Not sure how this will play out in this wg situation. By the way there were some heated discussions (?) at LWJ dc gallery on the matter of Shyeong’s lack of screentime vs you know who. Of course rabid shippers grilled the discussion to defend their princess… 🤷♀️🤷♀️🤷♀️
Any way I came across a comment saying that whatever being complaint doesn’t matter because the ep has been sent to netflix fully edited up to ep. 10 for subbing. Well, at least HP team is aware now that people are questioning them. Whether they will further edit the submmited eps depend because they did some editing after ep 2 was aired right? 🤷♀️
The bts is not yet uploaded. Uncommon delay. Perhaps shin pd needs some time to reflect or write a rebuttal media release. He needs to defend his ego as usual.😎
@Miracle23 Now that you mentioned it, you are right. We have never even heard JW verbally admit that he loves or even likes Jang whether it be to Jang or his friends (but we do get him saying she’s not his cup of tea in S1). In their whole relationship, there was also no exchange of such words unlike with the Bidulgi couple that we can hear them tell the other that they love each other every time they have a phone call. Of course, it could be that they prefer to express through actions, but there should be at least one verbal admission from JW right?
This makes me wonder if right now, JW is in the same position as with IJ and his ex-wife. We knew that it was IJ’s ex-wife who truly chased IJ and that IJ married her because of this. Could it also be that JW accepted Jang because she pursued him endlessly in S1? And just like how JW seemed disappointed with himself for setting up IJ’s ex-wife to IJ, would IJ also regret pushing Jang to JW? I just hope that this time, JW won’t make the same mistakes that IJ did and just end up getting divorced in the future.
@jwave, if ikjun realises fast enough he should put a stop to this toxic relationship of wg. He is her no. 1 supporter. He encouraged her as her cupid, and put the idea into PG’s head. He taught her to manipulate PG no? Remember the fake proposal and roses. He taught her to lie to get into PG’s heart. And her confession with that crappy sad face, that is guilt tripping of sort. Emotional manipulation as @Fly said. Pathetic way of confessing your feelings. No good thinking woman should stoop that low.
Right now if bad omen befalls wg, it is also Ikjun’s fault. Because despite knowing her fantasizing PG, he pushed forward, he encouraged them with his idea of romance when he knows first hand how incompatible is his boring princess and PG.
@Miracle23 Yes. IJ was the one who planted the idea in JW’s mind and pushed Jang to JW. Given IJ’s track record in the romance department, he shouldn’t have meddled in his friend’s love life if he truly cares about him. Every time IJ meddles, someone’s bound to get hurt (like Bidulgi couple). Also since he’s close to both involved, he should have realized how incompatible Jang and JW are.
Right now, it seems like IJ is also ‘fantasizing’ Jang. She seems perfect in IJ’s eyes and when she does make a mistake, everything is still okay and forgivable for IJ. IJ should wake up from his fantasy and see the danger he’s put his friend into.
@jwave, if you look at how Ikjun is handling bidulgi issue post break up, he is running away/ not taking responsibility from having to face his own mistake in interfering into their relationship with his nosiness. He walks away, he used iksun’s request not to tell Jwan as his shield. Jwan is his best friend. He knows Jwan is sincere towards Iksun. He is the best guy out there. Better than ikjun himself. Ikjun can be nosy with WG. Why can’t he take that one year to turn everything back again for bidulgi??? I bet for WG he will back out too. He really needs some reality check. Prove me wrong Ikjun. 😏
Holaaa, good morning. The discussion here is really like reservoir. Refreshing. @KattieR, all along since Ep12S1, I keep on wondering what made Pabo becomes Pabo. IIRC @FGB has mentioned several reasonable reasons, e.g Pabo is a man and not all man can understand how woman’s mind working. So when Jang throw herself and said it out loud that she likes PaBo, (and Pabo who has a delicate heart), saw the tears, and couldn’t help but reciprocate her feelings. And now, you came with another reasonable explanation. I am noting it down : Pabo is inspired by his parents marriage, loveless but convenient. And SHwa’s suggestion, find himself a nice lady to settle and have kids. That’s a good one.
@Miracle23 not only Pabo never say a word about his feelings towards Jang. As IJ said that PaBo cooks the best ramyeon, but we never see him cook ramyeon for Maggot.
@Pandamilktea, your list has a very solid ground. Since I couldn’t post clips (somehow I always blocked by copyright issues) I’ve shared Gifs about all of that before.
Rosa
https://i.postimg.cc/RhX3FRXZ/Why-SHwa.gif
Romance
https://i.postimg.cc/ZqK4RdmX/FG81.gif
Let’s get married
https://i.postimg.cc/DwXZS1R1/FG-11.gif
Shwa
https://i.postimg.cc/3R3mxdY9/Shwa-mistakes.gif
If we combined all the clues and crumbs from S1, we can build a ship as well, not just canoe, except if ShinLee prefer to working on another shitty ship.
I agree with everything you have been saying!
JW is escaping reality. He doesn´t like Jang…he just settled for her because she asked desperate with tears and Ikjun had been telling him what a nice girl she is. So he does what SHwa told him to do (“find a nice girl and marry”) and mimics his own mother (“I married for convenience. It was a loveless marriage but I was happy in my own way”).
Like he said “I have given up on love”…Jang is like a charity case which is in fact his specialty 😛
Also, he heard Ikjun karaoke love declaration…I’m sure he understood what was going on. He probably thought it was reciprocated and that’s why he accepts Jang and pushes SHwa to take him home alone in her car.
I find it interesting that they changed the lyrics of the last song from “autumn sky” to “winter sky”. I believe that it was in the fall of 1999 that the first “something” happened between FG (SHwa declaration?/romantic moment?/JW not going for it?). In the montage of the “Canon” rehearsal it’s in the “autumn moment” that SHwa looks behind and Autumn is the season of rain 🙂
@KattieR, I like the way you think. 😊
@BulmaGoku, thank you for the gift of Gifs all in one place to make my morning heart happy. 👍🍪🥠 Also your and @FGB’s combined ideas that PaBo may not understand the subtlety of women’s expressions. He is tender hearted and ready to accept a marriage that may not be altogether based on a great love. That he considers Jang as a charity, @Kattie R, made me chuckle. She is ready to receive his love and money. Little does she know that he has committed to prior charities…
How distant the memory of the electricity/rapture watching once provided… ’til that record scratch last season – to the point where I just don’t care anymore (even though there are characters I absolutely love). I get more enjoyment (at this point) reading these deep dives – how everyone has so much faith/hope…
Honestly, if I didn’t need something to exercise to I probably wouldn’t bother at all. Never mind, Maggot comes onscreen & I employ the FF button with it already at twice the speed.
IS THIS A MASTER CLASS IN HOW TO RUIN A SHOW?
pm3 it helps that I played your video first 🙂 Then I just tried again in YT & it came up as one of the results. It is hiding under the name “Sad Ocean”. I listened to it and it is the same one.
Re IJ & Uju’s camping request, it started from ep 3:
Ep 3: First time camping was mentioned. When Dad couldn’t finish off their burger meals because of an emergency call. He said, “It’s OK, I’m used to it”.
Ep 5: After the 1 year time skip. When talking about seeing Mo-ne every day and Uju still wants to see her. Uju’s response is “I do, but I’m still happy to see Mo-ne every day. Just like how I’m happy to see you every day.”
Ep: 6 Camping is mentioned again. IJ promised to go camping when the cicadas start molting. SHwa heard the conversation.
Ep 7 : IJ said he was going to study for conference in the weekend. When SHwa asked him to go to camping, he decided to go the next day. Just like that! That’s before the cicada started molting. In the camp site, father and son are wearing matching black and white outfits. Despite Uju mentioned he is happy to see IJ every day as mentioned in ep 5, he looks very sad sitting in front of the fire because of the potential break up with Mo-ne.
It shows that if IJ really wants to make time, he can just make it happens. He doesn’t need to make Uju waits for a year, or when the cicadas have started molting. I really hope he can reflect on his priorities and come to realisation of that. As mature as Uju, I always felt children grew up far too quickly. When the moment is gone it is gone. Uju doesn’t really throw a tantrum with the limited parent attention. I suspect no such perfect young kid exists in real life. XD
By the way – is it a serious plot about the fight with girlfriend? I always take it as a cute joke. (Or a metaphor of one of the five doctors’ love life that I read from the comments). I thought young kids like Uju at that age (7 yo) don’t really play with girls that much and very unlikely to stay angry overnight, to the extent that does not to want to play around in the great outdoor! Is it just a convenient plot to give some conversation time for the two adults, or shows IJ’s priority is wrong?
Re WG
The not sharing pain issue has been previously discussed by the couple.
In ep 5. After Jang’s mother late night phone call and after the abusive husband incident, the conversation of Jang and PB in ER:
PB: When something bad happens, you should tell others and ask for help
Jang: Okay.
PB: Gyeo-ul. Is there something you should be telling me?
Jang: No, everything’s good.
PB: I’m glad to hear that. But if you’re ever worried or stressed out about something, just tell me. I may be able to help you.
Jang: Okay, I will. But everything’s fine at the moment. Except for the fact that my patients suffer because I’m dumb and incompetent, everything’s fine.
And yet, when bad things happened on the proposal date. Jang chose to handle her mother’s surgery on her own. Let’s see if the writer will let it be just a bump in the relationship, or a breaking point.
@Kattie R ahh thanks for pointing out children’s connections. I haven’t thought about that at all 😊
“Little does she know that he has committed to prior charities…”
@Fern 🤭🤭🤭🤭 Imagine her face when he tells her this:
Oh, did I tell you that:
1. I have handed over my inheritance to Shwa for her to use for DLL;
2. I sometimes topup the DLL fund with my own salary;
3. I have committed to a long term mortgage loan to fund a shelter house for Yulje’s patients and guardians, and signed up the long-term lease with Shwa;
4. I also have to transfer around 1k or 2k dollar to an orphanage that my late father has inherited to me;
5. I rejected my mom’s offer on her land and ask her to sell it so that she can buy her own apartment;
6. I am not a chaebol and I don’t own Yulje.
7. We don’t have to buy a new car. We can still use Shwa’s car for a long long time.
8. I am practically a normal salaryman, some months I might be seeing red in my accounts.
9. I can still rent my own space once we get married though, on loan
🤣🤣🤣🤣
If PG did not find it is necessary to inform JongSu about DLL even after that old man helps him kick starts his big dream via the shelter house, do the wgrs think he would tell that ditzy idiot about DLL? And the whole long term mortgage and lease? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Liar ❤ Liar. What an amazing pairing! / sarcasm
My questions to our lurkers from that ship, as a future wife – can you live with this facts? Can you live with a husband who finds it more important to leave you out from these charity works he is involved with? His big dreams? Be honest. Do you think those hugs and kisses are able to solve any issues in your marriage? 😎
K bye.
@n!ck,
Welcome to the blog.
Can I assume that you’re past your 40s since you know the sound of a record scratching?
Even my sons think that phonographs are antediluvian.
Yes, I know what you mean about ruining a show. But just wait, will you? I’ve another “deep dive” — as you call it — on mothers and cinematography. I’ve Sunday church this morning but it should be ready before dinner.
Welcome @n!ck 😂. Masterclass on how to ruin a show indeed!
Hahaha, @miracle23.
But I thought the WGers were theorizing that Jang was chaebol? 🤪
Maybe she would FLEX like SeonBin, whose parents are both doctors, and tell JW, “I have money. Just bring your spoon.” 😈
On a serious note, it’s a red flag 🚩 when couples don’t talk about the state of their personal finances BEFORE marriage. Maybe it’s the Korean culture but it’s not right in today’s world. Financial problem is the #1 source of stress in marriage.
I wish this writer Lee would get her head out of the clouds. What is she preaching to the masses? That Jang and JW’s relationship is commendable #couplegoals? Weirdo.
@Miracle23, we are on the same path here. 😈
Even if Jang were also saintly, kindly and empathetic to JWon’s charities, (in other words, another person entirely), don’t you think she would be upset to learn about all of this at this late date? Unless she’s all of that and JWon has already told her in an off-screen segment we don’t know about.
I don’t think she is like that, however. I’m thinking back about Seok-min and his public statement that he wants to earn a lot of money and needs surgical experience to get to that level. I have no problem with him being honest about his needs because he wants to take care of his family and wants to contribute to his own wedding. It’s out in the open. He’s fooling no one. Seon Bin who is fine with his honest desire proposes to him. Listening to them was Jang, who says nothing but later takes on a surgery alone that she can’t handle (endangering the patient) and who most recently is fishing for a proposal from JWon. It makes me think she’s not altruistic. It would take a lot of back-pedalling from Shin/Lee to make me thing otherwise.
@packmule3, how interesting if Jang were chaebol! But we can’t know it unless the PD tells us now.
Your red flag reminds me of SH and his ex-wife. Her family wasn’t honest about their finances and it turned out to be a disaster.
@packmule3, I don’t think it escapes LWJ mind about how important stable finance is in one’s marriage. Just look at the number of korean productions that keep raising this issue in their own society. Look at what she herself produced in R88.
Additionally, this duo really has a weird kink i.e. how they wrote Taewoong x Siwon plus her sister, as well as Najung x Trash. They knows they have a huge followers and their influence towards their audience. They are also irresponsible for producing a toxic society among their fans and not to mention encouraging them. As a result their toxic cult followers or should I say, the toxic shippers, praise them to the moon and back, unable to discern right from wrong. They lap up whatever is presented to them, blindly. They bullies those who are in disagreement with them.
Meanwhile, the HP team keeps tagging the wg pairing as sweet love, sweet here and there. 🤮🤮🤮🤮 Relationship goal? My foot!
🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️ definitely a total bunch of weirdos.
I think I’m lucky for not being following the HP team or paying attention to social media. I didn´t know they were promoting the WG couple as much and considering them couple goals (if so I feel bad for the actors who have to embark on publicity stunts). I’m just following what they show on the episode.
I watch the show with my family (mother and sister), we discuss it and then I come here to see what escaped us. Nobody here at home considers Iksong or WG couple goals. My mother (a more casual viewer) was rooting for Iksong but at the end of S1 she said “I don´t think she likes him” and S2 confirmed it for her. Unfortunately, she never noticed FG until we mentioned it. Regarding WG, nobody here, even at S1, liked the couple (mainly because of Jang) and we all have been feeling very frustrated with them (a lot of eye rolling!).
But we also feel that the show is showing us that WG is not relationship goals and the money is a key issue on the show. We see that everyone talks about money with their loved ones and that a sign of a stable relationship is the act of “saving money”.
– This season we saw Minha opening a saving account after finishing paying her student debts (big step for her!). She also had that talk about her boyfriend and money last season
– JaeHak who has the most stable love relationship in the show was saving for years
– Seon Bin and Seok-min talk about it and has been a point of discord for the couple; they seem to have faced and talked about it;
– JW is always poor (he gives a lot) but he also saves a lot (ex: the account for his mother bday) and when he makes the loan (big step for him and SHwa) he talks about another 2 saving accounts that he has (what are they for?)
– SHwa and JWan talk about money with their families
I find it funny that Jang was so interested in Dr Bong information but she never payed for anything…it always Minha or Captain Ahn. She never pays for anything and never talks about money. Big no!
Have JWan and Iksun talked about money?
I despised Jang the moment I saw the look of disappointment when Dr. Bong told her that “Jeong-won, does not have any desire for material possessions.” S1E4
She is surely looking for an escape. And she thought that having Jeongwon as a bf, who feeds her every given time will be a sure get away. She might still be thinking that Jwon is the heir of Yulje but what happens when she finds out that charities are Jwon’s top priority. That Dr. Bong was serious back then.
Interesting @Kattie, you brought us back to this money topic. So indeed LWJ knew this could be an issue in a relationship and she explored it with other pairings instead of wg. I mean, other pairings really have a lot of sharing of important personal matters but wg just shares their body parts 🤪 (pun intended) and Jang insecurities i.e. one (physical) affection per day, fishing for a proposal, secret affair. She is dictating the relationship. She was the one who wants them to remain a secret from others. So why is she annoyed having to lie about it? She is making it sounds like he is the one who wants them hidden from public… Geez…
@Bulmagoku, weee gifs, thank you! 🙂 Re-watching these scenes all combined is heartening. You’re right, with all the (rational) crumbs sprinkled all over, we actually should be able to build a ship. One that has a strong foundation to boot. Wish ShinLee has not forgotten that. Harumph.
@agdr03, @Miracle23, I’m the same as you — I *love* Season 1 OST! It’s among my default background music when I work or drive or do household chores. 🙂 I haven’t listened to the Season 2 songs consecutively yet (only once each, while watching the episodes). So far, I recall “I Like You” (the one they sang at karaoke) and “Superstar” as the catchier tunes. 🙂
@Fern, on the chaebol theory, oh my. 🤪 I read about it on the same day I read about the shotgun wedding/unplanned pregnancy theory. I don’t recall all now (waste of brain storage space, hihihi), but supposedly it “fits” in the princess/Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (lone resident for 13 professors) narrative for Jang. + There is the evil/abusive father (analogous to Snow White’s evil stepmother) + Jang contributing financially someday to DLL (that’s how she will “take part” in DLL), and, I kid you not, she and JWon eventually presiding over DLL and the children’s hospital, which shall be like their own kingdom. I stopped reading any of that stuff after that. 🙃
@pandamilktea, if she were a nice person I wouldn’t mind all of that. But she’s dodgy. Gosh, if it pans out like that I’ll be cross. Too, too melodramatic.
@Kattie R it’s great to have you share your novel perspectives with us. And it’s also lovely to see that you watch the show with your family (I wish I could get some of my family members to watch kdramas *sigh*), it definitely helps to have someone close to discuss these things with, at least you don’t feel weird in your head haha Moreover, it’s always good to hear what neutrals have to say about the show in general, because we, while mostly rational, do after all dawn shipper glasses when it comes to couple scenes. Your theories have definitely been a breath of fresh air to read. Please do comment more from next episode onwards 🙂
@pandamilktea the imagination, when it comes to Jang, runs wild I tell ya. I wish she really were that kind of person to fulfill these “head canons” but she isn’t even 1/4th way there. It was really satisfying to hear her say how incompetent she feels she is even after 3 years of being a resident. At least she isn’t completely unaware of her shortcomings like IJ.
As I have said in all posts about E7, I wish we were shown that these friends shared their burdens with each other. At this point, it seems like they only share music between themselves and otherwise live closeted lives (or we get bizarre exchanges like “can you do the grocery shopping”). For a show that is rooted in friendship, the dilution in S2 is beyond baffling to me.
Also, yes yes yessss S1 OST is love, S2 not so much. In addition to both the songs you’ve listed, I also revisit Rain and You now and then 🙂
Thanks so much @pm3 for putting this together.
It was driving me crazy how ignorant IJ was, and reading your post i finally realized that he didn’t even interact with him at all during camping!!! I think the director purposely make them wear matching outfits yet disconnected from each other to send a message that although they look like a “couple”, they don’t match, just like Iksong and WG. For me (still an optimistic FG) it sends a message that no matter how the two popular ships (Iksong and WG) share many screen time they have, they still don’t connect to each other… just like IJ and Uju at the camping trip.
Meanwhile FG is on the background, walking at the same pace, sharing the same dream and pushing each other’s best potential. Tbh if the directors didn’t milk WG and Iksong fans, FG could be the perfect couple. Too bad S2 turns JW into a dummy teen.
It’s not that I’ve lost hope in FG, at this point I’m just not invested.
@nick masterclass 😂 I think DDSSLLS writers could contribute to the class.
For me, time skips are the most useful plot devices when done well. What I consider well done?
The ffwd of the years with pause at a certain event every year. Or an unexpected skip but with a voice over of what all took place so we don’t get bogged down by details that don’t matter. My favorites? When there’s a sense of whiplash and then time spent telling/showing us how we got there.
The poorly done time skip: what HP2 did
They told us it was coming, we knew how long the skip would be (1 year) we had high expectations and what was the the point? There was none. Everyone was still stagnant.
Such a let down. And that’s where I stopped expecting excellence and prepared myself for a mediocre drama viewing experience
@kattie welcome! And i love the breakdown of the children you shared.
I agree that JW is settling and he didn’t realize it yet. I find it odd when he apologized for being boring in the ep. That’s not something you’d usually say in a relationship? Sure it’s full of ups and downs but is he being self-conscious because Jang doesn’t really show her affection?
Jang didn’t help too when he said they should pretend to break up. It’s been a freaking year and they now work in different departments. I don’t even know why JW thinks throwing a ring will solve all the problems? Do they need a ring just so they can date publicly?
@fern @miracle23 i just remember her frown when Bong said he didn’t have any interest in material possessions. At first i thought she frowned because it means he’s not interested in dating, but why would she views herself as a material possession? The only logical explanation is she is kinda in to it for the money, especially since SB also heard the rumours he owned Yulje, it wouldn’t be a scretched to think she is eyeing him for that reason too.
The funny thing is WGers think she is either a chaebol, or also didn’t care about material possessions (based on her lack of outfit choices). But we do see how opportunistic she gets when she abused IJ’s card. She’s using both IJ and JW to fulfill her every needs.
@bulmagoku thanks for the gifs. I need it after the lack of FG scenes in the last ep. Yes let’s keep paddlingg
@birdie007 completely agree with you on all points. Not as invested in FG, although will be satisfied if they did get together in the end. Re. time skip, absolutely, can be a very powerful plot device but is done injustice 9/10 by TV writers. A lot of series simply insert them for the heck of it, like what HP did. The same duo did time skips well in the Reply series; that’s why it’s incomprehensible to me how they faltered so bad this time around, especially considering HP was sort of a comeback drama for them. My only reasoning is that the seasonal format has overwhelmed them and they have made to best decision in not pursuing season 3, it would fry my brain to no end. As a lot of us have said, I am on auto-pilot until next episode. Once #9 kicks in, I’m hoping for rhythm to get together. If not, then I’m throwing the towel.
It’s so weird that ep.s 5/6-8 are supposed to be about emotions, but those are the ones that felt most mechanical to me.
@dushman1010, maybe the emotion is more reflective by the patient stories? Actually when I think back after reading you girls, I find it weird. This is supposed to be a friendship of over 20 years. S2 was billed as the friends having deeper chemistry and relationship. Do we actually see their friendship going deeper? We have Shyeong talking to shwa. He did this in s1 too. Jwan, this poor soul can only talk about his feeling over dinner? And that scene is so short. Ikjun ran away from discussing it. That coward.
Then Shwa x Ikjun… any depth? Just ikjun being his chatty self and shwa indulging. They have always been like that since s1. The scene also was cut off with no further progress on the depth department.
I see the 99ers are growing apart as well. This is a different vibe from the friendship goals in the reply series. Really shinlee wasted so much screentime for banal subplots when they should have elaborated more on what they promised with further development of 99ers friendship. 7 wasted ep. Geez… 🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
@sasa13 Thank you so much! I agree with your points too. @dashman1010 Yes, I think seeing the episodes with one casual and one more analytical like me it’s good because I get the 2 perspectives. And in truth neither of them is happy with S2. And I totally agree with you and @miracle23…it’s bizarre that in a tv about friendship, the friends don’t talk to each other and help with their burdens.
For me the thing that I miss the most is the interaction between the 99ers. They also had family and love problems in S1 but we say them talk with each other over dinner or in office. It baffles me that after the time skip, they really don’t talk. Like I said before, in the first episodes (before the time jump) I was already missing their interaction but I thought that they reunited less (in dinners and SHwa office) because she was away (that it was purposeful to show how SHwa is their glue)..so it made sense. Still she found time for her friends…she had that important talk with SH (which I loved), she saw that Jwan was thinner and unhappy so she arranged the crab dinner (the few times I saw he smiling this season was when she announced the dinner:p), she made time to eat with Ikjun and helped JW with DLL and the apartment.
But now she is back and things seem worse!! She is always with Ikjun, she seems so passive and aloof…she didn´t even had a supportive and friendly word to Jwan after he confessed that he was still longing for his ex (they have something in common – they could support each other! they are friends!). She didn´t call out Ikjun for ignoring his son during the camping trip. We don´t see her really mentoring anymore.
Is she supposed to be like her butterfly patient? She is hurting but can´t express it? I don´t know.
And what kind of a friend has time for everyone and messes with everyone love lives (Minha-SH/WG) but chooses to ignore the connection between his sister and friend which are clearly suffering. Why doesn´t he meddle this time? I wonder if Iksun knows that Jwan is that miserable (Ikjun s1 was oblivious but kinder?).
Regarding the soundtrack, S1 was better but there are good songs in S2…however they don´t seem as compelling during the episodes. The music was interwoven really well in S1 episodes…sometimes in the beginning, sometimes in the end. It was organic and it took its time (now they are really short, in the middle of dialog scenes and always in the end). Another box to thick.
There have been somany perceptive comments that have broadened my appreciation for certain characters and ended me to change my investment in some characters,
Of the fab or lacking five, depending on the day, my main interest as it has always been is Songhwa. I want the very best for her because I see her as someone who not only is a fine doctor, but an exemplary human being. Her poor singing voice is the running joke of the series but as a visible character flaw it comes across as endearing. The other flaw is that she has chosen bad boyfriends in her past and seems like she has rejected some good guys. Even in her relationship mistakes her humanity ones through.i only wish her good karma and if she 3nds up with any of her friends. May itnotbe IJ. It is funny but I wouldnotnpbe sad if she ended up with Jwan ( and he didn’t end up with Iksun-that family had its limits). If she ends up with PaBo, he really needs heavy character rehab.
Right now, however, I agree that Jwan, who was not the radar as much as the others is the sleeper star of the male leads. I have seen Mumpng Kyung-ho in the e r dramas, but I agree that here he has been able to show his range as an actor and he’s very affecting. I just watched the first table read for season one and I was impressed by his show of respect and high regard forKim Hae-sook (Rosa), who was seated t notepad the table, indicating her place in the hierarchy. Jeon Mido and Kim Dae-myung (SH) were placed across the table. They were the newbies but were the first to rise in respect when Kim Hae-sook entered the room. Yys sat next to her followed by Jung Kyung-ho followed by p, get this, ShinHyun-been(Maggot). Across the table the first seat near the main table was given to Jo Jung-suk, followed by Mi-do,filled by Kim Dae-myung. The table seating was very interesting. The actress who plays Iksun came but wasn’t supposed to be there young Kim Joon as Uju was way down at the endbut probably accounting for his age. However, there was great interest in him. As a younger, he did very well.
Reading the seating arrangement, I think it is telling that the actress who plays Rosa was in a first seat position.other older actors were not in the position of honor and it is significant that she I supporting cast.that is why I think 5he character of Rosa and her illness are pivotal to the end game. Our Maggot actress was placed in a first position for supporting actors but was not in lead positions and Iksunwasn’t even supposed to be at the initial read through. It might be fun for other commenter to look at this video for more clues.
The other great behind the scenes video was Jeon Mi-Do’s audition tape. She went intriguing she’d get a patient role. But they had her read for Maggot and Songhwa. They told her that she could be any role but that they found their Songhwa and were blown away by her performance. She was also recommended by JjS based on her theater performance in Once and also was subsequently praised by YYS. I thinktheyhave to get back to giving her lots more screentime because it would be anutter waste of talent.That’s why I hope we’ll be seeing less of the WG coupling and Maggot(Maggot has been conveniently sent out of town). And given Rosa’s condition, with a neurological basis,, Shwa surgery maybe in order. Reading the room again.
So here’s hoping for some character redemption(not Maggot) and some realistic relationships going forward.. Fingers crossed…
@Old american lady I love Jwan and I think Kyung-ho acting has been top-notch. He is my favourite and I always shipped him with Shwa despite knowing that they are almost definitely just friends.
However I always found really interesting the dynamics and visual representation of the trio SHwa-JWan-JW in S1. They have a trio scene/interaction in every episode in S1 except episode 10 (FG one) and 12 (and many of them are intriguing; there are some interesting quotes also). JWan is always shown as someone who is very vocal in his admiration for SHwa and protection/concern of her well being. This is misread by her ex – Professor Jang – who thinks he is going overboard and that he has feelings for her. In season 1 JW never seems upset that SHwa likes Ikjun jokes but he clearly doesn´t like being left out in the dinner scene in episode 2 and even complains about another time they left him out on a meal; he also says to them in lunch episode 11 – “Stay friends for long. Just don´t marry each other, but have meals together.”
It always struck me that the most important scene of S1 is supposedly the dinner in episode 2 and SHwa and Ikjun barely talked to each other. On the other hand, we have the great boyfriend discussion between JWan and SHwa and the trio talking about SHwa problem that is concerning her.
My crazy theory is that JW thought that JWan liked SHwa and so he didn´t pursue her interest in his 20s/freshman year (even in flashbacks we are shown how close JWan and JW are becoming – for example Aloha karaoke – they are besties and JW would totally be the noble idiot).
Kids can act as if they are mature for their age but they are still kids with all the pain and fear. ,et’s just say that poor Uju is constantly abandoned-firstby his mother, allegedly for work and almost every day by his dad, for work, for social stuff. Dad’s priorities are screwed up. The milk and cookies scene said it all and now we see Uju abandoned even when Dad sits right before his eye the picture I f Uju in his little camping chair, with his little fire in his little camping clothing and hat is heartbreaking. Just wanted to slap IJ to come to his senses, but he remains n s what I think is purposefully oblivious.
Jang could be a chaebol,but herbrother is aware salesman, unless he owns the dealership. I think she. Ike money but won’t let on. We know that PaBo and SH come from money. But I think for Jang,money has to be some kind of c.ue…
@Kattie R, I think they established that Shwa is doing a ,ot of surgeries(maybe for DLL) so she doesn’t have a .ot of time for much else.
@Kattie R, what great comments. JW and JWan are friends and roommates too. The roomier thing could be sticky with both liking Shwa….wow…
@birdie007, sorry, a little off-topic, but I liked the timeskip execution in CLOY, too. The reading of various text messages throughout time over the leads’ montage of analogous scenes in N and S Korea, which montage is the culminating variation of the opening credits we’d been watching all along? *chef’s kiss*
@Sasa13, on JWon apologizing for being boring, it stuck out to me, too. Is he being meta, apologizing to us because the tropey scenes are boring? 🤪 Was it written so Jang could say she finds him the funniest, as opposed to SHwa who, as JWon has repeatedly noted, laughs at IJ’s jokes? (Incidentally, has Jang ever been shown laughing in the show?)
Speaking of, @Kattie R, I get your theory. I rewatched S1 recently, and I remember again that, at least during the first few episodes, a viewer may think that if there would be a love triangle, it would involve Jwon, SHwa, JWan. FG crumbs we already know; SHwa and JWan bickered the most in the first few episodes, and Dr Jang (the ex) cast in some doubt when he asked JWan if he liked SHwa. As the plot further unfolded, the viewer will realize she is wrong. (A little similar to the intentional misdirection in R88 about Sunwoo/DeokSun/Junghwan.)
Me, I’ve always thought JWon is subconsciously/consciously aware/jealous of IkSong closeness — after the shotgun seat incident, he rejected SHwa’s offer to drive all of them home, and pushed that she just drive home IJ instead; he gets increasingly irritated (?) that SHwa finds IJ funny.
I also agree with everyone about missing the deeper and closer portrayal of friendships! They were such friendship goals in S1.
And IJ’s treatment of Uju this episode! 😠 I get that as early as S1, IJ doesn’t get to spend as much time with Uju. (I understand thats part of their dynamic, and if it will be their plot point, well and good.) But last season, there was no glaring neglect of and disregard for Uju??
Unlike this episode, where IJ just decides to go camping (despite Uju requesting it repeatedly, and for over a year) the nanosecond SHwa suggests it?? Plus no effort on IJ’s part to cheer up Uju at all? He just spent the entire time chatting with SHwa and let the kid stew in his bad feelings the entire day and the next?? Badly done. 🙄 (Or, I suspect, lazily and superficially written script.)
Here’s what I am really hoping for with the reveal. That we have indeed been watching 2 realities. At the moment, it’s been almost fully the alternate trope filled reality with noble idiocy, first love awkwardness (played out in a 40yo male setting) etc. And that’s why we seem to be staying in the same months for longer. The weird braking sounds that we’ve been getting Eg when WG were on their car driving date with the sudden screech and then abrupt switch to SH dining with his mom is when the 2 worlds switch over. Same with the scene with the hand holding under the table and then weird music cut out to JWan opening the empty fridge in the apartment. I can’t explain it any other way. This could be what MiDo was talking about when she said their chat was set alight when they got the final script books. That’s what I am banking on. Otherwise HP2 has been a massive disappointment so far – when it comes to writing a cohesive script with a focus on depth anyway. Guess we will see what Ep8 delivers. I am hoping that with Jang away in GwangJu we will be seeing less of her. I can totally see IJ driving out there to seek her out. He’s always done this. Looking for her whenever she’s in trouble. Even back in S1. We have the gang going back to their roots? Dinosaur Ridge. I am hoping for some flashbacks about what the significance was.
The teaser video had a pingpong match? It looked like a GS Vs CS game.
Kattie, welcome! I too started posting this year (there’s so much to comment on!) I wanted to say your posts are great! Looking forward to hearing more from you later on!
Note to BODers, Korea always uses metrics to determine drama and actor popularity.Ratings are used for dramas and actor reputation scores based on consumer participaton,participation, communication,and community indexes are used to determine actor popullarity.The latest scores were just published and our fab 5 made the list.jo Jung Sukranked number one, Jeon Mi Do was next highest of our cast at number six.Jung Kyung Ho was number8, followed by Yoo Yeon Seok at number 9 and Kim Dae Myung at number 13. Shin Hyun Been did not make t into the top fifty. This begs the question, why is she being given so much air time when public interest is squarely onthe side of Jeon Mido of all the women. Makes zero sense from a ratings viewpoint. I’m stumped.
Also one correction, Mido was nominated for a Baeksaeng in 2020, UT didn’t win. However she won est new actress at the Brands of the Year Awzrds,2nd Asian CintentAwards, 5th Asia ArtistsAwards, 7th APAN Artists Awards and 15th Asia Model Festival. So again, I am perplexed by her dwindling screen time because she brought prestige to this drama.
What am I missing Shin Lee?
Songhwa forever!
@KattieR, I like your perspectives and I agree with the others that it’s a breath of fresh air. Regarding the money talks, indeed, the other couples had been shown to have had talks regarding their finances but this is one aspect that was at least never shown with WG. Actually, we were never shown any WG conversations that had any depth. They just don’t go deep and personal.
As with you and the others, I also always thought that the relationship would be between Jwan-SW-JW in S1. Even now, I also won’t mind JWan since he’s also one of my fave among the five, next to SW. We can see however that he’s still not over IS and I would just want happiness for him.
@OAL, Now that you mentioned the casting process, I also rewatched Jang’s audition video. She was told that the show was planned for multiple seasons but if she won’t be available for the next, then they can just figure something out. If she really is the planned love line for JW, I don’t think they’d pick someone who is open to not returning in the next season. As much as possible, you would want an actress who is committed for the multiple seasons right? After all, the love line is with a main character and not just anybody else.
Like all of you here, I miss the Fab 5’s interactions. It’s really sad how the five’s screen time had to give way for Jang’s instead. I really do hope that we won’t have to see her next episode. If they even show her outside the hospital tending to her personal issues, that would be too much. I think the show would do well even without her presence 🙃 At least in next week’s episode, we will have another dinner with the five of them and probably even a trip. I just hope that from the next episode and onwards, we will see them interact and eat together more often as now.
@jwave, if you can, check out the first table read for the series in season one. Pay attention to where the main cast is seated and notice that our Rosa actress who was Halmonie in Start Up has the most prestigious position across the table from JJS and right next to 5he writer and producer table(the head table).That she is a highly regarded senior(sunbae) actress goes without saying. But I also think it speaks to her role in the drama that will, to my mind, be pivotal. The clues started early, in the first season. We are seeing it become very important now. We know from the trailer that PaBo will be overwhelmed by her health issue and show guilt. With Jang away, he will be distanced from their “relationship”, We can only surmise how this will pan out. Rosa is a big key to the future of the five.
@nrllee talking about strange background sound. I remember when Seon Bin suggested to Shwa about creating a fake boyfriend. She suggested to pick Jwon, and when Jwon enter, there was this funny applause sound just like we usually hear in quiz or on stage performance. We’ve discussed about that when it was aired. it’s also a strong indication about Shin Pd’s preference. Putting that applause sound out of nowhere was really odd, and obviously it was deliberate. Because iirc he always sits with his editor whenever they do the editing.
@bulmagoku, not only that he x shwa shared same bgm when he ordered those drinks using ikjun’s card and shwa suggesting sharing full cake. The similar bgm was used for minha in the elevator too but not exactly as shwa x pg. Nobody else had this sounds in any of their scenes, funny or not, in that ep.
@BulmaGoku @miracle23 that’s why this season seems less serious? We didn’t have those strange sounds, weird music cuts and bizarre bgm in S1? It just makes the vibe/feel of this season different? Different isn’t bad. It can be good if done well. But the writing this season hasn’t been as tight. I get the feeling the drama they wanted to film was severely hampered by COVID so they’ve had to pivot with major script changes. And the fact that they decided to can S3. Squeezing 2 seasons into 1. When Shin said there are no concrete plans for S3, for me that’s death knell to S3. It would be too hard to get everyone back on board again to align schedules. Unless they do a spin off with the side characters. But I don’t think they’ve given them enough screen time (bar 1 notable exception 🙄) for the audience to want a spin off. Shin did say in his first official script reading that the goal was “at least 2 seasons”. He’s delivered so I would say S3 is not going to happen. And I think ShinLee know that they will NOT be in the majority of the cult following’s good books when FG is revealed. WG will stay in the fan fic dreamscape world, where it belongs. Not in reality.
@nrlllee, they came out with the program popularity stuff and HP2 was number one. Of the actors YYS and JJS made it as well as our ugh “favorite”, Shin Hyun Been at number ten. I don’t think we’ll be seeing that much more of the WG because Shin Hyun Been is already filming her new drama, Monstrous (a seriously apt title-I’m being facetious). SHB and I guess her agency are getting her new projects because, I guess she has shown popularity in some quarters. It is actor economics-get the best work that you can, when you can and Shin Hyun Been is doing exactly that. I’ve also been watching a lot of behind the scenes coverage and she has appeared in one so far. I have to say that you’ve got to give it to Shin Hyun Been who is running with her new found popularity to make her best deals.
The other thing is that the Wg ship is popular in some circles, the Iksong ship is gaining. I think these ships will sink. I hope in the five upcoming episodes Shin Lee returns to the storytelling that made them famous-realistic slices of life where the WG ship proves to be a reflection of hormonal first crush as opposed to adult love. If the episodes are almost two hours in length, they have from seven and a half to ten hours to credibly complete the stories. I believe they have the skills to punch their way out of their self-defeating paper bag.
@OAL is she really? She was filming 2 dramas concurrently with HP2. I don’t think that made her terribly popular with the other drama because it meant everyone had to wait on her schedule freeing up from her HP2 commitments.
But yes I do think they are sticking to their guns and FG will be the final reveal. Like mafia. Once you find out who the mafia is, the game is over. So it won’t be revealed till close to the end. So final kiss will be FG.
@nrlllee, I think it was one new drama, Monstrous, and the article I read.eas about.SHB testing negative for COVID because the drama is filming. I’m sure your comment on scheduling applies here. Planting flowers near the dock.and getting into the canoe.
.
@nrlllee, SHB or her agency is taking full advantage of her current popularity. 8 just saw a piece on YouTube solely about her and how she is a chameleon in her roles showing her looking plain, glamorous-well looking like, she has acting range. She has been around for some time and is in her midthirties. I guess her strategy is to become “an overnight sensation”. She has two good projects coming along so I guess her strategy is working. She should probab,probably, give Shin Lee a finders fee for her exposure. I’ve seen her in Sunset In My Home Town where she v had a supporting role. She was fine in that role. And I grudgingly have to say that she certainly grabbed our attention as Jang. however I think that it was because she was paired with Yoo Yeon-seok, a fan favorite heartthrob. Had that not been a love line, I think she might have vanished like the other supporting actors because her role was one note.
I do wish the actor well, but I don’t see her carrying a lead role. And in the chase for good parts she has a lot of competition from actors of her age, younger and older ones too.
@OAL even in her next drama with Joong-ki, she will probably have another established actor (“heartthrob” definitely fits better) beside her do the heavy lifting.
There are a lot of actors who have a fan following just based on the projects they pick and not their acting abilities, maybe she belongs in that category. Whatever floats your boat, eh?
Imma just gonna post this here coz i dont have access to the Al Fresco threads. Dont worry I’m not asking for password. Will prob go back to lurking anyway after this drama.
But I’m having mixed feelings about this episode. IJ is so hardsell.
The few things I liked are Rosa on the keyboards (I was hoping for this coz I saw a BTS where Kim Hae Sook played a classical piece onthe piano.) And Gomgom progressing nice and slow. 🙂
IDK if IkSun’s the best for JunWan, but I want closure for my best boy. And I want him to be happy.