I’m opening this thread early so we don’t forget its premiere on Netflix this Saturday.
So, who’s watching with me?
I just hope the Hong sisters will give us an finale where the lovers don’t:
A. die (like in “Hong Gil Dong”)
B. separate (like in “Hwayugi”)
C. don’t end up together (like in “Hotel del Luna”)
D. give us a depression.
Seriously, I just want a happy ending or I’ll cross the Hong sisters off my Must-Watch List.
Let’s enjoy the show!
I will give it a try mostly because of Lee Jae Wook.
I need to drink 2 bottle of whysky in a row to forget the spoiler about other dramas you mentioned and I didn’t watched yet.
Kalimera @Packmule3!
I do hope the same. Hong Sisters don’t sit well with me.
@WE let’s drink later on, it is too early in the morning, for our part of the world!
I am not into whiskey though… 😊
@Wenchanteur 🥴🤣
Yes, please let the ending be as satisfying as the voyage to get there.
@WE 😂😂😂😂😂
Yes @pm 3, their endings are depressing. Some people thought sad endings linger longer but it really tires me out lately. Let’s hope after Hotel del Luna they will give us a clear cut happy ending. It’s about time.
@Viva, it depends… I liked a lot of previous Hong’s dramas, except HDL second part. The ending itself wasn’t that depressing, but rather the long agony of several episodes without a real plot, just waiting all these ghosts go the bridge while dealing with “ghost of the week” cases. Less and less comedy + random folkloric stuff + long scenes with colored light on a tree and stares and sighs. It was rather a relieving ending (that the drama ends!). Hong sisters can make die the whole cast of Alchemy of Souls, if the drama isn’t boring before with a good plot, high chances that’s will be a moving and intense end. What are my favorite endings.
Which is to say… I felt that in HDL, writers’ styles just got “goblinized”. Which is also a good reason to cross them off my list. But at least I’ll watch the first few episodes of anything they do, because all their dramas have good first episodes.
Thank you for the reminder, @pkml3 … I will attempt to watch this.
LOL @WE… everyone in the cast can die as long as the ride was fun?
@GB, if it fits the story and makes it intense, yeah (but not low emotions and meaningless deaths). Look at the last part of Moon Lovers, it was great.
Not a lot of dramas do that nowadays, by I remember this antic “Nine Tailed Fox” from 2004. All characters die, except the male lead. I was in shock!!!
As a generality, I don’t care about the ending. What matters first is the whole drama. Then, get the best ending with that, sad or happy, writer choice. Just I prefer the ending with the most emotion. Some happy ending where “all roll” are not good, and just give the feeling of a pre-formatted conclusion. (Military Doberman for example). I even prefer striking open ending than that (MOTA one!), or weird ending almost unexplainable but with good emotion (Sisyphus!).
Annyeong 🌼
Yes, thanks for the reminder @PM3. I am in.
@WEchanteur – that’s funny **2 bottles of whiskey. I am more into *martinis 🍸 *social drinker here.
Yea @PM3 **spoiler alert** endings haha. I have to check out Hong Gil-dong though. If it’s in VIki that is. hmmm. i am a JKS fan (Love Rain).
Happy Friday Eve, BOD’s
@WE true true. I like both MOTA and Sisyphus endings even though it is not clear cut happy endings. It’s OK to have emotional endings like Sisyphus as I felt it fits the logic of that story. I didn’t feel my emotions were wasted. I also thought the MOTA ending was well done. Both shows have planted enough logic throughout the story for us to interpret the ending.
What I hope not to see is to get us cry for the sake of getting us cry. Or opening endings without enough logics or character patterns to work out the projection.
Good insight on Hong sisters’ style – I will revise my expectation to avoid disappointment.
Kalispera,
I just finished watching Episode 1.
It starts with a bang and we are going to see how this will go.
More when most of you start commenting…
Just finished Episode 1. A lot of world building/exposition, but I was able to follow. I am curious about what happened in the past and what is going to happen next, so I will continue watching. Plus, I can’t say no to long-haired sword-wielding Lee Jae Wook.
A slow start. The Hong sisters made better first episodes.
The first 16 minutes. Lots of CGI and money on screen, it’s spectacular. But also noisy, empty and rather boring. It sets up a couple of things to establish the universe and the birth of Jang Wook. The mage is pretty silly to agree to the soul swap. It smelled bad from the beginning. But if he don’t, well, we don’t know the concept, so…
🤨😐😑 (my faces when watching this part)
It gets more interesting when Mu Deok Yi takes over the weak body. With a little bit of comedy. When we realize at the end that Jang Wook knew all along about her eyes… we wonder why all the time with housework. Or was it to help her strengthen her body? Good thing is we have the two characters main goals.
A thing I didn’t like: two actors with idol heads and kpop hair. 😖
@Wenchanteur, I was perplexed with the Jang Kang’s hair as well. The king had fantasy hair but the 1st mage looked like he was going to a wedding shoot. When I saw the summer and autumn mages, I was actually laughing. At least Jang Wook has a proper hairstyle.
My many questions – perhaps you or someone can help me:
So the king wanted the soul swap just to beget an heir?
The woman Do-hwa didn’t seem unwilling. Who was she, and what was she to the King and to Jang Kang to make him so upset?
And if the king begat an heir whilst looking like the mage, how could he claim that heir? The written message seems insufficient proof and the DNA wouldn’t match. 🤓😆
Did the king’s frail body last the 7 days in order to swap back? I was a bit confused about that. In ‘real’ time Jang Kang doesn’t want Jang Wook to have training to be a mage, so the swap back must have happened?
Does Jang K not want Jang W to be trained because he doesn’t consider Jang W to be his son or because of something about the woman?
If a soul-shifter starts to need human energy to survive, then both the king, Jang Kang and Seo Yool (Mu Deok) need that or they will start to change to rock.
The gisaeng acts as Greek chorus to explain the Four Seasons of Daeho who are powerful customers and children of the strongest mage families. Jin (Spring), Park (Summer), Seo (Autumm), Jang (Winter). Is Seo Yool part of the Seo family?
If so, how did she become an assassin and how did she learn how to do the forbidden shape shifting magic being developed by Jang Kang at the beginning of the episode.
@Fern, I feel like a lot of your questions are mysteries and there are no answers yet. I’d have to revisit the episode but I don’t have the patience. Maybe Pm3 will have some answers.
We didn’t see the King. Rather strange. The soul exchange is supposed to last 7 days, but what happens if the king’s body dies? Is the king trapped in the magician’s body? But in this case, the king does not know magic. And so he cannot teach it to Jang W.
Regarding the human energy to survive as a soul exchange. Apparently, this does not seem to be systematic. We can bet that Mu Deok Yi is not likely to change into rock, because:
– The soul exchange happened in a strange way. Mu Deok was not targeted. It is as if Mu Deok hijacked the process to be targeted instead of the other woman.
– Then, the slayer observes that she is not blind when she should be.
– The slayer observes that she does not have a blue mark when she should.
So Mu Deok Yi is not an ordinary person and there is a mystery about her.
We don’t know what happened to the real Mu Deok Yi. In theory, after the soul exchange, the body of the slayer is dead. So the real Mu Deok Yi should be dead. This is strange.
I don’t remember if we have information about some important rules of the process. Such as:
– Once the souls are exchanged, can the mage practice magic in his new body?
According to the slayer, this is not possible, and she needs to get her sword back to do so.
Swords have an importance in the development of the mages’ powers. As a teenager, Jang W must draw his sword to activate his learning ability.
@Fern, the birth story of Jang W is straight out of King Arthur legend. I am also curious why the king went into so much effort (using forbidden magic) to beget an heir he could not claim. Maybe later, in King Arthur style, Jang W will discover his true identity/destiny.
The assassin’s name is Naksu. Seo Yul is the Autumn guy, heir to the Seo family. He and Naksu seem to have childhood connection.
It looks like Naksu lost her family and was trained by some kind of sect to exact revenge on the mages and their offspring. The said sect seems to have develop the soul-shifting technique. I call them The Sith Lords😀
Also where is Jang K? We saw him at the beginning of the episode, but did not see him with young adult Jang W.
Thanks @WEnchanteur. You have answered some of my questions.
I wondered if Seo Yool had been mortally wounded, which another reason why she quickly looked for another body. Once swapped, her body with the real Deok-yi’s soul, died. But I agree that Deok Yi must have been special for a reason beyond her blindness.
@Wenchanteur, if this was a normal drama, the King would have taken Jang Kang’s body for the long term and not held onto the 7 days promise. Really, how gullible was that magician? He could have said no at any point and denied the ability to do the soul shifting — or thought of something else to save himself. But it’s the way the story begins and how our hero is conceived after all, as you say.
@snowflower, well done for thinking of the King Arthur legend. (Even though the scientific part of my brain says Jang W can’t be the king’s son since his genetic material would be from the mage’s body.)
Thank you for correcting the name of Naksu. It seems to be an alias she has taken, but still I misread the casting list. Please forget that question about the Seo family. Yes, it looks like Seo Yul and Naksu knew each other as children.
I’m going to watch episode 2. I’m not hooked by the drama, but if I were to put myself in Pm3’s shoes, there’s enough to do an article! A lot of information scattered everywhere. I wouldn’t go as far as to say that it’s messy, because the order of the scenes has a certain logic. But there is nevertheless the impression that it is all over the place. I feel like I’ve missed a lot of details that could make sense.
I just watched Episode 2.
Jang Uk was banned from magic because his father mage Jang was mad to the King for what he did to his wife.
It is mage Jang’s mistake that he agreed to body swap with the King. Seriously when I saw that scene in Episode 1, I knew that things would go awful. Technically, she didn’t cheat, she couldn’t have known that at that time he was not her husband, or bethroded, but the soul of the King in the mage’s body.
After Do Hwa gave birth to Uk, she died. The Mage Jang kinda cursed his infant “son”, aka he blocked his energy channel, in order to be frail and not to do magic.
So, for his unforgiving mistake, Mage Jang decided to punish the infant.
Whoa! You are an awful man Jang! Even if you felt that your action was justified, because you were angry at the king and had regrets that your wife died, the boy is innocent.
Yes, @Fern, Jang Un has his father genetic material and some soul remnants from the King. If you watch Episode 2 with that dog ghost you will understand.
Jang Uk and Mu-Deok / Naksu are connected beyond the Master – Pupil bond. It is their fate, since is what his father said in the very beginning. She is the one who broke down the curse.
So far, Lee Jae-Wook and Jung So-Min are pretty good in their roles.
I am going to stick around for now.
Thank you, @Cleopatra. That explains some of my questions. I didn’t know that Jang Uk’s mother was also Jang Kang’s wife. I thought that she could have been anyone of importance to him.
Kalispera dear @Fern!
I think they were bethroded, hence his pain when mage Jang found out the King’s ploy. It was his fault being that naive. The King wanted DoHwa for himself, so in a way, he raped DoHwa.
For me, the mother and Jang UK are casualties in the body swap thingy…
@Fern,
I wrote to you before but It hasn’t showed up…
Anyway, I also found this map on MDL…
https://twitter.com/Korean___Dramas/status/1537389728659427333?s=20&t=-4DhAL4OiCG2crr8Mh3NRw
@Cleopatra, thank you for the relationships map. That will be helpful for names. What a convoluted group of characters!
I like the leads very much. The direction style isn’t very subtle – the music is telling us how to feel at any moment and I was laughing during the dog ghost scene because Jang Uk looked at Moo Deok every time someone said ‘Soul Shifter’ or anything about it. Any one looking at him would have noticed.
Towards the end of Episode 1, when Jang Uk showed up to find Moo Deok in Songrim, how did he enter if she had his passkey?
@Fern: background music are horrible. I feel like watching a disney or spielberg movie. The kind of noisy mind-numbing auditive horror from any failed and boring western blockuster.
@Wenchanteur, I was thinking Disney x Eurovision. It makes the show seems as though it is geared towards a young Western audience. But then, sometimes I hear modern music in historical K and C-dramas, even as the opening music during the titles. That’s jarring to me as well.
Kalimera @Fern,
Yes, there are so many characters in this one. Also, I saw on MDL that it will be 20 episodes long.
Kalimera, @Cleopatra. 20 episodes. No wonder netizens are comparing it to Chinese epics. That’s interesting because I thought the trend was going towards shorter dramas.
@Fern,
If I remember correctly, Hong Sisters are preferring such long dramas. “A Korean Odyssey: has the same format. Only in “Hotel De La Luna” they chose to write 16 episodes.
Episode 2.
Except for the BGM, it’s an almost perfect episode. Quite the idea I had of the quality of the Hong sisters. Towards the end of the episode, there is an adrenaline rush, with a dramatic intensity that gives hope that this drama is going to be good.
One detail I didn’t understand: MD says “it needs two people to open your inner magic gate”. And finally, there is only one person who does it.
Last news: Netflix published a note saying the drama should be extended to 20 episodes.
ARGH! Misstype… Extended to 30 episodes!
@WE WHAT?????????????????? 30 episodes 😮
@cleo,
The situation is unclear at this time. This comes from the fact that Netflix says 30 episodes:
https://uk.newonnetflix.info/info/81517188
This could be a mistake, but on the other hand, the director indicates that 20 episodes are not enough and that the Hong sisters are writing the sequel:
https://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20220615000732
I don’t know how this will end. Two seasons? One season extended to 30? Or more?
@WE,
I am not allowed to open the uk site of Netflix…Bummer on ours it doesn’t say anything yet!
Dunno what to tell you… 🙁
@cleo, I take this “30 episodes” thing as a mistake so.
However, here from the interview:
*****************************************
Director Park pointed out that his upcoming series will feature the first part of the story, with a second part in the works already.
“When Hong sisters were writing the script, we discussed so many interesting stories about different families, characters and their development. Unfortunately, I thought 20 episodes would not be enough to really show the strengths of the scriptwriters who create very entertaining and comical stories,” the director said.
“The scriptwriters are currently working on part two as well. Hopefully, we will have more time to explore each individual character in detail,” Park added.
*****************************************
It looks more like a Season 2.
Or, as I don’t like seasons, a classic historical kdrama with many episodes (>24), with maybe a kind of closure and a new hook at the end of the 20 episodes.
What?! 30 episodes?!
What’s this? A cdrama? Ugh. 😵💫
@WE,
I read that part when you gave me the link. I don’t know. I don’t like things to drag…If they are going to do a season 2, I would like them, to have another story to explore. That’s my opinion though.
Hi @Cleo and @WE,
I am not yet watching this, and I’m not sure that I will start. Even if I do, it will be later. Somehow the comments I read here do not enthuse me very much.
Another friend of mine who looks up news on shows told me: “Some Chinese netizens are upset that Netflix kdrama “Alchemy of Souls” by Hong sisters “stole” the Chinese Xianxia concept, elements and designs, from the cdramas, “The Untamed”, “Ashes of Love” and so on….” Can you tell if this Show is venturing into ‘Chinese drama style Xianxia’?
In case anyone is not too familiar with it… here’s a link to Wikipedia on Xianxia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xianxia_(genre)
Hey @GB Unnie!
I read on MDL something about the Chinese concept, but they said it has more western parts. I am not sure if they call it xianxia. I have to check again for that comment I have read.
I haven’t watched any of these shows, although I know that they are famous for their stories. Still, as our great poet Seferis said once: “in art there is no parthenogenesis”.
The show draws you in for now. I cannot say much since I have watched only the first two episodes.
Hi @Cleo, thanks for getting back to me on this Show. I’ll wait for more comments, your review and other reviews to know if I want to watch this. It seems I still have lots to do and no real break, so I may reduce stress by watching things I don’t need to comment on or I won’t watch much.
Take care and enjoy yourself!
@GB Unnie,
In AoS, there are no gods, or immortals.
There are mages, 4 powerful mage clans and souls swapping.
From wikipedia: “It in a fictional country called Daeho that does not exist in history or on maps, Alchemy of Souls is about the love and growth of young magicians as they overcome their twisted fates.”
@GB Unnie,
I really understand you. I am waiting for the last two episodes of Bloody Heart tonight and tomorrow, so my ongoing list to narrow down…
Take care and enjoy yourself as well! We will talk!
On Wednesday I want to see what it will happen to KISS!
@Cleo, I agree with your poet Seferis. This seems like a new style that is a blend of several things. As you point out, it’s said *very specifically* to be in an imaginary country set in the past. Personally, I don’t mind cross-pollination in art and music. How would they evolve otherwise? It would go in an almost straight line with few variations. If it refers in some ways to a Chinese concept, the C-netizens should feel flattered that their art form is revered enough to be imitated.
I’m aware of the tensions existing between the cultures, and if the Hong Sisters are indeed influenced by Xianxia style, they might not be able to express it until the drama is over without fear of censor.
Dear @Fern,
I agree with you in your comment. I think some are waiting by the corner, for some to make a mistake. The thing is in fiction there is not mistake at all.
Hi @Cleo
– I’m only trying to keep up with ‘Link’ and ‘Kiss’.
– We still have ‘W’.
– Our Wednesday leisurely rewatch is, I guess, on hiatus for a while? Until someone suggests something that a few want to watch roughly at the same time? 🙂
Hi Everyone
Notice for Next Rewatch Party
@pkml3, if you don’t mind us continuing to camp out here on your blog on Saturday nights …
I was suggesting that we put down shows in the ‘W’ Ep 14 thread that we would like to have votes for, for the next Rewatch Party. @WE has put in a nice long list with re-watch values. I’ll maybe streamline it a bit so that we can vote.
Deadline for adding more titles to the ‘W’ Ep 14 thread is Sunday 26 June 2022.
After 26 June, we vote by putting our names next to the show that we don’t mind re-watching.
If we get a tie (or many ties) I’ll literally draw lots for 1 Show. LOL.
Add the titles you want to rewatch here … https://bitchesoverdramas.com/2022/06/17/w-two-worlds-ep-14-rewatch-sat-jun-18/
@GB, apparently, it’s even worse than that. There is a controversy about plagiarism of a Chinese drama. And even, the Hong sisters are accused of plagiarism for other dramas. So, people are going to fight all over the internet. lol!!! Get out the popcorn bag. 🍟
However (my opinion), this kind of thing only makes sense if there is a court case. The law is specific on this subject. Otherwise, it is “borrowed” ideas. And anyone can borrow ideas from anywhere, that’s the way it’s always been. What makes quality is not a few ideas but the execution, the writing. And if we go that way, Chinese dramas also borrow a lot of things from Koreans.
Sorry. Just read this, @GB. I’ll open a different thread for you folks to discuss this. It’ll be easier than scrolling through all the comments. Just give me a few minutes. 🙂
I am enjoying AoS. There are some parts where it’s too much of an “idol” drama, trying to get the younger generation’s viewership, but at least there many more parts that is normal drama, trying to tell the story. The first scene of episode one had Yeom Hye-ran (doing a cameo) of the woman in the rain, mother of the dead body/soul shifter. I was sad to see her character end so quickly.
I can’t find the comment that I thought another BoDer wrote about the show having some elements of King Arthur and Merlin. At the end of episode 2, with the introduction of the current king’s son, I wonder if there will be a “who is the rightful heir to the throne” storyline?
This show is no where near xian-xia material. Xian-xia is about immortals/gods who live for thousands of years but act like teenagers, constantly immature and in angst for some love. Xian-xia incorpates a lot of Daoist mysticism, where nature spirts e.g. water, tree, fox, flower spirts can cultivate and become human-form gods. I see this show more on the Harry Potter side, with reference of the four houses named after the four great wizards and witches. When we are shown the force-field of Songrim, I was reminded of the battle for Hogwarts in the Deathly Hallows, part II movie.
The parts that bother me are the lazy glossing over some consequential actions.
1) Naksu takes over the blind girl’s body. Does this mean that the blind girl’s soul is dead? Or, is it a co-habitant with Naksu’s soul and Naksu’s soul is the more dominant one now?
2) Uk is your biological son, Jang Kang! Both Uk and Do-hwa are innocent to your consequential choice of body swapping.
3) When Uk broke the Gwigu and the scene was so glib about it. I take that object as a Horcrux object such as Gryffindor’s sword, priceless, holds a lot of power and irreplaceable.
I think I must have blocked out the music. It hasn’t bothered me, nor has it moved me.
Kalimera @GB Unnie!
We need to decide on a title for our Wednesday leisurely rewatch.
I have a hectic week, let me think about it some…
Hi @Cleo, yes, my week is still hectic too… and not sure if this is going to extend into the following weeks. I just feel pretty tied up and not in a state of mind to watch or rewatch much.
I will try to watch Link Episode 5. What day did it air? Yesterday?
@GB Unnie,
I totally understand. Just do whatever makes you happy!
Yes, it aired yesterday. It was a nice episode. Come to our “Link” thread. We are discussing it with @nrllee!
@pkml3… I just realised that my comment (the long one I posted several hours ago) is still awaiting moderation. Please check when you have a chance.
@Fan of TKEM, I made the King Arthur comment earlier while discussing the birth of Jang Wook. I got more Arthurian vibes from Episode 2 as well. Lady in a lake, holding a sword? Check! The hero can use the sword only when his energy is freed? Check again! It seems like JW’s father does not acknowledge his son as his own. Does that mean that JW has a claim on the throne as the previous king’s son?
I agree with you about the Harry Potter vibes. I am still not sure who belongs to which house. I find the character chart very useful.
As for the music, I liked the parts played by traditional instruments. They sounded like real people were playing. The orchestral parts sounded like a computer was playing the score, but I could be wrong.
So far, I am not bored or confused by this show, so I will continue watching.
@Snow Flower, I liked the traditional instruments as well. Otherwise, the orchestral score sounded generic to me.
I watched all of episode 1 and half of episode 2 and I’m just not feeling it. It feels a little over-produced, though maybe that’s because they had a big CGI budget and they blew most of it in the first episode. Perhaps it will calm down in the next couple of episodes and the story will begin to draw me in. Right now there isn’t a single character that I’m rooting for or have any kind of affinity towards.
Also, I’ve liked Lee Jae Wook in other projects, but here his boyish smirk doesn’t work so well. There are moments when he should be serious yet his mouth still seemed to be almost breaking into a smile.
@Snow Flower – Thanks! I didn’t think about the lady of the lake! Ohhh.. I’m looking forward to tomorrow’s episode!
Annyeong 🌼 BOD’erz
Enjoying the show.
the CGI is cool.
that king is clever. and Jang Kang and wife was was used *sad to produced an heir. what???
i feel bad for Jang Uk coz he was abandoned at birth and always kicked out of Songrim like he never belonged. i feel his pain.
it’s amazing *fate that he saw his master in the eyes of naksu/Mu-deok. the eyes are a window to one’s soul and Uk saw hers immediately – and through her fighting moves.
Uk and Mu-deok has each other coz nobody has ever risked their lives for them. they are each other’s life savers 💗 i like how Uk wants to protect Mu-deok by making her eyes less conspicuous by covering them and by giving her the drop.
Uk uses his mischievousness *trouble maker character to his benefit… esp when he broke the heirloom vase to save Mu-deok. i was laughing! it’s like OOPS did i do that?
Hi Packmule, how may I access the protected posts on ur site? I am going to start watching Alchemy of souls soon and badly need your analysis to help me through it. 🙂