Please post your spoilers, comments, rants, raves, theories, and analyses here. Let’s enjoy the show!
Dear kdrama gods, please give us an ending we can all drool over. Thanks.
36 Comments On “Hotel del Luna: Ep 15 Post Spoilers Here”
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Heh! I feel that we’ve actually drooled or at least used much in the way of keystrokes (rather than saliva in talking) here over this show about as much as the above fountain gargoyle head. LOL, It’s been fun spazzing, ranting and discussing so many nitty-gritties here with you folks.
I wouldn’t mind ‘drowning’ in the ‘drool’ of our collective thoughts and sharings. It’s been educational and thought-provoking, but most of all, FUN! So thanks everyone … as we hit the penultimate Episode tonight or tmr morning (for me).
Here’s something from another drama blogsite, “The Drama Corner” … we have yet another cameo to look forward to… the almost original, long living alien, Kim Soo Hyun (My Love/You from Another Star)! This is supposed to be for Ep 16, I think, but no harm knowing it about it earlier!
from https://thedramacorner.com/2019/08/31/kim-soo-hyun-to-do-a-guest-appearance-in-the-final-episode-of-hotel-del-luna/
π @PM3 whatβs with #5799no title in the navigation bar up top? Itβs not your tribute to Room #404 is it?? π… it goes nowhere when you click on it… Imma checking in. π
Haha. So you got my joke about drooling like a fountain. π We write copiously over here, like an open spigot.
You’re right. No matter the ending, our personal journeys have been fun because they were enhanced by discussions with people like you, @GB. Thanks for being here, my friend.
That picture was taken in Longwood Garden, Pennsylvania a few months back. It’s a very pretty place to have a marriage proposal. I was trying to give a son a “helping hand” and a “gentle push” like one of the MaGos — but I’m not ditzy and interfering as MaGo 3, ok?
Yes, I’m looking forward to KSH. “You From Another Star” is another show I should watch but I saw him on “Moon That Embraces the Sun.” The plot was so messy, but since I binge-watched it, I could fast-forward or rewind when necessary.
Okay, so I resolved to never watch or read spoilers for the last two episodes of HDL. Since that had been my habit for the previous episodes, I wanted to fully savor the last moments untouched and unspoiled this time. I thought that would add more thrill. Told myself I’d sleep early tonight and then watch the full episode on Sunday morning. But here I am, 9:31 pm in my place, browsing raw videos clips in Instagram and reading a live recap online. Face palm. LOL. πππ π
But hey, I must say the writers are being consistent in making the Saturday episodes funny. I’m giggling and smiling like crazy while reading the recap. Took time to visit here while the recap writers are still on a break. I wonder how long this smile will last. Or will it turn into a smirk again when I reach tonight’s ending scene? I’ll soon find out. π
Just finished reading the recap. I find this episode so warm. My heart is smiling.π
Anyway, the bartender’s backstory is totally unexpected. Never got a hint it would go that way. A serious matter back then but a bit hilarious in the present time.π I applaud the writers for surprising me with such a fresh take. π
She is back! β€οΈ
I watched it raw. Some character resolutions and a major decision made. Loved the group hug and the photos!
Finally a truly, from the heart, happy smile from MW!
Loved this episode! Just watched with subs. The graduation, the picture-taking, the pick up and swirl, and our OTP obviously in love, though CS is still resisting the role of boy toy! Hated to see the episode end. If tomorrow’s ending is bad, we can just back up to this one.
I’m done guessing the ending, but as I’ve been saying for eons I think it will be happy. It’s too bad they lose all their memories when they cross the bridge, cause I’d be happy with a big reunion party in the afterlife with all their past guests, the staff, and of course CS will join them because of his bad heart, right pkm3?!
just watched the episode and i’m interested on how the bartender’s resentment is going to be solved. because during episode 15, the bartender was revealed to write lewd stories and brought shame to. and im quite interested on how the hong sisters will wrap this up. hopefully the OTP can have their happy ending.
Chanseong was tempted to stay with past Manwoel..luckily he didnβt..
i like all the fluttering & lovey dovey moment..their togetherness..Manwoel seducing Chanseong π€£..thatβs firm & strong will man right there..
they are priming us for the ending tonight possibly sad & angsty..still hoping for a good ending..
Am working on my review now. Will post in an hour.
Too many visually and emotionally satisfying scenes here. Hard to choose which one’s my favorite. If I pick my favorite scenes, it would seem like a full episode recap rather than an episode’s highlight. LOL. ππ
While watching, I feel like I’ll be fine now with whatever ending they prepared for us. Since the episode itself gives the “acceptance feels”. Seize the moment then let it go.
Like @Barbrey, I’m kind of done guessing the ending until it came to the dashcam scene. Was it there merely to insert an ad or will it play a part in the finale.
Sanchez: Goodness! Is that a ghost? I must be able to see them now.(Startled at sight of an old man slowly crossing the street)
CS: Here. He was recorded clearly. He’s not a ghost.
(Showing the record on his phone)
Now my fun imagination plays like this:
The original plan still stands. CS will peacefully see MW off. So she must be non living now. In the world of the living, CS continues his life with the memories of Man Wol. Then one day, she will appear before his eyes and he would think that’s it’s just her ghost form or a figment of his imagination. But then he will see a record of it in the dashcam and surprise! Man Wol is a living person for good now. Giggles.π I don’t how they’ll pull it off though. But the presence of Kim Soo Hyun here plus the fact that HDL is directed by the same director of You Who Came from the Stars make me feel that an “unexpected come back” of a non-typical being like Do Min Joon or Man Wol is still possible.
Additional note:
I’m new to seeing more of Man Wol’s humanness now. I’m not used to it but I’m definitely pleased. You know she’s back to being a normal woman with no super powers when she’s having a hard time carrying the heavy camera suitcase. Awww. She’s the weaker one now, physically.π
My random thoughts about Ep 15.
The Drinking Trap – Something new we learned this Episode … Food from another realm will tie a person down. An important ingredient in this, being tied down to Moon Trees business, is the Moon Flower. Instead of being a flower on the tree, it could be a flower that grows in the garden of the Moon Lodge, that shines at night.
The Moon Flower wine even needs moonlight (moon energy) and one full month (lunar month?) in order to be brewed well.
Coincidentally (or not) Tae Suk ate the potatoes of Hyun Joong before turning his gun on him and accidentally shooting him. He gets tied down to Hyun Joong’s sister for all of his life.
How much does MW remember of firefly? – For some reason we are not properly told if she can or cannot remember. Therefore it becomes intriguing and I start to wonder if this is significant.
Late Reveal of the Wine Trap – This is quite unfair of the Hong Sisters, … why is it we only know now that MG’s wine had been the reason MW was trapped or tied to that Hotel and Tree. While MW had first come upon MG, reckless about living or dying, she had not yet spoken to MG but MG had already served her the Moon Flower Wine. It was unfair that MW had unknowingly already got herself tied down to a moon tree.
Do we now need to think what else MG has been feeding CS? He did drink herbalist MG’s drink which was ostensibly to help him feel refreshed… but it may have made his dreams of MW waking dreams.
Letting Go – I hope everyone learns from CS the letting go lesson. All the ghosts have an issue with this. It takes a living CS to make the decision that continuing on, just because letting go is hard and separation, painful, is wrong. Poor chap had to make the decision for all of them.
I loved the open-hearted look in MW’s eyes at the end. The total freedom and peace with which she could finally say that she loved CS. She never actually had that clear-eyed, peaceful look before. I loved the photos and their genuine smiles!
Oddity – Our MW is strong enough to fight vengeful ghosts and put fit men down or pin them against walls … but she has difficulty carrying bags of camera equipment? Actually I never could figure out why she did as much manual stuff as she does when she can use telekinesis and teleport, etc.
Anyway that scene gave CS a chance to be the macho guy who could scoop MW up and spin her and dump her on the couch LOL! That’s my upright and chaste kind of guy! I liked that she was so put out… even the offer of jajanmyeon did not appease her!
Foreboding – Sanchez may have a reason to be worried about CS. He is so alive with and attached to the ghosts, seeing them as family and colleagues. His life will be quite empty without them and he’d be in the same boat as Sanchez when MW leaves.
200 years in the past – There’s the gambling that MW does with a ghost’s help, so that she always, dishonestly has the upper hand. CS by choosing to return to his time was taking a gamble that he’d be able to have present MW back whom he would see off. If he’d stayed on, it would have been past MW who’d have seen him off, so he’d never have to face the pain of letting go. The temptation was there for CS.
The temptation (and the wine) might still rear it’s seductive head. MG, after all, for all that she says she’s giving a choice… is more like the Eden snake in setting up scenarios of temptation. There would have been no need to face the conflict of choosing if MG had not created the situations.
With Yu Na, she didn’t even need to appear… but left the wine urn unattended for anyone to help themselves.
The temptation falls into MW’s hands but this time the temptation was not for herself but (she felt) for CS’s good. So it was right that she got him to make the choice. – ‘Should she drink the wine or not’. And the HS have written CS to be a veritable saint! Hardly a flaw, full of integrity and wise. Therefore he said, ‘No’. It was interesting that he did not say ‘It’s up to you…’ He knew by that time that she had chosen to return from the Afterlife because of him. Once again, he chose what was for her good, in full circle.
It’s maybe noteworthy this give and take – the going around the tree to MW and returning the way he came to a present that might have been without her. He was told to come back the way he came. I wonder where he would have ended up if he’d walked the circle around the tree … back to the distant past?
He chose to remain the one who would send her off instead of the one who passed by. The 99th and last living Manager.
Endings – Because show has set it up so well and all the logic has held until now, I’m OK with the unpopular ending. The sad farewells and separations will make sense. (I liked the 49 Days ending after all!). However since it’s a kdrama and writers do not want to upset their viewers, I still expect a happy twist … a restart of some kind. Maybe a slow walk around that dead looking tree?
@pm3, thanks in advance for investing such a precious time writing well-detailed reviews. Like my “highschool pal” @GB,(insert *wink here) I also intend to air my appreciation for BoD.π
Just so you know, since I signed up here last August 21, you and the commenters’ posts are the things I obsessively check throughout the day. Now I’ve got no regrets watching this drama while it’s still airing. Had I waited ’til it’s completed so I could binge watch it, I doubt the experience would be terrifically the same. It surely became more enjoyable like a roller coaster ride because of this online symposium with you guys. Gomawo! β€οΈ
oh my god @GB, you and your beautiful mind is such a bless..saranghaeyo ππ…
oh and all Chanseongβs heart wrenching and longing gazes for Manwoelβs daebak!make me fluttered..woah
@GB, I must say I do like the idea of a slow walk around the tree as the ending!
Liked that MW was dishing out advice on how to move on to Hyun-Joong as a change – now that she has let go of her grudge, she’s passing that knowledge onto other ghosts. Will she also be able to counsel scholar Kim too? Or will he get his own spotlight in the last episode?
I just had to get in a few responses before I get into work in earnest (one of my volunteer things, not office work,… it’s Sunday after all!!)
@Barbrey – Yes, the same scenes touched me and what a good idea about backing up to this episode. It really had the feel of a ‘proper’ ending with the ‘I love yous’ said with all the appropriate sentiment. I agree with @The Scholar-gentry and others that there’s no need for a kiss, etc to be swoon-worthy. Just that hand-hold of infinite trust and the holding of each other’s gaze was more than sufficient for me!
About that bad heart … I noticed how often poor CS has been hit in the chest. Even Seo Hee hit him when he came back fine and now MW hits him 3-4 times! Is it significant that she said “Die, die, die” for the last 3 hits? LOL. Yes, as I said above, I worry about CS with Sanchez.
@judy I can’t really imagine Bartender Kim writing lewd stories. Although it’s hard to prove innocence now after over 200 years. But I guess the only clearing off, of his grudge is that he feels (and I believe is) wrongly accused and wants to be exonerated even after all this time. That new ghost author who popped up at the bar is the key to getting some justice for Kim. He needs to re-write his story (Heheheh! Be his own ghost writer and change his own words) so that Kim’s true situation comes to light in the book to be published. Kim had so much pride in his Civil Service Exam results only to be vilified because of his writing – this is the part that needs to be redressed.
Parallel hugs – EP 14 MW waits at the entrance of the tunnel, uncertain whether to enter. When CS emerges, she runs and hugs him. But it is CM at first and she breaks away. The rest of the staff come running but don’t know how to greet him beyond whacks on the shoulder or chest. The staff unite behind CS in the end, while MW does her worst.
Episode 15 MW emerges from the car and stands uncertainly. She’s staring back into the tunnel when CS comes running out. Is she thinking that she could have been rid of this place if she’d stayed back there? CS’s hug is one she knows, she remembers him and hugs him back and all the staff eventually join in a group hug. They’ve become family.
@Storm Moon – That camera thing and .
Hyun Joong is able to make himself visible for short periods of time and to take selfies. We hear that ghosts who are hundreds of years old seem to have that ability. Otherwise, if ghosts are ‘less experienced’ they do not show up in the camera.
All the rest of the hotel staff are invisible to Sanchez. He is afraid of them and even of what he can see passing outside the car. He does not know whether he is seeing a ghost or a living being. The dash cam should have assured him it was not a scary ghost. However it was a stranger to be ignored and forgotten.
He worries about CS because as he says: “It’s normal to be afraid of ghosts. You are the one who became strange. Chan Sung, I think you’re going too far. I’m worried you might completely move on to the other side.” It’s true that CS has a great attachment to his ghost friends and might not want to be parted from them. But his way of keeping them with him is by remembering
In his usual selfless way, he does not mind that present day MW and staff will not remember his foray into their lives 200 years previously. However, he wants to remember them and for them to remember each other as they are now, even when the trek across Sanzu erases him from their memories later on. His is a very painful loneliness, because he will no longer exist to them, should he remain alive. Sanchez might not have known the true extent of the cost of CS’s letting go.
The Dash Cam photo of a passing stranger in contrast with MW’s photographs. Her real living managers never appear in any of the photos. She regrets now that she never kept a record of them, having not appreciated those who would just pass by her, in her long life. (@packmule3 has said more than once that it’s because she does not want to have the pain of attachment … I paraphrase badly). 1,000 years she had that great camera, and she had never once considered taking a shot with or of her staff who’ve been with her for 70+, or 200+ or 500+ years!! So self-centred, our Man Wol! LOL, to her there was no such thing as permanent staff … all were temporary compared to her. They were not really ‘worth’ remembering. They were passers-by.
However now she’s grown. She took out the camera voluntarily (for a photo with CS? and Hyun Joong) and although the idea of having a bigger group photo is new to her, she agrees to it. Now that she acknowledges having attachments and wanting to keep records … those persons/ghosts are no longer just temporary in her life. Even though they would eventually have to part, she’s now prepared to remember them, or have them remembered.
It’s great that this time, it was she who came up with the idea to have an event for Hyun Joong (her staff had complained that she’d always been so cold to them before!)
This time in the camera it’s the ghosts who are the main focus, not the photo-bombed scary spirits that Sanchez fears. LOL. Yu Na admires the photo and is sad she’s not in them. However she’s likely to remain and to remember. The real photos of real ghosts are the assurance of the memory even past CS’s time.
I think the camera and their picture will be significant because of the ghostly pedestrian that scared Sanchez.
I thought that was an odd scene to film just for the heck of it. Unless they were doing a product placement…
@Storm Moon – It’s great that your one year on BoD has given you such a good drama viewing experience. I’ve had that with DB for years, and been very grateful for that as well. I love to watch as shows air in order to chat with others about them, but I’ve hardly ever gone into such depth with more like-minded people until some kind soul (also on DB) mentioned this blog. Thanks back to you and you’re welcome!
@Papai – Thank you for your kind words. I hope my mind is growing beautifully LOLβ¦ Right about now I’m supposed to have completed some work but here I am trying to be ‘beautiful’ *eyeroll* π Hugs and love to you too!
@kei – You know that thought about walking around the tree only just hit me as I wrote all the way down to the last 2 paragraphs? I never thought of it properly until then. But it was a fun thought to throw out here and I’m glad it has garnered ‘excitement’ π although whether it comes to pass remains to be seen tonight!!!
I like that MW is becoming a mite others-centre now. I like that she sat down with Hyun Joong under the tree and spared him that time and gave him advice and options without pushing anything at him. He used to say that she never had a warm word for anyone, but she took some trouble over him while as usual being sarcastic about his sulking (well he was sulking!) And then she calls him a kid⦠and gets an event and a party thrown for him. That was so sweet.
Opps… just noticed that I’d lost the full title: It was meant to be:
@Storm Moon – That camera thing and remembering.
Unlike all of you folks, this is literally the first full, normal length K-Drama I’ve watched entirely from beginning to end. It’s been a weird ride. Β―\_(γ)_/Β―
Anyhow, is it me or am I imagining the weird eye bags that MW and CS have? Is that just the makeup being weird or supposed to symbolize how MW is no longer bound to the tree (and is thus “dead”) or something else? It reminds me the ghosts’ look and I think it is too big a coincidence to be missed. MW is very obvious but I think CS is noticeable too.
On Bellhop’s story, I’m glad the guy masquerading as Bellhop wasn’t truly evil, it was simply a bad situation and he screwed up. A reminder of how shitty the whole Korean War business was. The parallel between Bellhop and MW, as someone who has a grudge against someone, and Intern and CS, their lover who helps them overcome the grudge, is really sweet. Seems like MW did learn something. Anyways, I’ve always wanted a little sister, so the Bellhop’s backstory really hit me, though it was resolved more quickly than I’d expected.
I think it comes as no surprise that MW doesn’t look as overly fancy or flashy (or “extra” as the kids would say these days) now that she’s let it all go. There’s something about her picture with CS that reminds me of a generic Asian mom and dad look lol.
Next, it seems like we are gearing up to resolve scholar Kim’s story – it’s good he’s not a comic relief character after all. Though it seems to come from nowhere, we can note a few things about scholar Kim:
– He’s been around the longest so it must be a really deep grudge.
– He seemed awfully eager to set up CS with Sulli. Perhaps he was writing love stories?
– When he came to MW in the flashback in the early episode, he was bleeding from a wound while still wearing his scholar’s robes – the same ones as when those guys were trashing him.
Besides this, there is some important historical and cultural context needed here. Losing the fame from getting first place on the exams meant you somehow fucked up royally as getting first rank on the exams was no small feat and something everyone knows. I know this myself as my earliest known ancestor got first place in Vietnam’s variation of the civil exams centuries ago – my family literally doesn’t know (ie doesn’t care) about who came before him, that’s how impressive achieving that is. So, when scholar Kim lost that, it was not just a personal thing, it is literally something that shamed his family and ancestors too. *Now* his comment that he couldn’t face his ancestors in the afterlife makes more sense. Though the exam system was a meritocratic system ahead of its time, it was also subject to corruption and politics, so perhaps scholar Kim was set up.
Anyways, we know his story will tie into the protagonists somehow, but I cannot figure out what as it doesn’t seem as simple a parallel as Seo-hee or Bellhop’s story. Because his is the only of the staff that isn’t resolved, however, and we’re at the last episode now, this means it might be very important.
Other random thoughts:
– Which memories are lost? MW could still remember drinking the booze that made her the owner, as well as CM. I’m glad MW still keeps her personality anyways. Would’ve been weird if the memory erasing made her super sweet all of a sudden.
– Hypothetically, could CS and MW drink the special binding alcohol *together* so they will own the hotel together? Is that even possible?
– We have six MG now, is there even more?
– The time travel part was fun and they even managed to wave off time travel paradox shenanigans with MG “lol dun worry dude no one’s gonna remember.” For me with my history degree, it’s always fun seeing parallels drawn between the past and present, such as horses = cars. It’s also sweet that CS had a positive impact on MW even before they met, even before they were born, and that (as much as his earlier self may’ve hated it) he’s the reason why she’s a foodie.
– MW “let’s go to the bedroom” thing before CS picked her up and trolled her must’ve been quite frustrating for the fangirls who wanted some steamy action. I suppose the writers were trolling them.
Awww, CS did the exact same thing for MW in Joseon time and he was the one who thought her to enjoy food from different towns. βΊοΈ It was very tempting for him to stay but deep inside he believes that MW will come back and I feel heβs accepted the fact that he will have to let her go. Just like the wine for the new hotel owner.
The picture taking was cute. βΊοΈ I love the way MW held CSβs upper arm as if to say, his mine. π
What does MW want to do when CS lifted her and said go to her room? π The look on her face said it all after CS said, letβs eat. π€¦π»ββοΈπ
I extra love that group hug after MW came back. Oh the scene at Sanchezβs restaurant was funny. And I agree with @Storm Moon about the dash cam βΊοΈ I can see it totally happening.
How unconvinced was Sanchez about the decision of Mi Ra and Detective to live together? π
Another random thought: if we don’t have CS or MW become the hotel owners, what if Yuna became the new owner? That’d suck for her but I thought of the show description talking about finding someone with a sin greater than MW and while Yuna isn’t anywhere near being a mass murderer she did steal a body (albeit unintentionally) so she isn’t clean either.
Or maybe Sanchez becomes the new owner lol
I feel like there’s a decent chance the new owner is someone we already know. Otherwise, they’d have to spend some time in Ep 16 developing the new owner as a character if he or she is a new character and there isn’t much time to resolve all the loose ends.
@GB, where did the “one year” came from? Haha. I’m just 11 days long here on BoD.π And I enjoyed every moment of it especially ’cause HDL is the first drama ever that I decided to watch while still airing.π
I like your theory that the Bartender was writing a love story rather than porn, and that it was misinterpreted.
He seems to be a courtly man. And an oblivious man too. He doesn’t flirt with the Housekeeper although they’ve been together for 200 years and he still uses formal language with her.
And look at the way he set up CS with the Sulli. He idealizes the romance. Lol.
If he really was a guy who wrote porn, he wouldn’t be able to maintain his celibacy for 500 years.
@scholar-gently, you picked a good kdrama to start with. Are you interested in Korean historical s – called sajeuks? My favorites were Six Flying Dragons, Seven Day Queen, Tree with Deep Roots. I’m not into palace drama – feel too claustrophobic- so I tend to like the fusions better. Really liked Rebel, Shine or Go Crazy, Splash Splash Love, and of course Moon Lovers. Lots of people loved Moon Embracing the Sun as well, and the Moonlight one.
My fave non-historical drama (though it took a few episodes for me to get into it so bear with it) is Healer.
But I mainly watch for rom coms so would be happy to share my top ten.
I rather envy you not having seen many. I only started watching a few years ago during an illness but binge-watched so many I have trouble finding new ones now!
@packmule3 There’s also the fact that back in those days (in many parts of the world, not just East Asia), the line between what was considered porn and romantic love stories could be very blurry – especially if politics is involved. Given the prominence of the scholar-gentry class in East Asia, most of the love stories and porn of the day would’ve been written by them anyways. I’m not sure about the specifics in Korea, but I do know that in China and Vietnam at least, love stories were often a convenient way for the scholar-gentry to project their own ideals and vent their frustrations without actually explicitly talking about politics and other sensitive issues (kinda like how HDL has deftly woven into commentary about stuff like spycams and online hate). Perhaps Scholar Kim was trying to do that, but got on the wrong side of politics when his enemies realized what he was doing.
And perhaps the love story he wrote (or was accused of writing) will somehow tie in with the resolution of MW and CS’ own love story.
@barbrey
I’m still surprised I got into HDL. My grandmas watched a lot of Kdramas, and I’ve fangirl friends who watch them, so I’m familiar with Kdrama tropes and formulas – hot brooding jerks with hearts of gold who take hot brooding showers, evil MILs, drunk piggyback rides, etc – but haven’t experienced them much firsthand. I’m quite grateful HDL doesn’t follow the tropes too closely. Ironically though, most of the stories I write are basically mellower Kdramas, so there’s that.
My degree is in history, but of the four main countries of the Sinosphere (Korea, Japan, China, and Vietnam), Korea’s history bores me the most. Palace intrigue bores me too, though mainly because it makes me feel like it’s just eyerolling catfights with cool costumes.
I do like romcoms if they aren’t too heavy and dramatic. As I mentioned in the other post, to.jenny is probably the closest to my ideal story (minus some cringe in the first episode): fluffy, simple, and mellow but not vapid, with thoughtful themes that are subtle and not too preachy, and a clear main couple without stupid love triangles, idiot plots, and complicated schemes to get in the way. Tbh I’ll probably binge on it again to get the very heavy HDL out of my system.
I did hear that splash splash is a short and sweet type of deal, so I might check that out later. I would love to hear what other good romcoms are out there, either way. π
Actually, similar to you, I only got more into romance stories in general years ago after a life threatening illness. Before that I was stuffy kinda like CS at the beginning; almost dying changes your perspective on things.
@scholar-gentry, I think the lovely thing about sajeuks, though, is that they are character-driven usually, so regardless of the actual history, you’ll be watching it in a very palatable way so it goes down better than most historicals from other countries. The history is also much easier to follow. I knew nothing of Gogoryeo, Gojoseon, Balhae, Baekje, Silla, Goryeo, Joseon, etc., before kdramas! I know some Japanese history (Shogun started my interest), but little Chinese because its ancient history is so complicated, and nothing about Vietnam.
You might really enjoy “I am not a robot”. It does have a rather complicated (and not always believable) scheme but that drove the story along with the romance. Light, fluffy, great romance, but still thought-provoking especially about ethics. Highly recommend. I haven’t watched to.Jenny . It wasn’t available to me when I first heard of it but thanks for the reminder. I’ll go back to it.
@Barbrey I’m terribly picky with my historical settings haha. History has always been very easy for me to grasp since I was young; Chinese history is my biggest interest, but I’m not too fond of the long, winding nature of Cdramas. But looking through it again, Splash Splash Love looks like it would be fine with me – short and sweet. I am not a Robot also sounds like it might be worth a shot for me too, so I’ll check that one out!
As for to.jenny, it was marketed as a guy (re-)meeting the girl of his dreams and the two bonding through music, but I think it was deep down about two depressed young people with quarter life crises helping each other heal and enjoy life.
@scholar-gentry, I understand! I almost did a history degree but as a Canadian with a British background it was Britain that interested me. My degrees eventually ended up in literature, anthropology/archeology and drama.
What is it you write? I’ve written a number of short stories but my spare time has been taken up with a novel of late. A ghost adventure love story. It started with me on a kind of blind date and the guy said he admired Trump. And for me the date was over. Like I was so repelled I astonished myself, didn’t know I would have an almost bodily reaction. So the book was just originally going to be a romance called Love and the Trump Supporter, and I was going to make my progressive feminist protagonist fall in love with him! And hopefully challenge myself as well because I’m not normally so intolerant.
Anyway, a good part of that is still there but it morphed into a ghost story (the protags twin brother, don’t know if he’s imaginary or a ghost – shades of that imaginary ghost in Del Luna, which I’m sure was based on the Simon experiments in Toronto, same research my ghost is based on) as well as a mystery-adventure based on The Voynich Manuscript – I’m certain you know of it as most historians do – and my own feminist take on medical history!
Okay – I need to stop talking about the book. No fun for anyone but me.
Your name intrigued me, scholar-gentry, because I think a great comparative history topic would be on the scholar-gentry in China/Korea and Britain. I’d love to compare to Lord Byron’s time, just before Victoria, when every Oxford graduate had to prove himself a poet as well as a politician. And in that 30 year period you get these amazing women, the best novelists of their time and maybe ever, Jane Austen and the Bronte sisters, and they were never part of the system, and so they were heart-stoppingly original for their time. I’d love to compare the Romantics with their Chinese or Korean counterparts.
@barbrey Coincidentally I considered doing a double major in history and anthropology but had to just do history due to medical reasons.
I write slice of life, but my stories often end up being about serious topics like race, masculinity, Asian-America, and history, disguised as fluffy Kdramas. The 2nd book of my main project is akin to HDL as a mundane take on the supernatural – instead of hoteliers and fancy decor, it’s bureaucrats and paperwork, per Asian mythology. Coincidentally, years ago I chose IU as my reference for that book’s protag as she felt “right” – one of the secret joys I got from HDL is seeing my character come to life in a way. Imagine a low maintenance, melancholic, gentler, intellectual version of MW as a paperpusher. Even my protag’s man is sort of like a more serious CS. It must be fate lol.
Anyways, I can totally relate to the spark for your story being your rather unfortunate date. Our own personal lives are so full of potential sources of inspiration, and a nice way to process it is through writing. Not to mention the weird journeys meta-wise a story can take. So if I read you correctly it’s a supernatural romcom then that somehow involves the Voynich Manuscript meaning some sort of mystery is involved.
In East Asia, as I mentioned on the Ep 16 thread, there is a traditional trope of the scholar who scorns the corruption of society and/or suffers from it, and seeks solace in creative and spiritual pursuits. This might be the closest to the European Romantics. I recommend Pu Songling’s Strange Tales from a Chinese Studio, the culmination of centuries of East Asian literature about the supernatural. It’s a collection of short stories that reminds me of HDL a bit, and was the main inspiration for my Book 2 above, which is a modern, Asian-American take on it. Like scholar Kim’s writing, it concerns the everyday; it also has social commentary (some progressive for its time) that is not heavy handed. Pu Songling failed to pass the exams, but in return gave Asia some of its best supernatural and love stories.
The big difference with the East Asian scholar-gentry and elsewhere was that the scholar aspect was heavily institutionalized, partly due to the exam system. In other parts of the world, if you were educated you were nobility; for the scholar-gentry, you were nobility if you were educated. A subtle but important difference. But this also meant family lineage, honor, reputation, and all that were also closely tied with your intellectual side, for better or worse. I’m actually descended from scholar-gentry; it’s meaningless now but even growing up my family imprinted the ideals of intellectualism onto me.
Anyhow, I digress
Your books sound fascinating (and choosing IU for your protagonist – what a cincidence! You do the same as me – mine looks like Shakira and has her joie de vivre!) and I will definitely take a look at Pu Songling. When I was researching Korean myth I found very little was published in English so went back to old original sources because there was a translated semi collection of them. They’ve even got bureaucrats and administrators in some of their myths by the way. I’m trying to remember which myth and area I’m thinking about in particular – I think it was Silla.
I was going to mention the difference of institutionalized versus not, but in the dramas I’ve seen, the system was so corrupted it was not a true difference at all. The rich and titled got all the scholar positions. What I imagine it influenced more than reality is the way people thought about education. But I could be wrong! Dramas often over-represent so perhaps the system, which seemed so amazing to me, did work for certain time periods, and at least partially.
I’m glad you digressed because after I wrote my own digression I wanted to take it back! Your own negates my embarrassment. Best of luck with your writing project!
@Barbrey You know you picked the right reference for your character when the character ends up becoming more like the reference lol. And best of luck to you as well!
Pu Songling would be a good launching point since he’s the pinnacle of the East Asian genre. After him I would recommend Yuan Mei’s Censored By Confucius/What the Master Would Not Discuss, which is a more cynical, dry take on the genre – in contrast to Pu Songling who was the romantic, introspective artist, Yuan Mei was an edgy hipster and free spirit. The last of the great three exemplars of the genre would be Chi Yun’s Shadows in a Chinese Landscape, which is more of a wistful old man’s take on the genre.
The bureaucracy thing is so embedded in East Asian culture that near death experiences from East Asia are typically not “light at the end of the tunnel” stuff, but “I met a guy in an office who said they accidentally got the wrong person and told me to come back later.” In the dramas the exam/scholar system comes off as corrupt I think because it’s easier to create, well, drama for the story. In real life, when it did work it worked – a meritocratic system of governance based on one’s knowledge and virtue, and not one’s birth, in theory was ahead of its time even if in practice results were mixed. After all, even many of the scholars who critiqued it saw themselves as true (Neo-)Confucians. A complicating factor for Korea was that class hierarchies were stricter than the Chinese and Vietnamese equivalents which tended to be fluid.