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36 Comments On “Dali and the Cocky Prince: Eps 9 & 10 Open Thread”
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Let’s enjoy the show!
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Thanks @pkml3. I was almost going to send you a reminder post, but thought that you’d probably scheduled it to pop up automatically, so I didn’t. And here it is!!
Here are some cookies 🍪 🍪 🍪 🍪 🍪 for you, because bitches always deserve cookies!
LOL Episode 9. Loved how Moo Hak turned the tables on poor, hapless Won Tak over the burglary.
MINOR SPOILER
MINOR SPOILER
If it was the result of a grudge it had to have been Won Tak’s fault since criminals (recently released female ex-convicts!) would not like him, and since it was a woman that MH bumped into outside the house, it might have been a crime of passion LOLOL. Loved Won Tak’s expression and how MH’s street smart thinking mind works. Makes complete sense, but he’s sooooo wrong, as usual!!
@GrowingBeautifully Moo Hak really doesn’t excel in drawing the right conclusions ahahaha! But he is pretty good at picking up on details.
I loved how gracefully Moo Hak took Da Li’s rejection. He’s very respectful in that way, which is such a contrast to Tae Jin’s sense of entitlement. Moo Hak gives Da Li the space to feel what she needs to feel, while also reminding her that it’s not typically in her nature to retreat due to fear (it really isn’t, gurl literally confronted a thief and a potential burglar). That was a very nice way to imply that she’s being somewhat cowardly in the face of love. But I can forgive her – she’s still getting over Tae Jin, not just in the romantic sense, but she’s also trying to process what it means to be intimate with someone platonically and romantically with the risk of abandonment.
Moo Hak really picked the perfect food for the kids to cook. Frittatas have everything that kids love – potatoes, bacon, eggs – while being super filling (and cheap to make!) I have yet to meet an omnivore that doesn’t like frittatas or some variation like quiches and tortillas. It’s particularly endearing when a man is good with kids.
I wonder what Moo Hak will do with the ex-chamber pot that is now a pot for doenjang. It would be a shame to waste century-old doenjang but damn I wouldn’t want to be eating out of a chamber pot. 🤣
@hotatoes, judging by Dali’s reaction to the ‘chamber pot’ it is probably a very valuable antique that the owner sent as collateral for the loan.
I like what you wrote about how well Moo-hak took Dali’s rejection. Compared to Tae-Jin who is constantly trying to manipulate her emotionally, Moo-hak is willing to wait and work for her love. You said he’s respectful in his own way. We see his understanding when he’s comforting Ahn Chak-hee when she is distressed about his rejection.
@Fern Yes it’s the pot that the gallery gifted Don Don F&B as a thank you for the loan. The dad had it in his hand in Episode 1. I think @Welmaris mentioned that in another post?
Clearly something happened at the Jin family home and the valuable chamber pot was mistaken for an ordinary ceramic. Lol. It was indeed a chamber pot, so that’s a bit of an icky mistake when you’re putting food in it.
Moo Hak realised that it was the antique chamber pot that was given as a gift – that’s why he hides it from Da Li. I guess he’ll be figuring out what to do with it in an upcoming episode.
As of Thursday afternoon Pacific Time, Episode 9 is still only 25% subbed on English on Viki. Episode 10 is released, but 0% subtitled. Waiting is hard! I want to watch on Viki so I can see the show on my TV. If I watch on Kissasian, I have to watch on my much smaller computer screen. First world problems…
SPOILER FOR EPISODE 10! SPOILER FOR EPISODE 10! SPOILER FOR EPISODE 10!
I just watched ep. 10. There was a lot of plot development! Yeah!
One thing I did have an issue with is right before the big kiss, MH makes a snide comment that if Dali slept with TJ, he’d probably give her $20 million rather than just $2 million. She naturally slaps him across the face then prepares to do it again, at which point he grabs her wrist and says something like, “don’t or I might not be able to control myself.” She winds up again, he grabs her and shoves her up against the wall, and kisses her. He pauses, and asks if it’s another mistake. She slightly shakes her head no, then they pursue a mutual kiss.
I’m walking through the analysis of the scenes prior, having watched them twice. I can see the mindset he might have had, and if that is the case, that comment would have a different meaning. I watched it on Kocowa, so I’m waiting for other translations, but depending on the wording, it could be that it wasn’t a slutshaming one, but he could have meant something like “since you love him so much, maybe he’ll give you the money,” because earlier scenes pointed to MH feeling jealous/hurt/betrayed/used. Of course, I could be completely wrong, so I’m interested in hearing others’ comments. That statement was so alarming, it stood out as so out of his character that it caused me pause.
@Welmaris, the subs are on dramacool.
@Skayt, MH’s comment was indeed snide and hurtful. I wonder how it will be translated on Viki. I had the same impression you did – that although he was really angry (not answering her calls when they can both see each other); furious and hurt by his family acting without his knowledge; jealous and his feelings were stung that she was apologising on Tae-Jin’s behalf; still it was a comment that was unworthy of him. Again, Dali was brave to wait for him outside of his house. And she didn’t back down after slapping him once- He was effectively saying very crudely, give me my money so I can get out of your life. I think on some level she wanted to get a reaction out of him.
So, were the ‘stamps’ simply the drugs that the nephew was smuggling in the frames? I think there’s more to it than that – or perhaps I’m missing something in the translation. I don’t think we’ll see the cousin again.
@Fern, I’m not sure what the origin of the stamps came from, but that makes sense. I’ve seen comments that maybe they were going to sell drugs at the gallery, or perhaps the drugs were placed there to get the gallery in trouble (one of the many underhanded tricks being done to weaken the gallery’s position).
I agree with the comments above regarding the insult he threw at Dal Li , it was quite crude. It would have been nice to see a scene where he apologized to her and that he was lashing out because he was hurt. I’m not a fan of scenes where the man overpowers a woman with a kiss until she submits – but it was a light kiss and he asked her before proceeding further – so I’ll give the scene a barely passing grade (grading on a curve). K-drama writers enough with the anger kissing – it is kinda icky.
This was a pivotal episode in terms of advancing the plot. I really like the OTP together. The flirty dialogue at the end was pretty cute but of course they would be interrupted. Someone on the blog correctly predicted TJ was behind the scheme. but was he behind Mr. Kim’s death? It is implied that Dali might have been adopted from the orphanage where WT and the museum assistant came from. That may explain why the druggy cousin in his twisted logic thinks he is the rightful heir.
The writing for MH is so clever. This character feels so fresh and different from what I’ve seen in other kdramas. MH’’s assistant is so good too – again a character who feels really fresh. The actress reminds me of Lucille Ball in how expressive and elastic her face is at times. I don’t know how they’re going to fill 6 more episodes, but I continue to be thoroughly entertained by this drama. Last comment: KMJ has a great speaking voice. I love to hear him – I wonder if he can sing irl.
I was lurking on the various hashtags for this drama, and not a single person at the time of my writing was commenting on that line, only the subsequent kiss. I thought I was misreading something for a second, so I’m glad to hear I wasn’t the only one who was shocked by it.
Thanks for the discussion!
Episode 10 had so much to love. This Show really gets it right in terms of plot progression, honest revelations, conflict and trust.
We get the backstory we needed about Gong Ju to explain her attitude and decisions, and I hope it means that we’ll see her coming around as a better individual.
I’m relieved that the Segi guys has proven he really is the bad guy so I can ‘hate’ him heartily and well.
More later!
At the restaurant TJ gets a call from a “Mr. Kim” – I am wondering if that is Dali’s uncle? (It’s a common last name so maybe not) Is he part of the conspiracy? (Insert theme from Carmen being whistled in a flat key here).
Title: “Do you know how to tell dogs apart from wolves at dusk?”
This reminds me of the title of another Show (totally NOT light or fluffy), The Time Between Dog and Wolf, which had, I believe, the same meaning. It’s hard to tell these two different animals apart at a certain time, and Dali has come to the point where she’s considering who the dog (who will be faithful, respectful and helpful) truly is.
Blatant Hypocrisy: It’s often the culprit of the crime who lays the blame of it onto the innocent party. TJ is the one who is engineering the land grab (by pulling on the puppet strings of Assemblyman An), but he accuses MH of doing this and pretends to be on Dali’s side. The wolf if sheep’s clothing (badly dressed at that!)
Same thing with An who’s in the middle of making his righteous speech about land rights while Dali exposes him for insider land deals.
I like how Dali thinks through both aspects of MH, recognising that although he’s crazy about money, and can be crude in speech (like in telling her to sell her organs, if necessary, to pay him back), he was sincere in his care for her.
The Surprise Kiss
MH comes out of his car without enthusiasm. He hardly looks at Dali when he speaks.
MH : “Do we still have something to talk about? I believe we’re done.” (As in he felt that Dali was on TJ’s side and they were literally done as a possible couple.) He walks off without looking at her.
Dali : “I’m sorry about today.”
He turns back, comes close and looks her in the eye.
MH : “Why would you apologise?” (As if she is an item with TJ and can apologise on his behalf?) “Did you also think I was vulgar and crude?
Dali : “No. That’s not why. He’s not the type to be rude.” (She still remembers TJ who used to be nicer. She is making excuses for a past TJ.) “I think he just got worked up because of me.” (She is taking the responsibility as if her being of special interest to TJ excuses his behaviour, but it’s more that she does not want MH to feel humiliated because TJ had been harsher towards him because of her.
However this is the wrong thing to say.) “Don’t take it to heart.”
(Her answer does not clear the air about whether she thinks MH crude or not. He still thinks that she does think him crude and vulgar. This could possibly be why he taunted her with sleeping with TJ.)
MH : “This is driving me crazy.”
Dali : “Sorry?”
MH : “Listen up, Ms Kim. Do you know what kinds of people I’ve had to put up with while working at our restaurant from the age of ten? They say you should never bother a dog when it’s eating. That’s an insult to dogs.” (As if it’s okay to bother dogs at other times, which is of course not true.) “Do you know there are people worse than dogs?”
What Jang Tae Jin did earlier? It didn’t even get to me. It wasn’t insulting at all. (He is lying here because it did get under his skin, however it did not really hurt him.) But you know what? Your waiting out here at night just to make up excuses for him. And now, you’re apologising on his behalf. Now, this is insulting to me.” (Rather it hurts him more than anything TJ had thus done.) This isn’t right.”
He walks off but Dali is not prepared to let it be since it’s far from resolved.
Dali : “Then what about you, Mr Jin? Don’t I deserve an excuse or an explanation from you?”
MH : “An excuse?”
Dali : “Why didn’t you answer your phone?”
MH : “Are you implying I did something so dirty that I need an excuse?”
Dali : “The land around the gallery and the construction company – they do look a bit suspicious.”
He goes up to Dali : “Am I obligated to report to you about the land my brother bought? Because I like you?”
(Dali is speechless. But the fact that they both know MH likes her is in the air now.)
MH : “I made myself very clear from the beginning. As long as I get my money back, I’ll stop meddling with the gallery. If you don’t believe me, bring me two million dollars now. Maybe, you can ask JTJ for the money. If you sleep with him, he might even give you 20 million dollars, not 2 million dollars.”
(He had just been asking if she thought he was vulgar and crude, believing that her answer was ‘yes’, and now out of sheer defiance is deliberately crossing the line to be vulgar and crude. He was possibly also trying to get a reaction from her.)
She slaps him and calls him a jerk.
He grabs her arm before she hits him again. “Stop it. If you don’t I might not be able to control myself.” (He’s giving her a warning.)
(There is a long pause of deliberation. This time, it’s likely that Dali wants to get a reaction from him, and to test him on making good on his warning, because she lowers her arm [and so MH lets go], but she deliberately raises her arm again, so he grabs it a second time before he kisses her against the wall.)
When he pushes her to the wall, he protected her back so that he probably hurt his own hand but did not hurt her. He looked at her for a split second before he kissed her (2 kisses!). Perhaps it was a kiss that was hard to avoid, but not impossible. I figured she could have turned her head a bit. Watched in slo-mo, there was a lag time before he kissed her, so she might have been able to avoid it somewhat. I kinda felt that she too was intentionally pushing him to react. She knew he liked her, she had originally kissed him first, and the fact he liked her was in their minds.
It looked like although she had been offended by his crude words, she weighed her options, took the action that would get a rise out of him, and so (nevertheless) accepted his advances.
@Growing Beautifully, you explained it very well. There’s not an excuse for his crude remark but there is a reason. I was also initially surprised at Dali’s restraint. I expected her to start by demanding an explanation about the land purchases rather than apologising. (Another drama might have gone that way + a break-up) Then I recalled that earlier, as soon as she saw she was going to a Dondon restaurant and that the other meeting participants had ‘cancelled’ she became wary of Tae-Jin’s intentions. She likes Moo-Hak well enough to give him an apology and equal time to explain the situation with Dondon. Also she is brave to pursue and provoke him, rather than let him walk off.
I saw on Soompi that the ratings had dropped and I’m surprised because I found these 2 episodes very energetic.
I find both characters refreshing. The angry kiss was a bit retro, though. 🤔
@Good Twin, I agree about Mr Kim. He must be Dali’s uncle.
Thanks @Fern. I felt the comment and action was out of character for MH too and decided to dissect it. That’s just my opinion, of course.
Yes, I like that Show does not waste time with misunderstandings and break-ups. It shows us that Dali is a smart person, and able to think for herself objectively.
She knows to be suspicious of TJ. When MH suggests she thinks of the people in her upper class circle who could be the mastermind behind taking over the land and gallery, her thought turned to TJ. She admits to MH on the rooftop, that the mastermind she has to fight could be closer than she thinks.
Gong Ju
I wondered what Gong Ju meant when she said: “You think you are so different from me. You and I were just randomly chosen.” It sounded as if both of them had come from an orphanage, but that Dali had been the fortunate one to have been chosen by her dad. But this is the first intimation of it.
Won Tak to Gong Ju : “Hey! Do you know what makes your kind of people disgusting? You give validity to people who say we should never help others. Those people say the nice ones are the foolish ones, and you add some credit to what they say.”
Gong Ju : “Won Tak. You’re a big shot now, aren’t you? You were nothing but a thug. How dare you lecture me just because you’re some detective now?”
Won Tak : “You belong to that dump. Why did he get you out of there?”
Gong Ju : “Hey. What did you just say? Get who out? Who got me out?”
Won Tak : “Did you actually think you got out for no reason? You were ready to kill yourself because of your debt. Do people in that dump just let you go as you wish? Do they?”
In her memory of her visit to the art gallery, after she changes her mind and does not commit suicide, Gong Ju looks at the photo on the wall of children, who are likely orphans like herself. She might have been in that photo. Won Tak had been an orphan too.
Won Tak : “He said a girl who looked devastated came to the gallery. he wanted me to look into you in case you needed help. He didn’t care how much it cost. He wanted me to take care of it without your knowledge. he said as long as a person had someone to lean on, they’d have the will to live. And he wanted to be that person.”
Gong Ju is left feeling ashamed.
Not Bluffing
LOL how MH’s assistant, Yeo Mi Ri tried to pretend that they had Pu Er or Early Grey tea in front of Dali, while MH was looking Mi Ri without comprehension. He’s such a straightforward guy, it never occurred to him to bluff while impressing Dali.
Loved the admission of MH to a drenched Dali in his office : “Anyway, you can’t be like this already. … I’ll see you once I get off work. Why couldn’t you wait? If you run through the rain and fall into my arms … and if you do that in front of my employees, you’ll make me way too happy.” He smiles and they both laugh.
I like that Dali not only went to MH’s office because she was afraid, but also to ask for his understanding. She laid all her cards on the table about what she was going to do, and he gave her his support.
MH is an honest man. He can smell the rot in the dishonest deals and decides to expose all, not just for Dali’s sake but to protect his family and business.
Assistant Yeo Mi Ri is super loyal. When warning Dali about not hurting MH, it’s so cute that her only threat of punishment is to put a curse on Dali. It’s not that she can’t russle up the calvary to scare Dali, but she only threatens a curse out of respect for MH who cares for her.
TJ is caught off guard that Dali posted the accusation herself. An Sang Tae has a plan that he whispers in TJ’s ear. In the meantime his daughter is off to see MH, who is actually his enemy.
Chak Hee is feeling very alone now that her father has been exposed. The next time we see her, she’s at Moo Hak’s door and looks like her face has been beaten up. I’m surmising that she’s been out defending her father and even got into a physical fight while doing so.
Wanting the Dog to be a bit like a Wolf
What a comfortable rooftop date Dali and MH have. Wine with crunchy instant noodles and what looks like noodle seasoning/chilli powder sounds like something I can try.
Moo Hak asks Dali to stay over at his place because he wants to be with her. I like how he says that directly without guile.
MH : “I just want to be with you. … I’m serious. I won’t try anything. I won’t even touch you. So you don’t have to worry about it.”
Dali says cheekily, but looks most innocent : “Why must I sleep over at your place if you’re not going to try anything?” (She’s saying that she’d like him to be a little bit more predatory, like a Wolf?)
MH looks transfixed with shock: “Eh?”
Dali : “Why won’t you even touch me?” (She looks like butter won’t melt in her mouth!)
MH : “What?”
Dali : “You must be quite conservative in that area.”
MH : “What? I didn’t meant it like that.”
(She goes up to rub his arm as a sign of her understanding LOL naughty girl!)
Dali : “It’s okay. We don’t have to rush. Just let me know when you are ready and comfortable. I can wait.”
(She smiles sweetly at him and walks off.)
MH : “Who said I wasn’t ready? I’m totally ready.” (He looks down LOL.)
He indicates his whole body : “Both physically and mentally.”
He’s slightly breathless : “I’m totally comfortable with it.”
He clears the table : “So we won’t have to wait.” He walks off quickly to prepare his place while Dali laughs.
So who’s the Wolf? LOL.
@Growing Beautifully, wasn’t that rooftop scene funny? But away flies their chance with the arrival of Chak Hee. By the time she has left, I’ll bet that Won-tak arrives. A comedy of timing, right? I wonder, will Won-tak will end up with Chak-hee or with Gong-ju? 😉😊
When Won-tak was speaking to Gong-Ju and said ‘you give validity to people who say we should never help others’, he almost reflected the words Tae-Jin said to Dali at the restaurant, “You must think because you treat them with good intentions, they will treat you the same.” Tae-Jin is the type of person Won-tak means, but Dali, despite her privileged upbringing is clearly not.
I enjoy this show so much. The acting by the main characters is spot on.
Did MooHak say to Dali that if she sleeps with TaeJin, TaeJin will be willing to pay even if it is 20 million, not 2 million.
What I heard was this “당장 품에 안기면” “Dang Jang Pum-e anki myeon ” and Google translated it as “if you hold me in your arms”. In the context of this scene, I believe MooHak said/meant “run to his arms” not “sleep with TaeJin”. Even when TaeJin provoked him earlier on, he kept his composure (he didn’t grab someone’s collar) so he will not insult the woman he likes by telling her to sleep with another man.
When she slaps him, I heard MooHak said “stop it, if you do it again I might make a mistake”. Here he is making a reference to their first kiss which Dali claims is a mistake. She raised her arm to try to slap him again and so he kissed her. During this kiss she made a small lip movement, she kissed him back which is why MooHak looks up and ask Dali if this time is a mistake too? To which Dali gave a very minute shake of her head and so they continue their kiss.
I think Dali wanted to tell MooHak that he is her choice when she tried to call him earlier in the day but he did not pick up her call. When MooHak hinted that he might kiss her she took the chance to push their relationship forward.
@GrowingBeautifully, thanks for your excellent analysis! I woke up this morning with the intent to break down everything leading up that scene because I wanted to understand more about the context, so I was so grateful to read your write-up instead! My analytical mind is comforted by your analysis!
The one thing that I looked into were the situations before and after this incident. It came to me that the emotions MH was feeling contradicted everything they talked about when she stayed overnight. Dali made it clear that she was not rejecting him because he was uncouth, that he was in fact quite smart. She also made it clear that her rejection was because she was too hurt, that she was definitely not interested in TJ. She did however, want to maintain, their “friendly creditor-debtor relationship.”
After the restaurant ordeal, these things got challenged. Dali’s actions implied she did think he was distasteful, and that there were still tender/positive feelings between her and TJ. MH also snaps back that he doesn’t owe Dali an explanation about his company’s business dealings, which is the same thing he told TJ, but with Dali, he added “just because I like you.” To me, this felt like he thought he was being taken advantage of via their “friendly creditor-debtor relationship.” Later on, when his secretary delivers the landowner information personally to Dali, she tells Dali that she better not take this information and dump him later, or else she’ll put a curse on her. I think from being his secretary, she understands his vulnerabilities and that the possiblity that he was being taken advantage of was a real concern.
I really appreciate reading everyone’s thoughts on the subject. It really helps to put that shocking comment into perspective. The scenes were necessary plot-wise to get them to address so much unsaid feelings, but also to get the storyline to the next level so they’re both working together with each other’s full knowledge.
Thanks @Feifei. It’s great if you could catch the actual words, since the subs might be inaccurate. I’d like to think that MH wasn’t as harsh and as crude as the subs made him out to be…
My guess as to why she was trying to call MH earlier was that she wanted to assure him that she was not prejudiced against him ie she was not stuck on TJ. His restaurant staff had put a romantic spin on her lunch with TJ, and she knew that it probably looked that way to MH, and so she wanted to disabuse him of this.
Thanks, @Feifei, for this. I’ll have to remember this point when I do the write-up for Ep 9 (or is it 10?)
and hahaha — are you doing kiss analysis, too? Welcome to the team!
You’re welcome @Skayt and thanks for your insight.
Yes, you’re right to take into consideration the before and after of significant scenes. MH and Dali had just come to some understanding of where they were with each other and where Dali was not, with TJ. Therefore his reaction of avoiding her calls and not wanting to meet her that night, especially to speak about TJ not being that rude normally… was very understandable. He was wondering if everything they’d said the previous night had evaporated when TJ was on the scene, and he was angry that he had to see them together at what looked like a romantic lunch.
I felt that they were both provoking each other on purpose. She wanted him to respond to her because he’d intentionally ignored her calls, and she was afraid that he misunderstood her being with TJ. I agree … he wanted her to prove that just because he likes her, she was not taking advantage of him. You’re right that he added that part ‘because I like you’ and it was this that was a concern of his.
He used provocative language and then waited to see if she rejected him. Instead of walking away, she retaliated, and even after a warning, she didn’t leave. So he took the next step and found the answer he was looking for when she accepted the ‘almost forced’ kiss.
@PM3, it is episode 10 and I am still a noob at kiss analysis but would love to join the team nonetheless.
@GB, we were not told the reason for her call attempt but shown flash backs instead so your guess on why Dali called MooHak is possible too.
Just saw the Viki sub. It translates that line to “He looked ready to hand over 20 billion, not 2 billion, if you hand yourself over to him.”
@Skayt, the Viki subs of the entire scene seemed better. Him saying I might make a “mistake” instead of “can’t control myself” (I hate this line in K dramas – yes yes you can always control yourself Naughtysaurus nothwithstanding) makes a lot more sense. He was basically telling her he was going to kiss her. I suspect the “hand yourself over to him” also implies sleeping with him but reads a lot less crude.
@Feifei @Skayt @GB @packmule3
I watched Ep9 in Mandarin subtitle. And it was like Feifei had mentioned
1. Mk asked why don’t you just run to TJ’s arm
2. Stop now, or I’ll make a mistake(실수).
My guess is the second slap that Dali intended to give is asking for a kiss. And so MK gave it.
One of the most important things that I have learned here is to watch kiss scenes carefully. Still learning! Love to know other analysis!
The subs are all over the place aren’t they.
Episode 9/10
Dali is on her way to return the backpack to Moo Hak. She saw him hugging Chak Hee, she stopped moving towards them and brought the backpack to the back of her leg. The next moment she was walking alone without the backpack, she mumbled to herself “Who was I bluffing?” (another site translated it as “Who was I fooling?”) at the traffic light before the call from Tae Jin came in.
So who was she fooling? I recalled that she had a conversation with Moo Hak after he woke her up from her nightmare. She apologised for the “mistake” she made that day and thank him for his feelings towards her but she could not accept his feelings for her. She realised that she was fooling herself after watching Moo Hak hug Chak Hee. She realised that she had accepted his feelings for her but she has yet to tell him that.
During the lunch with Tae Jin whenever Tae Jin associates negative traits to Moo Hak, Dali view those traits positively instead. She had this smile on her face until the land acquisition part. This piece of news is unexpected, and she needs time to process it which she did after they left the restaurant.
About Gong Ju, what is her relationship with Kim Shi Hyeong? Why is she helping him?
@Kuroshio, he was gentle when he said he might make a mistake. He didn’t sound angry to me at all despite a long hard day that he went through, in fact he looks a little defeated to me when he let go of her hand. He had a long day from work in the morning, meeting Chak Hee, visiting the restaurant, the encounter with Tae Jin and verifying the land acquisition with his father and lastly with Dali. He was upset though that Dali is speaking up for Tae Jin and apologizing on his behalf, if an apology was to come it has to come from Tae Jin not Dali.
Thanks @Skayt, @Kuroshio, @Feifei, your research and observations contribute more information on the nuances of that troubling scene. True BODers LOL.
I feel that we have now come more or less to an agreement that what Moo Hak did, although externally appearing boorish, crude, exploitative? was perhaps, from Dali’s view, the reaction that she wanted to get, and that he was actually gentle while quite aggrieved by her.
@Feifei, I guess to the question that Dali asked herself as to “Who was I fooling?” there are 2 possible interpretations.
1) She thought that Moo Hak really liked her, but she sees that he is not rejecting Chak Hee, and therefore she feels she has fooled herself into believing he likes only her.
2) The other interpretation is what you wrote… she had fooled herself and Moo Hak into thinking that she was not able to accept his feelings, but she already had. Seeing Chak Hee there made her aware that she was jealous and upset.
I wonder what she did with his backpack. 😉
Thank you @GB, with your added perspective I now understand why the subs in Chinese translated it as “Who am I?” instead of “Who was I fooling?”. It could mean that Dali realized that she is not the only person whom MH likes, she is just one of the many or one of his past likes. In the same conversation, MH did say that they will go back to the friendly creditor and debtor status.
I wonder about the backpack too and that very expensive watch (it is still not making an appearance.)
@FeiFei Thank you for translating the line that preceded the slap! Really shifts my perception of the scene
@Good Twin I didn’t interpret that bit as Da Li potentially being adopted. I think it’s more about the idea that our lot in life is purely up to chance. The family you are born into, the parents who raise you… these are things that are pure luck. And along that line, Da Li could’ve easily been born into Gong Ju’s life circumstances and vice versa.
The way that Da Li’s father treated Da Li seemed pretty distinct to how he treats his other ‘children’.
I’ve finally gotten the time to join this discussion after watching both episodes. Thanks, all, for your wonderful analyses!
I agree that MooHak’s words to Dali before the kiss were meant to provoke her. I personally have been in a situation when someone accused me of being angry when I was controlling myself. My response was to say, “Angry? This isn’t me being angry. But if you want to see me angry, here it is!” And I let that person have it (verbally, unfiltered, at much higher decibels). MooHak gave Dali a glimpse of the tough personna he’d developed as a survival mechanism. Remember, MooHak has often bragged about himself as the fighter of (neighborhood I can’t recall). We got a little information about why MooHak had to put up such a front, having to deal with rough people since the age of 10 (after his mother died). So if TJ thinks he’s crude, and if Dali agrees with TJ, well here’s a sample. Can you deal with it, Dali? But I’d rather MooHak’s words in Korean referred to Dali running to TJ’s arms, rather than prostituting herself to save the art museum.
Earlier Dali had called MooHak wise. I would agree with that. Moohak may not be highly educated, but he’s got street smarts and wisdom…and not all people who are educated are wise. I like that he clearly states his mind and his motives.
Whatever Dali’s cousin and Assemblyman An have been looking for, I don’t think it has been described by the drama itself as a stamp or stamps: I think that was speculation by commentators. I can see why stamps might come to mind, because if someone had Director Kim Nak Cheon’s stamp, they could make the sale of Cheongsong Art Museum look legal. Dali’s cousin did say in a phone call with Assemblyman An something along the lines of, “It’s not like someone’s name is on it.” I can’t recall his exact words, but the implication is that whatever they were looking for so desperately might not point directly to them. Dali’s cousin also voiced worry that Dali might have thrown away what they were looking for if she found it, and I doubt she would have thrown away her father’s stamp. I think what Dali’s cousin was looking for was a drug shipment coming in with the artwork from New York. Someone phoned Director Kim Nak Cheon with a tip, and he found the packet of drugs hidden behind a framed picture. I believe he put the drugs in Dali’s art transport tube while he was giving his nephew a chance to turn himself in and confess to his role in drug smuggling. What Director Kim Nak Cheon didn’t anticipate is that his nephew was just small fry in the drug smuggling operation, and that he would die of shock when he saw who the kingpin is.
I am glad that MooHak turned over to Dali all his assistant’s research on the land transactions around the Cheongsong Art Museum. It is a move that earned Dali’s trust, despite Dondon F & B being a buyer of some of the land. And I believe MooHak when he says part of his motivation for disclosing his company’s role in insider trading is to ultimately protect his father and stepbrother. They are in over their heads, and MooHak senses it. If they continue unchecked, they’ll bring down their whole company.
I’m also relieved that Dali did not hesitate to turn over the discovered illegal drugs to the authorities. That’s a good example, and seems a fresh turn for a Kdrama. I’m glad this show avoided the “I’ll figure it out myself” trope. Even if finding drugs in the museum, in one of her own possessions, might reflect badly on the museum or her personally, it could be far worse if she hung onto them and they were found by someone else. She’s on the right side of the law, which gives strength to her position.
As for museum employee Na Gong Ju working for Dali’s cousin, doing his dirty work, I think he threatened her with revealing her background to the other museum employees. Curator Song knew there were inconsistencies in Gong Ju’s background records, but since Director Kim Nak Cheon vouched for her, she didn’t dig further. I think Gong Ju did have natural talent for her job, and did it well despite not having valid credentials. I also think Gong Ju liked her job at the museum. That is why she was vulnerable to blackmail, because she didn’t want to go back to her old way of life. But when Gong Ju reached her limit of being pushed to do unsavory activities by Kim Shi Hyeong, she eliminated his leverage over her by quitting her job. I hope the story arc for her character includes her being valued for the work she has proven she can do, and that she can work at the museum again wholeheartedly, without fear. I think she’d be a valuable asset to the museum, despite being pushed off track for awhile.
As for the kiss…previous comments have covered it well. I agree that having a physically stronger male overpower a female in order to kiss her is not sexy, but abusive; however, it seems this drama was careful to not cross that line. What we saw was more along the lines of, but not going as far as, makeup sex. Look it up, if you don’t know about makeup sex. Here’s one line from the short Wikipedia article: “After conflict during a relationship, arousal transfer may occur which shifts anger into arousal.” Sounds like what we saw, no? For both parties.
Good to have you here @Welmaris! Yes, you’ve got it all put together for us. Thanks!
I also want and expect Gong Ju to return to the Museum, without the shadow of her past to haunt her, and to be valued and happy.
It’s true that this drama has the rare and refreshing ‘reveal all clearly’ and ‘do the right thing’ by its main characters, that is such a relief to see. I actually do not recall every seeing something like this in both main characters of a Show in all my kdrama watching. What they’ve done is to come clean, which puts them above the possibility of being blackmailed over the drugs. I hope this earns the respect of the public and staff, although I’m sure those affected will not be reacting positively about it.
@Welmaris, I’m also so glad that Dali turned over the drugs rather than try and figure everything out. (Hey, it helps having a friend on the force!) It also means there won’t be time wasted on the plot with the hand-wringing, wondering what to do, what to do?”
I was a little surprised that Goon Ju didn’t recognize she had been given preferential treatment, but perhaps she didn’t realize how she looked when she went in to the impromptu interview? She also harbored a lot of bitterness, but likely that surfaced when she was in a safe place where she felt free to express her deeper hurts? Whatever reason, I like seeing character development from her.
@Skayt, so true about people allowing bad attitude to surface when they feel safe. Parents will recognize that behavior: children that are quiet and compliant in school coming home and taking out their stress on family. Many times raising my girls I had to remind myself that I was the lucky recipient of their foul moods because deep inside they trusted my love for them. As for Gong Ju, she trusted the previous director, but Dali became an unknown factor in her safe place (safe when the nephew/cousin wasn’t around). And Gong Ju was blinded by jealousy and prejudice in regard to Dali, only perceiving privilege and not seeing Dali’s losses, sacrifices, and struggles.
Gong Ju was a victim of predatory lending, unable on her own to get out from under her debt no matter how much she paid back. It made her feel so hopeless she wanted to kill herself. The cousin also owes money to loan sharks, I suspect the same ones who oppressed Gong Ju. Her debt was cleared by Director Kim Nak Cheon, but she didn’t know that. She probably feared they’d find her and resume hassling her, turning her much-improved life into a nightmare again. That was another weakness of hers the nephew/cousin could exploit to pressure her to do his dirty work.
What do you want to bet that TJ has a connection to the loan sharks? He wouldn’t sully his hands with direct supervision of their operations, but maybe he bankrolls them so he can use them as his goon squad. Remember how he threatened MooHak with crushing DonDon? He must have past experience destroying people’s livelihoods.
Here’s a recipe for gamjatang, if anyone wants to give it a try. The recipe is in U.S. measurements, so it’ll have to be converted to metric or imperial by those of you who use those systems.
https://www.koreanbapsang.com/gamjatang-spicy-pork-bone-stew/
Annyeong,
Enjoyed this 2 episodes because we got a few confirmations/revelations:
1. our OTP are in the same page regarding their mutual feelings leading to a passionate kiss; moving from sleepover to sleeping together. oh but wait, that will not happen per preview. darn. 💔
2. TaeJin is our top bad guy 😡 augh! we knew that, didn’t we?
3. Drugs is what the cousin and GongJu are after. i agree with those who wish that Gongju will redeem herself and return fulfilled and not defeated. she will have a resurrection, better than before, knowing now that the Director played a major part in giving her a new life.
yes, love our OTP moments:
1. embrace in the rain
2. kiss with a force *make up sex per @Welmaris
3. rooftop date with champagne and dry ramyeon. interesting pairing by Moohak. must be good 🍷
even though Dali did not feel ready to enter into a relationship in Ep 9, what a turn around in Ep 10 when she’s the one that’s more ready to be taken to bed by our Moohak Hero. it was hilarious seeing him run around trying to prepare everything for their first night together. 🤣
so glad to see her over TJ. go Team D&M.