The thread is now open for spoilers, theories, analyses, and everything but the kitchen sink.
Bring it on, show. We’re ready for it.
BTW, the train man is the cat man. I called it before the press releases. And now the press releases have already confirmed it.
Let’s enjoy the show.
Thanks @pkml3. I’m now debating whether I should try to watch Ep 7 raw. I may be a good girl and do some other study first and come back to Sisyphus when the subs are out. *Decisions, decisions!!*
Σ੧(❛□❛✿)
Σ (°ζ‿° )
(✿╹◡╹)
I’ll watch it tonight or tomorrow when Ep 8 is out so I can watch it back to back.
I’m still working on Hello Me review and I heard Lee Seunggi’s drama is out. So I’ve to check that out too.
Btw, somebody commented on Jaesun’s loyalty in another thread. No, Jaesun will not betray SeoHae. The idea did cross my mind that the CB could blackmail him with his family.
However, after seeing that he won the lotto BECAUSE of SeoHae, I think he’ll be a loyal pup. It’s his character. He bought bananas for her despite not having money bec he thought she could see the lotto numbers. He’ll follow the money. 😂 💸💸
Anyway, that’s my take. I’m cynical.
See you later.
@pkml3 I managed my study and slipped in to watch half raw and half subbed. This was a fantastic episode. It answered ALL the questions on how Sun got there, how the EMP thingy got there, how Seo Hae got there and the deal with Tae San.
Oh and you’re right @pkml3, Sun is as loyal as a pup but his motivation is not crass ($$) but full of heart (٩(♡ε♡ )۶) LOL.
Now we’ve got to see how Sigma is to be unearthed by TSul, whether TSul really does build the uploader (since he always did in the future) and how the brothers do get to meet again. Also, whether SH can get through to the end without too much damage and even death. I wonder if SJ will blame TSul for what happens to her parents and try to avenge them, whether Seong Bok (Eddy) will grow more backbone and be a true friend (I expect so), whether SH will meet her mum (and dad, and younger self) and whether she’ll actually get married. I even want the Asia Mart folks to get out of trouble and get their downloader to do more timely ‘magic’!! What a swell show!
⌒(o＾▽＾o)ノﾟ
I am grossed out and fascinated by LSG’s new drama Mouse. The body count is high and the murders gruesome (serial killers). But I am on board for this whodunit. The writer gives me pause though. She’s the same one who wrote the travesty Gods Gift 14days (which I watched). And she also wrote Black (which I didn’t watch). She’s very good at holding you in suspense right to the end but she ruined the ending (I can vouch for GG14days – it was illogical). I hear she did the same for Black. So I am dialing down expectations for a neat satisfactory finale.
Thanks. I just read a recap of Mouse and I remembered why I didn’t include it in my list. 🙂
After L.U.C.A., I’ve decided not to give any more platform to kdramas that on one hand, decry sadistic tendencies and violent strains found in society, but on the other hand, desensitize the viewers to the horror of sadism and violence through OVERKILL scenes. 🤨
These shows emulate what I deplore about Hollywood and its movies.
L.U.C.A. was my “threshold.” I’m not going further.
I did a 30 min watch during lunch, triggered by the comment of @GB. Indeed, more answers to our questions and I was keeping tab of them. Love the section with Sun! I’m so happy he won the lotto, it turned out as I expected as a last minute thing when he found the paper in his pocket. Also happy he evaded CB and that his rescue of “sis” SH is from the goodness of his heart and a mild little crush 😻.
What time are you watching it? Want to watch it with me tonight? Like a rewatch?
@PM3 – yes!!! I am free at my 6PM PST.
How about 7pm PST? That’s 10pm EST, my time.
That works for me, too. Will have early dinner then. See you at 7PM PST/10PM EST. 😊
See you later.
I’m here, Janey. I’m about to start.
Here here!!!
Let’s go, Janey!
SeoHae wakes up again. Does she ever sleep in the same place?
What’s this hideous nightgown is she wearing? Or did her sister make her wear this? This is a far cry from the lace dress that Taesul bought for her for the Chairman’s party.
This is too frilly for SeoHae.
Jaesun: She’ll beat you up even when you saved her life.
lol. He’s speaking from experience.
She grabs a pair of scissors? As a weapon, this is an upgrade from the ballpoint pen that she picked up at Jaesun’s place.
I like how Jaesun took the scissors from her hand. That looks kinda boyfriend-y to me.
LOL! Too colorful dress. Sun’s sister dressed her up.
New word – misogamist! Not a believer in marriage. The sister is funny! I bet SH will use this word with TSul.
That’s a trope. Every kdrama must have an annoying sibling who spills the bean on the male/female lead. I bet they would be surprised to hear that Jaesun took care of her at his rooftop apartment.
Misogamist? Marriage-hater?
Miso: hate
gamy: gamus: marriage.
Sun has a crush on SH!
Why did the dad and SH separate with her mom in the shelter? The bickering of Sun’s mom and sis are being back memories.
Oh, you’re probably right! That’s where she got the idea of not wanting to marry Taesul??
And here I was thinking that she was referring to Taesul’s comment about avoiding marriage to each other in the future.
Was this her regret?
That her mom didn’t join them in the nuclear bunker/fallout shelter? Why didn’t she go?
Finally, he put his hands in his pocket and got the lotto paper! Run, Sun, run!!! I knew this will be a last minute thing. Glad he made it and found the coin.
Note: She didn’t like the taste of coffee, either. So, she doesn’t like the taste of beer that TS gave her, but they ended up drinking a lot. And she didn’t like coffee.
Maybe she’ll soju in the end…or perhaps banana milk!!!
Aww… he has a picture of SH. sweet!
So he was the one watching Tsul’s house.
You were right! It’s going to be a photo-finish for Jaesun.
Wait a minute. Did you notice the date? let me rewind this…
It’s 9-13 on the TV!
Lotto says 8-19-2020 in the lotto ticket . Oops I thought 913 is the date on TV.
Notes:
So that’s the trick!
Jaesun went back to the restaurant. It’s still August 13 for him, but it was already August 15 for Seohae AND Taesul.
That’s why when he went back to the restaurant, the suicide of the owner had just been discovered.
The news report that night was still speculating about the return of TS as CEO. There was no news of the sniper attack in Busan yet.
News report: “Q&T CEO Han Taesul expecgted to return to the Office soon.”
If it had been the same day, then the news would have been reporting about the gun violence.
Jaeson was back in his own time.
lol. He thought he was a bum.
Seohae knew the numbers because for her, it was the “past” already. It was already August 15 for her.
Is that the date of the lotto on the screen? 913?
The previous night, it was 912.
SH refuses help from Sun and does not want him to be involved. He calls her “sis”.
He gives her a watch as gift. PPL! He owed her for life.
It’s still 913.
I don’t know how lotto works. 🙂 It’s possible that the the number is valid for several drawings. That is, you can buy a ticket today, but it’s still good for, say, five days after the purchase.
Those time differences are dissonant! I can’t keep track. Didnt they go to the train station on Aug 15 for the conference? Both of them were there. The aug 19 is raffle of lotto.
Oct 31 is the start of nuclear war. SH decided to open us to Sun and advised him to leave. She confirmed she knew the lotto because she came from the future. Sun believes her.
Jaesun: But it didn’t feel right.
Good instincts! I like that he sensed that something was wrong.
The news report: It’s been over a week since the shooting, but no suspect yet.
The shooting was August 15. Plus 7 days = August 22.
August 19 was the day they met the Hyunsik, jumped off the bridge, and stayed at SeoJin’s office.
August 20, they left SJ’s office at 9am; they argued at the ATM; reconciled; went to the sauna; then to his house for the key. They stayed overnight, and left the following day for the Chairman’s party.
Meanwhile, Jaesun waited at the hospital for Seohae. When she didn’t drop by, he went over to TS’ house.
Jaesun: “Starting that day” he waited in front of his house except when he went to the bathroom.
The impression I got there was he spent days.
Mr. Park’s boys covering him from SH’s gun. Aww… Mr Park seems to be a good employer then. The boys are loyal and protective of him. So it’s not TSun on TV in a hoodie.
Oh, we find out about the cup with EMP and photo and how it came to TSun’a house. They can do package delivery!
She has a picture of their wedding in her diary!
Mr Park “I’ used to be a misogamist”. Lol!
He didn’t call her “sis.” This is when I wished Netflix would just use the actual Korean word.
He called her “noona.” And there’s a wealth of meaning there.
I’ve to make a note here:
He was born in 1997, making him 23 years old in Western age. 24 in korean age.
She was born in 2012, so she should have been only 8 years old.
I like Jaesun’s advice here. “They say only those who can accept help can help others.”
In his case, he can be relied on to help her because he already accepted her aid.
Maybe Seohae shouldn’t turn down his offer of assistance, but I get why she didn’t want to endanger him.
I hope he doesn’t die in the end, though.
Nice gift. A wristwatch with angel wings?
“I’ll return the favor for all my life.” Whoops, I hope he didn’t mean that he would REPAY the favor with his life. Because I’m sure his life is worth more than 2.0 billion won.
Mr Park: “why don’t you just kill TSul? Then it will be over”. Nothing will change.
SH: I can change it.
Sisyphean task. That’s why she keeps trying and in the loop!
So who did he marry?
Can it be the person he was sending money to every month?
Awww… the mom teared up when she answered the call.
This must be the time paradox that was explained to Taesul by the Asian Mart minion.
I noticed that the sniper Hyunki also had a teary eye when he was about to shoot Seohae at the night of the party. I knew that Seohae’s eyes were watery, but I didn’t get why Hyunki looked like he was about to start crying. I assumed it was because he was just being emotional and full of hatred for Seohae because he believed that CB’s lies that she killed his defenseless mom.
Ugh. No wedding ring on the dad. (rolling eyes here)
Maybe. I can’t tell from Korean names if it’s male or female.
Hahaha! Sub asked SH to be his girlfriend. And to go to New York with him. So much about noona. 😻
Yes, I like that Jaesun believes her instantly. But hey! that’s what winning the lotto will do to you.
So was she alive or not alive by then?
Her birthday is supposedly on September 30.
And she told Taesul that the uploader would be invented in 2021.
That’s right, I did notice the teary eye also.
Sorry @PM3! I have to log in back to work. I hope it’s a short thing and I can catch up. I’m ahead of you a bit.
Ugh! That’s cheating, writer! Booooo! Hisssssss!
Sending a box back in time with the EMP, photo, and the mug is deux ex machina. It’s contrived solution to an impossible situation.
I’m not happy viewer here in the peanut gallery.
No problem. I’ll just continue. 🙂
Did I say that I like this techie girl? Taesul and Seohae should hire her.
So, they can UPLOAD things from the future to his house? They just don’t download? If that’s the case, why can’t they upload things in the prison cells of the captured illegal travelers? Or upload something to Mr. Park to help him escape?
Yes, Janey, Mr. Park had a good point there. Why not just kill TS? I wondered about it during the ATM conversation, and I was going to write about it —
Ha. This was her father’s advice. If she had walked away with the money, she would have a nice life, because Taesul would be assassinated, and the uploader wouldn’t be invented. I’m assuming that his invention of the uploader TRIGGERED the nuclear war. If he didn’t invent it, then nuclear war wouldn’t happen. Right? So just have him killed then?
Huh? But if he created the uploader that escalated the nuclear war, shouldn’t killing him stop his invention and prevent the war? Why bother save him?
********
That’s when I realized that diary could have mentioned something about love. Seohae could have written down that she loved this man so she didn’t have the heart to kill him. Even if meant doing this over and over again — the Sisyphean task — she would try to save the world AND Taesul.
Awwww…Jaesun is definitely winning me over with his puppy charm.
He wants “Noona” to go with them.
Heck. Where did she get that rifle? And rubber bullets? If this is the same rubber bullet that I’ve heard of, then it’s going to bounce. lol.
I like that she shot a lot of Taesul’s attackers and Taesul was (literally) in the dark about it.
Hahaha. The difference in fashion tastes. Taesul looked appalled when he saw her “sleepy cats” sweatshirt. He’s such an ahjussi.
SeoJin and Eddie Kim really did a number on him, didn’t they? He couldn’t trust anyone so easily now.
“Are you really Seohae?” This question was begging for a kiss as proof of identity. But of course, this is Seohae we’re talking about, and I don’t think she’s ready for a kiss yet. The kiss scene will probably come in Episode 10.
Seohae: It’s me. I’m here.
I like the holding hands.
Her diary says to save TS and save the world. That she can have it all. That’s why she tries so hard to change the results and continue to have hope.
Jealousy trope.
Taesul is more childish than Jaesun. It was obvious that he was insulting Jaesun:
“Discontinued model” “Second-hand” Then teaching him where the climate button is. And then rocking the seat.
And that grumpy expression on his face as he left the two alone was funny. He looks like an ahjussi.
The key. All that fuss about the key and all it contained was a love letter to Taesul — like a message in the bottle? Like a Juliet letter?
Gee, thanks, Hyung! You almost got your little bro killed for nothing.
So this was what the Hyung actually said to Seohae:
Taesan: You’re putting Taesul in danger. This is my last warning. If I ever see you again, I’ll kill you. You don’t care whether he dies or not if you can save the world. But it’s the opposite for me. As long as I can save Taesul, I don’t care what happens to the world.
What a complete loco.
But the question is: can you really have your cake and eat it, too?
If she’s Spock, she’ll know the answer. “The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.” But then again, when it comes down to it, being human demands that we act illogical when love and compassion require it.
Awww. Mr. Park is going to sacrifice himself.
Why didn’t he want the downloader shut down?
My guess is he wants to continue helping people from the future return to the present. He wants to continue to give them a pathway.
But my cynical self also says that he probably has a means to go back, so he doesn’t want the downloader shut down. lol.
Moment of truth for Jaesun: he decides to help noona out.
Don’t die now, dude!
Wait. Is he the wild card here? I hope his assistance can really make a difference in Seohae’s mission.
I’m back!!! Are you done with the ep? I’m at the part when SH is assembling her gun.
JaeSun: I’ll wait for you!
Okay, so who’s this Sigma? He was right next to Taesul all along.
Did they mean literally, physically beside him? Or metaphorically beside him, like a supporter or fan? Whatever.
And is he an animal lover? First cat, then monkey. I get the cat. Seohae was wearing a cat sweatshirt. But monkey? Did he mean that Taesul was up to his sly tricks again like a mischievous monkey? Doing monkey business?
SH is an excellent markswoman! Here comes the bridge scene.
PSH is a cat person in real life. She has 2 cats.
Love the holding hands. Reciprocating his gesture when he hit the van.
TSul being jealous of Sun and nitpicking his car. SH to TSul : “how old are you?”
Really? PSH is a cat person?
You know this bridge scene proved to me that the actor playing Taesul isn’t really a tall guy. He’s about the same height as PSH. lol.
I’ve to go to sleep now. Good night! Thank you for watching this with me. 🙂
The safe is a red herring! Finally Tsan explaining his actions. He has the blueprint, he staged his death as a way to protect TSul. He could have done it in a different way and not endanger his brother and not make him so guilt-laden. “I’m not smart” – yup!!! I agree.
“And don’t look for me”. This confirmed he was the person who left the message behind the painting.
Why so cryptic again in sigma? I think SeoJin is part of it.
Goodnight @PM3!!! Will finish up!
@pkml3 @Janey
Unbeknownst to me, you two were online the same time I was re-watching this episode too! LOL.
Fave impression of Seo Hae: ‘Mother Mode’ LOL. I loved how she spoke like a mum to TSul on the bridge and led him off by the hand, while he followed her, docile and trusting like a young child.
She used a ‘Mother’ tone to shut the boys up and rolled her eyes over the 2 squabbling in the car, with TSul being more petty and childish than Jae Sun, LOL.
My fave expression on Tae Sul’s face… the mutinous child look when ‘Mother’ told him to wait inside Asia Mart.
Cho Seung Woo was so entertaining.
Yup, TSul is not that tall. SH was taller than him in heels during the party
Strange that the chairman was very nervous about the laser from the sniper gun on his chest but eventually took his own life using a gun. Sad. Was the last person he talked to his daughter or Sigma?
Sigma is “right next to us” – I think it means Sigma has eyes on them, everywhere. TSul figured this out he was being watched hence he issued a challenge to him and also a message to his brother during Q+T press briefing announcement.
Alrighty, Ep8 tomorrow!
I’ve been other occupied hunting down a serial killer in Mouse. Will try to catch Ep7 tonight and see if I feel inclined to do another madcap. 😂
Hello @GB 🙋 oh, you could have joined us! Maybe we can do it again tomorrow night, @PM3.
SH: from noona to momma mode. 😂 TSul sulked cutely! And JaeSun is so sweet, he reminded me of NJH/Dosan due to his height and features.
Your madcaps are always rad, @nrllee! Looking forward to it!
@Janey yes, now that you mention it, Jae Sun does look a little like Nam Do San in Startup. Or there’s something similar in their diffidence before the girl they crush on. Cute!
I was only able to watch the episode in bits and pieces while being on standby for work calls etc. However if you’re going to do a re-watch tomorrow. I may pop in and out.
V(=^･ω･^=)v
Episode 8 was another riveting episode. Show continues to give us backstories. We get to know what Sigma did and does and how the diary came into SH’s hands.
And with SH we come to realise that the looping back from past to future-present must have taken place before. This SH is wearing the watch given by Jae Sun, but she shouldn’t have met him yet.
The chilling apocalypse is brought home by SH once again being perfectly at home amidst the debris of war around her. There was so much pathos in the incongruent celebration by SH of her birthday with gun in hand, among the dead, amidst once fun rides, broken and covered over by nature.
I continue to marvel at the detailed rendering of the vast scenes of destruction.
Kudos to PSH for the action scenes where she managed to fight and shoot her way out of deadly situations. She was convincing, although I cringe at the number of people who were killed just so her dad might survive.
This is the common thread that links the characters. They are prepared to sacrifice many others for specific beloved individuals. It’s only Sigma’s motives that are still unclear. We know he wants the uploader to be made, but for what end? It seems he’s in favour of the war, but why?
So uhhh question maybe i’m being dumb but the original taesul and seohae how did they fall in love to lead to the first war for her to then find the diary again? Because at this time she’s 8 right when he’s his age, so how did the first seohae and taesul meet each other? or am I being confused also seohae’s mum is a bit off? like could she be from the future? we didn’t really see her die. i think I’m starting to get confused by the drama a bit
@PM3, not sure if my comments are in your spam folder? I posted on Vincenzo thread 2x but I did not see it. I thought I made an error in posting but there might be error in my email? Appreciate if you can check. Thanks!
Hi GB.. my question is exactly the same as you. What is Sigma’s motive… But looking at Sigma smile when he told that the everyone is gonna die, I get the feeling that he’s a psycho that just want to make sure the country is collapsed. He just love to see it (maybe ?)
Oh and I think I missed the scene/post that explain about time paradox.. i wondered why SH’s mon crying when she called her. I should read more about it.. my next question is how many iterations that actually happened.. if it’s already many times, she should note the more accurate instructions to her younger self. When she touch her corpse and become hologram and suddenly all of her memories appeared in her mind..
(I thought previously it was SH mom that give her the diary. But actually it’s SH herself, I already suspected it when Tae Sul give her the new one and she realized that TS is the one who give the diary in the first place.)
So I think SH doesn’t have regret yet when using the uploader. She just want to follow the instruction because she feels she has to. (Is it the time paradox also? I get the feeling that her actual purpose of travel time is saving TSul: the love of her life. But she hasn’t met TSul yet so she convinced herself that it is to save the country from War. What do you all think?)
And thanks @packmule3 for the previous thread about liminality. I watched extraordinary you and seeing how the concept of stage/shadow is connected to liminality in Sisyphus = so fun!
why the Asian Mart boss told the girl employee to keep the downloader on? Is he waiting for something.. or someone to appear in 2020-2021 timeline?
And where is HanTaeSan!? I hope he’s alright.. after Sigma beat him really bad..
Done! I approved the latest post.
I don’t know EXACTLY what happened. Your email address is fine.
All I can tell is your two posts were sent to my spam box along with the Bible spam messages and ads for viagra. Weird.
@PM3 – thanks! LOL! Looks like your keyword screening works for spam. I just posted mentioning the b and v words and I did not see it. Hahaha!
Just want to let you know that I can rewatch tonight if you’re up for it. @GB can join us, too.
Haaaa, I just come here to say hello.
I watched ep 7 and 8.
I’ve many comments but not the time to write it now. And not sure I will tomorrow because of my work.
So, most important : changes of music director (episodes 9+).
I just don’t understand why, because background musics are perfect. I’m almost sure it’s the dream-team W-Signal-MOTA-SaveME (I will post timecodes).
Great episodes, made me happy and addicted. ahaha. So good drama. Sorry, it’s just a “feeling” good comment. 😉
Hi @Janey, Thanks! I will certainly need to rewatch Ep 8, and I can time myself to be online (popping in and out as need be) during your Thursday 7pm/10pm watch (Is that Friday 11am for me?)
@moonstar512
You’ve got so many questions too!!
The Time Paradox
I’m just taking it at its most simple interpretation. That between the chicken and the egg, both had to come first. I quote Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporal_paradox)
” A causal loop is an interestingly simple paradox of time travel that occurs when a future event is the cause of a past event, which in turn is the cause of the future event. Both events then exist in spacetime, but their origin cannot be determined. A causal loop may involve an event, a person or object, or information.”
This is the causality issue that was mentioned in BOD before. SH’s diary is the example of the object that causes the loop. We see in Ep 8 that she found it in her grave. It’s interesting that she’s not freaked out in seeing her own corpse, touching it and getting ‘flashback memories’ of a life she had not lived. I wonder if this means, she knows she’s ‘been here, done this’ before.
If she’d never found the diary, she’d never have gone to 2020. If she hadn’t gone to 2020 where the diary was destroyed, she’d never get the diary from Tae Sul. If she hadn’t received the diary from Tae Sul, she’d not have a diary to find at her grave. That’s the paradox. Which came first?
The Ep 8 Future Seo Hae and the Diary
She seems to have been buried (with Tae Sul?) and with the diary in post holocaust Seoul. The scene of her finding her own grave was strange. Was it a spot marked on her map that she was told she had to visit? Locating her grave and the diary seemed to have been a hit or miss affair. She might really not have noticed it at all if she’d not been rooting around ‘hunting’, as she called it. Leaving the diary in the grave where anyone else might have found and removed it, was at odds with the need to pass on the diary to herself, in order to prevent the war. It looked like someone else buried her and left the diary there for her to find, if luck would have it. Perhaps this someone else also left the map to point the next SH to the spot on the map.
The diary was also not placed in the coffin/box, but outside it and covered in rubble. This raises the question about why… did someone want it to be easily found by the next SH? Who would that be, and who else knows the contents of the diary, and who might be a friend?
Or was this a person who wanted to leave it to FATE that SH might come along to retrieve the diary, or she might not, and so be it?
Or would she always find the diary, because she always did?
@GB That was amusing when Seohae told Taesul to go and wait inside Asia Mart. Although he doesn’t seem like the type to be bossed around, I liked how he followed her orders even though he gave that sulky look haha. Showed how much he trusts her now, and the bridge scene showed he needs her emotional support, not just help staying alive. They’re a good team, Taesul with his genius engineer mind and Seohae with her combat skills. Also, nice observation about the watch in ep 8 – I missed that!
@GB @moonstar512 I was wondering the same thing – what is Sigma’s main motive? He wants the uploader and the world to be destroyed…yes, it could be that he’s just an evil guy who wants to feel powerful. He’s obsessed with money which seems to be a recurring theme with the lotto, and twice Taesul tried to give money to send people away (first, his hyung, and second, Seohae) and both refused the money. This is in contrast to Sigma who kept collecting loads of it. But if the war happens, then his money won’t matter so I don’t know…
The characters have various motivations all related to Taesul, the uploader and the war. Hard to keep them all straight. Some want to save Taesul, others want to kill him. Some want the uploader while others want to stop it from being invented. Some want to stop the war / save the world, others don’t care. I think Sigma is the only one who wants the war. Seohae and Taesan both want to save Taesul, but only Seohae wants to save the world, too. Interesting that they both have the same motive to save Taesul, but Taesan wants her to stay away and believes she would be putting Taesul in danger. She needs to stay with him to save him, though?
@moonstar512 I think the Asia Mart boss knows he can come back through the downloader. The CB guy says he survived the war because he was in jail at the time, so still locked up by the CB. The boss wants the downloader to come back from the future, or maybe he needs to keep it on for the ‘higher ups” that were mentioned in ep 7 (wondering who are these higher ups)? I think it’s inevitable that the CB will search the place and find the downloader, though.
Kind of random, but I was wondering what happened to Taesan and Taesul’s parents? There was a glimpse of them in the flashback of the young brothers playing by the sea. We know about the family of other characters such as Seohae and Seojin, but as far as we know, Taesul’s parents are not around. Are they just irrelevant to the story? Maybe that’s what bonds the brothers so closely; they don’t have any other family.
About the blueprints, wondered why Taesan didn’t just destroy them if having them around was endangering Taesul’s life?
Eddie Kim appears briefly only a few times. In one quick shot, he’s sitting in Taesul’s home looking pensive. How much does he know now? Also, I’m wondering how the event at the end of ep 7 will affect Seojin – if she will try harder to keep her mom alive or if she will become angry towards Sigma for everything.
@moonstar512 and @Beingwritten
@Beingwritten You’re not the only one. I’m confused too… and just as I wrote above to @moonstar512, that’s because we are watching a paradox in progress. How could TSul and SH ever have met, if not for the diary, and how the diary ever could have come to be with SH if they had never met.
On the one hand, we seem to see a beginning to the paradox in how SH finds the diary this Ep 8. But not really, because the diary already contains information on Tae Sul and Sigma that this future 2032? Seo Hae has not heard of yet. These kinds of paradoxes may never get resolved (I don’t know if any show ever attempted to resolve it!!)
You have an interesting comment about SH’s mum. There’s nothing that shows she’s from another time. It’s interesting that when future SH speaks to her ie makes a connection to someone in her past, something happens to affect her mum, and she starts crying without being aware of it.
Similarly, when future SH touches her own corpse, making a connection across time, something happens and she gets flashback/memories of the previous SH.
I’d like to know if anything strange happens to her 2020 dad should she make a connection with him as well.
@royangi I need to make an amendment to the ‘watch’ on SH’s wrist. I went back to check Ep 7 and no, *sigh* it’s not the same watch. The strap and the watch face are different.
I thought that there was another great paradox of how she got the watch without meeting Jae Sun, but I was wrong.
Howevever it was interesting that when SH was in the Amusement Park by herself, she was NOT wearing any watch. When she went to the Hospital, we was. I have to re-watch and see if she put on the watch when she went out again to get the antibiotics.
@GB, I may rewatch a bit later at 8PM PST. Have to eat dinner with the family and won’t be able to pull it in this time. Not sure if @Pm3 can do it.
Just when we think we are getting answers, SH discovers her grave and diary! More questions again…
I like how you explained the time paradox, which comes first, the chicken or the egg. This made me think… Why did the chicken cross the street? To get to the liminal side! 😂
LOL @Janey I’m in liminal state now … standing by for work and still thinking about Sisyphus. If you can wait until 8.30pm your time (12.30pm my time), I may be able to join you. I can have an early lunch and then pop in. As it’s lunch time for me, I can generally ignore work calls, so it may be better for me. 😉
Motif?
I was thinking that the motif of Seo Hae not killing someone/something out of better feeling, and because she’s more humane, will come back to affect her decisions, and the results of her efforts. She did not want to shoot the innocent rabbit or the boy or even to hurt the hospital staff, but all were killed by other people anyway. Might this be a pattern that she has to avoid?
We take it that SH has been looping back from future to 2020 multiple times, failing to stop the war each time. Each time she will do something differently or meet someone new, however the big results remain unchanged. She may have to do something totally against her normal inclination or make a decision that is different, in order to achieve a different outcome and break out of the loop.
Meaning, she might have to do contradictory things for eg. she might need to do what Tae San wants and stay away from TSul (but we saw that they get weird episodes happening to them when they part). Still it might break the cylce.
Or she might need to go against her better nature and shoot innocent bunnies etc to break the loop/cycle.
Or she has to stay alive past her birthday or whatever date that she died, to break the cycle.
If her doing things the same way or not killing out of the goodness of her heart, still leads to those people dying, then she may have to do something radically different, to keep Tae Sul alive.
Okay. I’m here for the rewatch. I just posted something to get it out of the way.
Hahaha.
I saw that chicken joke.
I also remembered your joke about the “vitamin sea.” That had me chuckling, too.
Props Problem!?
Are we being trolled by the Props Department?
I took screenshots of the diaries old and new. The only difference seemed to be the accessories dangling from the diaries. The older diary had more beads and the newer one had maybe 1 bead and 2 or more stars dangling from it. I couldn’t get a good screenshot to see the accessories in detail.
So from the beads we see with the diary in Ep 8, I take this to be the diary that Seo Hae takes with her in her suitcase.
However the photo that falls from it… we see it in the same scene with cuts. One moment it’s a photo with blank back, and the next it has words written across it. *Eyeroll* so is this photo meant to be the one that she sent to TSul’s apartment? If so, then it’s a sign that she failed in her last time loop journey, because the photo is with her corpse in a destroyed Seoul. If it’s a photo with a blank back, then this is the ‘start’ of sorts, of her mission.
Here are the backs of the same photo.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1pag3pJ08-hAx7VOwuwGhStdZdbHyihzh/view?usp=sharing
The words on the back:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/19xXAYa-wcxUpsG7Xy4QP7fnFNohJLsHL/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1im-1rKY9bDhB9RwQMKOWQeNsdWc6SBM5/view?usp=sharing
Here’s the diary in the rubble: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_ZeV5mmK9eAlUQ0_nT0r7GUH3dchJpne/view?usp=sharing
Here’s the diary she brought in her suitcase. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1MhR87Z8x9mbQJ82XSWmCILLW3kakURP8/view?usp=sharing
This is the diary TSul bought. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TauWXhVSRdldvAxtx6igi_lOv1FdOFbn/view?usp=sharing
Yes, I’m annoyed with this prop director.
Forgetting the wedding band, messing up Seojin’s diploma. then this diary wedding photo.
What the heck?
The only thing he did right was the Mondrian painting. lol.
Rewatching Ep 8
Is that his number on his upper arm? Is that a bloody number “1” tattooed on his arm?
Really now. I said he shouldn’t have been called sigma. He’s alpha!
Hello 👋 I’m here rewatching Ep8!
Yup, I saw #1 also on his arm.
This actor! If there’s a Korean version of “The Hobbit,” he’ll make a splendid Gollum.
How come Sigma doesn’t know how to tie a necktie?
Did you recognize the tune he was humming? I thought it was poor version of Schubert’s Trout Quintet. lol.
OK I’m here!
His suitcase is full of meds and newspapers. Cash is king!!! He is really intent on making money. No lotto then yet? More horse racing.
That’s Sigma for you… a man with a proper plan. He’s got everything he needs to make many killings in gambling and investment, and he arrives ready to kill. Just that he can’t kill Tae San, because he has a plan.
I remember the fund manager guy was in Record of Youth as a bank employee brothe of PBG. Oh, reference on Sep 11 attack.
I think he just wants to get rich quickly so he could entrap Taesul.
If he really loved money, then he would arrange his money in stacks, and neat piles. But he just throws them all around his place.
My impression there is that money is just that means to his endgame. Whatever that endgame is, it’s still too early to tell.
So weird that he gets away with smashing someone on the head in public. No cameras? No good samaritans to stop him?
Not in 2001, no CCTVs back then. But there should have been good samaritans to report his description, and so on.
Ah that explains why he gets away with murder, literally.
Yes, money means nothing to him except that it’s a means to an end.
I’d still put them in a bag or something, what a mess!
When I saw this investment manager, I knew he’d not live long.
Sigh … so much workplace violence.
But the tables turn.
I wonder why he picked that specific manager to deal with his business. Were they related?
And I noticed that look on his face when the manager said that his wife was pregnant and he was going to have a baby boy.
He looked angry.
I won’t be surprised if he uses the cash as fuel for starting his fire. But that’s an artificial fireplace.
Hi @GB!!!
From the the very start, it was Sigma.
“Money burns easily but people don’t.”
Is that his main motivation to burn people with the nuclear war?
It seems he despises anything of that time, anything not to do with him or his plan. He despises the meal before him and eats sardine!!! Does not have any fellow feeling for a person with a wife and family. More like a Zero not Sigma!!
Yes, he was “littering” the whole place with money. If he was avaricious or plain in love with money, then he would have taken care of his money.
As he said, money was for burning. But not people.
Either he lost somebody he really loved or he wasn’t loved by anybody at all.
Trying to ‘play god’ in keeping alive people who should die leads of course to great calamity – like suicide in Kim’s case.
The sardines is referenced to the future, what they eat are more canned goods. Also, money in the future is burned as fuel in the future as per SH. Money to Sigma was a means to an end.
But he likes fish though. Mackerel.
And I was annoyed to hear Taesul explain the whole meaning of sigma. He said the man was sigma because sigma stands for the letter “s” and Sisyphus starts with the letter “s.”
That’s it?!! S stands for Sisyphus?? What’s this? Sesame Street??!
Sounds right @Janey.
Wonder how Tae San figured out the rest of it in 2010, I believe.
Seriously … that was the reason TSul says he was Sigma?
So how does fund manager figure out that TSul should never meet Sigma? He had a whole bunch of papers and a photo with him.
I’ve been thinking that everyone has a motive that boils down to being selfish.
Oct 31 is my birthday LOL.
I thought about that, too, Janey. That he ate canned sardines because that was what he ate in the future. However…
He was much older than SeoHae. He should have memories of all the good food that he used to eat as a grownup before the nuclear war. Didn’t he miss those?
I think it’s about his character. He was hell-bent on revenge, destruction, or whatever his goal was for teleporting back to 2001 (and can you believe that? 2001?!) that he didn’t want to see the good things to enjoy in life.
Boy. Somebody really did a number on him.
Unlike Seohae. She too had a mission but she took time to enjoy the tomatoes and the fresh air.
Even Jung Hyunki the sniper was
“romantic/idealist” about going back home. He returned with a suitcase of noodles to feed his mom.
This Sigma was just full of anger.
Curious on the comment of fund manager when he was at the view deck with Sigma. “the CEO recruitment will go well”. Wasn’t TSul the CEO when Q+T got listed? This was 2010 conversation.
After that scene is was sep 20, 2020 and he was running from something. The article says CEO TSul richest stock millionaire. “I have to tell HTS not to meet with him”. Then got hit by a car.
Heheh! Those 2 guys are like kids over the same girl.
Poor Park is still in custody. Wonder if his boys got out.
So he escaped the war by being held in custody somewhere safe.
I liked how TSul extrapolated where Sigma was painting from, from the painting.
I think that was what TSul said. When we reach that part, I’ll take down notes.
I don’t know how the fund manager discovered Sigma’s plan for Taesul. IIRC, the papers only said that he was the youngest millionaire. Nothing to be petrified about.
My initial guess was he encountered one of the assassins from the future. That’s why he was running fast.
Yes about Sigma being full of anger. He took the trouble to come back for so many years 2001 – 2020 but he was only interested in getting the uploader made… to bring back someone…. to wreak his revenge… these are the possibilities.
What a sad and joyless existence.
He does not even lock his door. What does that show? Supreme confidence that no one can really hurt him. He’s unafraid of anything from before his time.
Hahaha. Now your birthday is connected to a fictional Doomsday event, GB.
But I still haven’t figured out why Seohae and dad were hiding like they were fugitives or “rebels” while there seems to be an official government in place. Shouldn’t the government take care of all their remaining survivors?
Like Park, Sigma also knows how things will play out and when he’ll die or not die. So he fears nothing.
My subs did not say that Sigma and Sisyphus were linked by the letter ‘s’.
I think the boys were released. He told Bingbing that the CB was only looking for him and wasn’t interested in them as long as he gave himself up to them.
Then, he said something like “here I go again” implying that this wasn’t his first run-in with the CB.
Yes, he was with the CB when the nuclear strikes happened. lol.
mr Park is a famous person? Or is that a sarcastic remark. Then he says to CB head that he’s grown a lot. They know each other.
Yes, I had the same question about SH and dad of the future. Why were they scavenging and fighting for stuff against other scavenger groups. And why did her mum leave the bunker.
One confusing piece… in Ep 1 she still mentions her mum as if mum is still alive. But here, we are made to think mum died.
@Janey Yup, that explains Park and CB Head. They lived through the war together but on opposite sides.
So we’re back with SH sleeping again. She keeps getting hurt and has to be patched up, but she recovers super fast. She sleeps a lot in between.
Amazing that TSul can get to see SH’s home videos!!!
Sometimes I don’t like Tsul! He and his ego! His motivation for finding Sigma is because he was deceived and fooled. He did not seem to care about the world ending. And even for SH putting herself in danger. He can be selfish.
I replayed that again.
I think Seohae meant that her mom would die again (like she did the first time) if she didn’t go back to stop the war. She didn’t want to see her mom dying all over again.
I’m not sure if the translation is bad…or if the writer is at fault for deliberately trying to be vague and keeping the story “mysterious” and (needlessly) complicated.
Sept 30, SH’s birthday and so he will bring her to the same amusement park that she’d been to as a child.
She has a very ‘healthy’ attitude to rooting around in the waste of destruction. It’s terrible to look at, but she’s inured after more than 10 years living in this state.
I’d think that all the stuff she picks up outside would be radioactive… not safe to eat!!!
They sure spent a loooootttt of money on fake plant props. Noticed some that look fake but most look very realistically draped and wound around stuff and growing on buildings.
CGI of wild dog and rabbit a bit rough.
When she comes home, she does not have the watch with leather strap on. When she leaves again, she does. I have to watch whether she put it on.
That knife wound is nasty. She needs stitches. Feel guilty pls, Tsul. SH is battered and bruised because of you. JaeSun gets it.
@Janey, yes, TSul is one selfish brat. He’d been indulged by his Hyung. No quite the kind of character I’d call a ‘hero’.
SH does this run to the hospital in broad daylight and now one sees her sailing across between buildings!
I like SH’s escape from the hospital with gun blazing. She’s a real sharp shooter even when on the run.
The props for the theme park looked good! The pirate ride with dead people was cringey. The snacks would have been spoiled and expired after many years. Even the canned goods they forage on were from years ago.
Plants are also growing and lots of trees. So the earth is healing? But no produce yet because of radioactivity?
Yes, the writer wasn’t so good with the world-building in the post-apocalypse. Like the snacks were edible??
Even if those snacks weren’t radioactive, they were only supposed to have only a shelf life of months…not a decade! Would you eat 14- year-old Doritos?
They had to show her running away in a forest of sorts… too much for props to create many street scenes for her to run in.
I liked the scene of her standing on the top of an overgrown building, as if it was part of the landscape, and looking out to see the rest of the city.
SH bedazzles everything! Her weapons and even her zip line slider.
You’re right @GB, she is a woman-child.
I know, right? He’s selfish…or perhaps the better word is self-absorbed and self-centered! He thinks the whole world revolves around him because he’s a genius. 🙂
The “giver” in this relationship is Seohae.
Well, at last the child part of the woman-child can cry a while and sleep comfortably (like a babe) on debris in a sideways fallen building!! very arty that. Glass walls have become a glass floor. Something else interesting …nothing much scares her.
Her map has a part circled in red with red hearts. Is that the place she’s come to here?
She seems to be standing on earth/ground but below her is a building… so it was a rooftop garden? Great work with the scenery.
Her grave has a red cross… she’s Christian, I guess.
“What you’re looking at right now is yourself.” – these words are different from the firs time we saw the subs of the letter? I thought those words were something like ‘Don’t be surprised that what you are look at now is from yourself.’
I thought it’s the same watch as Sun gave her but it’s a different one. No angel’s wings.
SH standing on the precipice seems apt. I did not realize she was on top of a building.
I wonder what she was looking for in the map. Then she found the grave.
The corpse glitched and fizzed because only it had time traveled. Seo Hae had not yet gone back. However she seems to get the memories and the emotions of the dead SH.
she didn’t lose the medicine, did she?
I wondered if the glass bottles in her suitcase contained medicine/pills/drugs for her mother. My wild guess was her mother opted not to stay in the bunker because she needed something to survive that wasn’t readily available inside the bunker… like her supply of meds.
Good guess about the mum, perhaps she was already ill.
Interesting to leave us hanging at SH’s future-present rather than back in 2020.
When we next see her, will she once again be just opening her eyes?
Yes.
I talked about this in the Quick Takes. This whole flashback happened before SeoHae got on the uploader. She touched the skeleton and she absorbed all the memories of the remains.
But the skeleton really didn’t time-travel. The original Seohae was buried there, along with Taesul (it can’t be her dad). The nuclear war happened, and time passed by.
@pkml3 If she brought back meds for her mum, then she should have been trying to make contact with mum, to give them to her before she herself gets killed. We don’t see her using the meds, only the diary and her gun. I wonder how much ammunition she has left!!
I have the same feeling that her mom was sick hence she stayed behind. I was thinking there’s no space in bunker but it did not seem like that’s the case. The bunker they stayed when mom did not go with them is the same bunker SH and dad live in.
@GB – yes the words seem different from the first diary. And there’s mention of Sigma and that TSul is the man she loves.
hahaha.
Maybe, she’ll open her eyes. Or maybe she’ll be closing her eyes for the last time. Who knows?
That’s my guess about the mom. There must be a good reason for her to leave the bunker.
BTW, I noticed a Mary statue in the bunker. It was behind Seohae when she sat down with her dad to eat snacks. 🙂
No the corpse didn’t time travel, but the living SH who died had done so… the glitching still occurred, even for the corpse!
Hah! @pkml3, another RC article sighting! I should keep a compilation and name them by the show.
Catch you both on the Start Up Rewatch tomorrow. Gentle reminder to open a thread @pkml3. I’m going to re-watch the diary entry to see how it differs from the first time.
Yes, it’s the same bunker. The only difference is SH and her dad accumulated stuff from foraging over ten years so their bunker looked cluttered.
Yes. The words were different. But I don’t know anymore whether the writers truncated the first one diary entry for effect…just like what they did when Taesan and Seohae met at the party. Seohae only revealed what he said in full in Episode 7 so in Episode 6, the impression I had was Taesan was being paranoid.
The diary found at the burial site was also wrinkled, while the original one (or the diary this current Seohae lost in the river) didn’t look wrinkled at all.
I’m hoping that this meant that the whole past was NOT entirely copied, and that “variations” could be made. Of course, the major events would still have to take place, but the minor events leading up to them or the little details would change.
Take for instance, the stabbing attempt on Taesul. This wasn’t listed on Sigma’s postcard but it happened anyway.
In ep7, SH mentioned to JaeSun that she flickered because she does not have much time left in her present. It’s a side effect of time travel. But that still does not make sense how her skeleton glitched. I think the glitch can be better explained by the time paradox which also coincides with the memory transference.
Okay. Goodnight! Heading for bed now.
Will open a thread tomorrow.
Seohae might not be able to explain fully what’s going on with her because this is her first time travel, too.
BTW, did you think she was being evasive when Taesul asked her where the uploader was??
Wow it’s amazing reading so many comments.
Thanks much @GB for explaining the time paradox. I am sorry I asked so many questions.. thanks to @royangi too answer my question about Asian Market boss.. 😅😊
I thought I will be the only one who panicked when SH eating that snacks! It’s expired already, girl! Even if there is no apocalypse, you shouldn’t have eat those omg..
Yes TaeSul and his ego to find his brother. Both TaeSul and TaeSan don’t really care if the world’s going to end. They just care if each others are alive (?)
I agree that the one who has reason for a greater cause is SeoHae only.. she already saw what ugly it was when the war happened. She care not only about her mother but also the whole country. She also wanna save TaeSul. So the objectives of her would be:
– mother is alive
– no war
– Tae Sul is alive
Whenever I watch some series/movies about time travel/time looping.. They would stop the loop when the objective is obtained. And my concern now is whether SH actually had some thoughts about the sacrifice she should make to obtain all of them. Which include to lose something that more precious to her. (And I wonder what is more precious to her than the objectives, is it the “possibility” to live and grow old together with TS..)
And @packmule3 I thought so too about SH being evasive. I think she knows more about it.. I wonder what previous SH wrote in her diary, I believe it’s a complete tutorial/instruction to travel to 2020 which includes the possibility of where the uploader might be.. 😅
And @Janey i just remembered another question when you mentioned it. If SH has a limited time in her present, does it mean that SH will have to go back to the future, or will she die/disappear in the end when time has come?
@ Beingwritten, I also wonder how they fell in love in the first place. May be at the first loop, the uploader was invented accidentally and allowed either TS or SH did time travel, met and got married. Then somehow people misused the uploader, went back to the past and caused a war/(or whatever pain that annoyed Sigma that he was so determined to end the world).
If the downloader can be accidentally invented in TS’s simple lab, perhaps the uploader can be invented without all the cash Sigma throwing at him in the first round.
However, I am not sure if the show will ever be able to explain to us how TS can be the greatest love of SH’s life in the first round (without the many going back to save him loops). May be we have to take it for granted that he was.
@GB, to break the pattern, I am wondering if they have to let go of each other? If TS has never invented the uploader, they wouldn’t be able to meet. As much as I wish they can be together, I just don’t see how logically they can. May be selfish TS didn’t give up the chance of meeting SH and didn’t care about saving the world. He chose the woman instead of saving the world in every loop.
However did SH said the uploader was invented in 2021 (correct me if I am wrong)? If TS died on 31 Oct 2020 then someone else would be building it.
Also, in the merged memories, one of the last scenes was SH shooting with a gun and she looked very shocked when she saw that memory. Who did she shoot that made her so shocked?
@moonstar512, is it possible she died together with TS therefore they can be buried together?
Sigma motivation is driven by wanting the world to end. May be in his backstory humankind has disappointed him somehow. Such a determination to end the world – it also comes with a high chance that we may not think his justification is enough, so I am managing my expectation when the revelation finally comes.
I do hope that in each loop they learn something so they are better in the next loop. I am hoping TS can learn to be less selfish in the next half but who knows, let’s wait and see.
Many comments to catch up on! 🙂 Makes sense about Sigma wanting the money as a means to an end. He threw a wad of it into the fire which he probably wouldn’t do if he really valued it. He needed the money to invest in Taesul’s company.
I’m wondering if Sigma is working alone or for somebody. And the deformed guy showing up near his place made me think there’s some connection.
When Seohae’s mom shed the tear, I thought it was because she knew somehow that Seohae from the future had called her. I don’t know how she would know, but maybe there is more to her story…
@GB The place where Seohae found the diary is Namsan Tower, at least that’s what was circled on her map. Also, I think the first translation of the diary message was an error. I tried to read the letter when it appeared in ep 3 and although I’m not a native speaker, I’m pretty sure it said “what you’re looking at is yourself” in Korean. I had been confused by that and thought I didn’t understand correctly, but it made sense when she saw herself in the grave.
Taesan’s letter said “I believe the outcome will be good when good choices are accumulated.” Maybe that’s how the time loop can be broken, making better (less selfish?) choices during each loop.
@royangi, Thanks for the translation of the letter. Yes, I believe that if that diary was meant to be found with SH’s dead body, then those words make perfect sense.
You’ve made pertinent points. Yes I feel that deformed downloaded guy was working with or for Sigma. He may have moved on to do recruiting on his end, to get his own minions. He seems to be the boss, working for himself.
I was theorising that SH’s mum cried because a connection made between the times and between people with close ties, would bring along emotions/memories. In the same way, when SH made a connection by touching her own dead self, she was filled with the memories and emotions of her past-future, and cried as well.
Ah thanks for pointing out Namsan Tower. That explains the 2 heart shapes drawn near it on the map. She might have been on a nearby building on the hill, when she found her grave.
Yes I like this idea. If we consider that Sigma means the sum or summation of evil choices to bring about destruction, then Tae San’s accumulation (also a summation) of good choices can lead to hope and many good things. We need the good to counter the evil, and for many individuals (especially our main protagonists) to change from the norm and to make unselfish and others-centred choices.
@GB Sigma as a summation of evil choices, interesting! I saw there was more discussion about this on the other thread; will have to read more closely.
Episode 7.
Some remarkable events, with Timecode.
For the BGM (BackGround Musics) quoted in example, I put youtube links.
It is thus possible to make a precise comparison of certain pieces.
The comparison of the styles is however more general, on the totality of the discs.
02:21 – Sun Turns on the TV, and falls on the news flash with Tae Sul. The chance!
03:40 – At Seo Hae’s mother’s house, there is a basket with oranges, but no bananas.
03:55 – The props man did his job well this time. Lots of family photos on the walls.
05:30 – What is this bunker that doesn’t close from the inside, and forces the mother to close it from the outside? And how do you get out of it after that?
06:46 – Sun sees the control bureau evacuating the corpse of his boss. He deduces that the ICB is responsible for his death, but certainly wrongly.
The corpse was discovered after the hanging, and of course, long after the moment of death, which took place before the pursuit of Sun and Seo Hae on the roofs.
So, that the ICB is probably not the perpetrator of this crime.
08:30 – Before playing the lottery, Sun hesitates, he says he is afraid of the control bureau. So we know that the scriptwriters did not forget the fact that the control bureau might catch him. The reason why this does not happen is unknown.
09:30 – Sun first goes to a store with the broken lotto machine. Then, he misses a few cents that he finds on the floor. In short, a lot of luck, real lotto before rigged lotto. With a suspense due to the time, multiple close-ups on the clock all along.
10:47 – Sun wins, close up on a drink poster with a lime. But we don’t see Sun going to get his money back. And so, we don’t know how long afterwards, or how he would be controlled.
“Sweet: You will be full of hapiness with drinks”.
10:50 – The lime drink is used to segue into the pool scene.
11:12 – A strange detail, Seo Hae’s face is displayed on Sun’s smarphone. Impossible to know what. The face comes out of the shadows, as if it was a reflection rather than a wallpaper. Or maybe it’s a thought of Sun projected on the screen.
11:22 – Very good BGM, looks like a simple BGM from W.
(Title: episode 9 of W, airport/taxi father scene 8:30, never published on the various artists disc, alas).
12:25 – BGM typically in the style of several Signal drama BGMs.
(Titles: 과거는 바뀔 수 있습니다, 프로파일링, 형기대의 하루)
https://youtu.be/0KiiVkOEBaE?t=71
https://youtu.be/-XEewyAtB_k?t=12
https://youtu.be/HJcGRr3VsvQ?t=59
12:43 – Sun spies Tae Sul and Seo Hae when they sneak into Tae Sul’s house.
I’m having a hard time placing this moment in terms of dates, and seeing if it matches with the time Sun could have spent on her side (spying on ICB, begging, playing lotto, getting the money back, going to the hairdresser, buying a car, sunbathing by the pool). Not to mention what he bought for his family, since he says that thanks to Seo Hae, his family was saved.
15:00 – Sun says that he was born in 1997 and Seo Hae in 2012. This parenthesis in the dialogue, well brought but resembling an insert, makes one think of an information to be given to the viewer, for both dates.
16:20 – Sun gives a round, golden watch as a gift. This is rather appropriate for a time travel story.
The watch reads 5:45pm. There is a golden bee design with wings spread in the center. As for the bracelet, it can be replaced by another one if needed.
16:56 – BGM sublime. In the style of some of MOTA.
(Titles: 내면의 갈등 Inner conflict, 우연한 만남 Accidental encounter)
https://youtu.be/7rupUq38kxg
https://youtu.be/luXCVOLRfQw
Seo Hae calls her mother but gives up.
18:05 – The mother cries for no reason, after the phone call yet no conversation!
19:00 – Seo Hae says that the war will break out on October 31. 2020 I guess.
19:20 – Seo Hae explains why she glitches and almost disappears. Side effect of time travel. She doesn’t have much time left here.
What happens to her afterwards? No explanation. Is she annihilated? Or does she come back in the future?
25:24 – A dialogue badly translated or that I don’t understand. When they decide to use the machine to teleport the cup.
The assistant says “If we use it, the superiors will withdraw”. As if the organization of broker Park depended on other people.
25:40 – An important but difficult point. The assistant describes how they will send the cup.
1 – They store the cup in a package. This package is stored in a post office box for a long time.
2 – Several years will pass. Someone in the future will see the indications given for the package, date and location where it should be downloaded in the past.
3 – The package is sent to the past, which corresponds to the present of the drama.
Here, the uploader is used to teleport the cup, but it must go through this complicated process.
The machine that broker Park and his assistants use is an downloader and cannot teleport a package, this is the important point.
This tells us that AT LEAST, the uploader can teleport people and objects in time to a specific LOCATION.
On the other hand, we still don’t know if the date can be chosen. Indeed, maybe in the future, the person who is going to send the package must wait for a precise date to do it.
We also learn that the geographical location is easier for small objects, and the risk of failure is lower if the objects are simple.
27:20 – Seo Hae chooses the wedding picture to put in the package.
Here, considering the total process:
1 – The film of the photo is from the future but the photo was developed in the present.
2 – The photo (with the inscription) is stored until the future.
3 – The photo is sent from the future to the past. (the present in the episode)
27:56 – Broker Park says he was against marriage, in a way that suggests he changed his mind afterwards and got married.
28:16 – Broker Park says he needs the cup, because “when it breaks” he will know it has arrived (in the present). No idea why he says this, and how he would get the information from the cup breaking.
28:25 – The assistant begins the download of the cup. Nothing extraordinary about this, except for one detail.
The assistants still haven’t put the cup in the mailbox. Let’s imagine that they are stopped in the meantime and that the cup never arrives in the mailbox.
This would create a paradox, since causality would no longer be respected.
I wonder: has anyone ever tried this as an experiment?
Download the cup first, then never put it in the mailbox (break it for example).
28:45 – Seo says that Sigma is holding Tae Sul prisoner. She confuses Sigma with So-Jin and her father. But it is logical that she confuses them.
29:10 – Broker Park laughs “you know you can’t change the future”.
“Nothing will change, no matter what you do”.
29:40 – Broker Park just admits, he would hope that the future could be changed, but alas, it seems impossible. Notion of hope instilled by Seo Hae finally.
Seo Hae is determined in her conviction that the future can be changed. Without proof?
30:05 – The screen displays the percentage of the download. The assistant needs to use a headset. We don’t know what the headset is for. Maybe to locate in 3d the place of appearance of the downloaded object.
30:20 – BGM in the style of Signal.
(Title: 흔적을 찾아서)
https://youtu.be/5mAz47XnqOk?t=42
36:20 – Seo Hae fires a sniper shot, all the while having the phone stuck against his shoulder. Tssss. Why doesn’t she have a hands-free kit?
Probably because it’s more fun that way?
45:00 – The safe is supposed to have been booby-trapped, so that the contents would be destroyed if forced. But we only see here an old, rusty and rather fragile safe, with no particular mechanism…
45:45 – BGM in the style of W.
(Title: Like Usual Couples – Jung Se Rin)
https://youtu.be/3uOJcZEHskU
46:30 – It’s not smarter that Tae San keeps the uploader’s plan on him all the time. He is being chased, and even taking risks (he was in the villa at the party).
And we know that he will be captured by Sigma (either in the future, or right now if the scene was set in the present).
50:25 – An army of supermodels storm the Broker Park store.
53:20 – The way Broker Park is surrendering is really not believable. And why would he surrender in the first place? Anyone would know that this is a diversion.
57:40 – There are indeed windows on the other side of the room, which explains why So-Jin’s father can be targeted by red laser pointer.
59:04 – Seo Hae’s aiming position is credible.
01:00:40 – Every time Eddie Kim is going to make a public speech, Tae Sul arrives at the last moment to steal his thunder.
01:05:35 – Great BGM.
Impossible to post because of youtube links. Episode 7 is probably in the SPAM box.
Done. I retrieved it already. 🙂
@packmule3, in a flash! lol! Thanks.
I will rewatch episode 8 now.
I don’t know yet if I’ll get more comparisons (and links) about BGM into it.
I need at least 3h to watch and write, maybe more.
Episode 8, after rewatch, with timecodes.
01:05 – View on the uploader. After checking, it’s exactly the same device and the same surrounding details as in episode 1.
The view is close up, impossible to know if there are other people in the hangar.
01:20 – First close-up on Sigma, in the subway. I wondered why the camera showed his shoulder first, while the rest is blurred.
We notice a kind of small red debris stuck on his shoulder (or a blood trail?).
But above all, we notice that there is no barcode engraved on his shoulder.
So Sigma is not part of the immigration process to the past.
Either he used the machine before anyone else. (Theory, the time jump gap is invariant, 20 years).
Or, he is the last one to use it. (Theory, the last to leave the future becomes the first to arrive in the past).
In episode 7, we know that it is possible to choose the place of appearance, but there is still a doubt that the place is determined by the downloader, the uploader, or both at the same time.
If it depends only on the uploader, it means that Sigma wanted to appear in the subway, near Tae San.
When Tae San takes the picture with the attack dates, Sigma does nothing to take it back.
Was it one of his objectives to give this picture to Tae San?
02:00 – Sigma glitches. Then he reappears further on the oar. It’s as if he teleported to his own future.
In episode 7, we know that this is a side effect of time travel (is it possible to control this faculty?).
Seo Hae says that her time is limited. What happens next?
Will she teleport to her future, and make bigger and bigger time jumps?
Does the person who glitches actually experience the moment between when she disappears and when she reappears?
02:26 – Sigma picks up a stone on the railroad.
We imagine at first that he will use it against Tae San.
Not at all! It is to be used much later.
But it would have been easier to show Sigma grabbing another improvised weapon, when he needs it.
The reason we see him do this, to me, is a clue that he already knows the time loop.
He knows exactly that this stone will be used to stun the man in the street later.
He knows which man, where, how.
03:20 – Sigma hits a passer-by in the middle of the street with the stone.
And there are many people around!
And it will take him some time to move the body and get hold of his clothes.
Everything is there to show that this scene should not take place without problems.
Too many risks: Passers-by who interpose themselves, who follow him, arrival of the police, etc.
But Sigma knows in advance, that even if all the odds are against him, this event must succeed without any problems, that it is impossible that the time will be changed so that someone will come to stop him.
I think that’s why he’s shown hitting a passerby, prominently in the middle of the street, rather than quietly knocking someone out.
03:45 – Sigma doesn’t want the tie. lol! What does he have against ties?
Maybe just, he doesn’t know how to tie a necktie?
By the way, has Sun been seen in a suit with a tie?
Episode 7, we see him with designer clothes, all very expensive, but also, all casual.
04:49 – Sigma’s suitcase combination: 203113 or 203112 or 203102. Some numbers overlap.
If 203112 represents a 31/12/2020 date, that’s exactly two months after the 31/10/2020 nuclear attack.
Potentially, date of the future in which he uses the uploader. In this case, he is the very first traveler of the future.
He leaves from 31/12/2020 and arrives on 06/08/2001.
The time jump is then 7087 days, that is 19 years, 4 months and 25 days.
05:10 – The Sigma event binder goes from 2001 to 2010.
05:12 – A transition into the room is made by showing a poster of a girl praying, in the dark. Above her on the left, a light masked by a black cloud. (light of the moon? or something else?)
05:24 – We see a calendar in a reflection (reversed dates), with Sigma in the reflection. Reflection of what?
06:25 – After having earned easy money, Sigma chooses however to stay in the same shabby hotel. Just a better room, with a window.
A 3 months rental, during which he carelessly stores the money.
Conclusion: he is neither interested in luxury nor in money.
He is not interested in cleanliness either!!! It is certain that no maid of the hotel enters the room.
(Or she can give herself some serious tips, lol).
08:56 – The financial broker who helps Sigma is named Kim Dong-Hyeon.
09:15 – I don’t know what exactly he is doing: investing with his own funds for his family?
It seems more like he is investing for his regular clients (and maybe himself as well).
He is trying a risky operation that could bring him a better rank in his business.
09:35 – Again, Kim Dong-Hyeon, MD investment manager.
09:40 – He gets punished for making crazy investments, by his superiors. And of course, live, the attacks that will make his investments profitable.
10:45 – Sigma is in an expensive and luxurious apartment, sparkling floor, decorative patterns on the walls, view on the business district, and even… a brasero!
However, no trace of comfort, almost no furniture. Mainly an armchair in an empty room, and some boxes (filled with money) stored on the floor.
12:25 – In a luxury restaurant, Sigma prefers to eat his own can of sardines, with his fingers!!!
What style. He even has the nerve to wipe his fingers on his shirt. Definitely, this guy doesn’t give a shit about cleanliness lol.
The can refers to the food of the future.
Exactly how long did Sigma live after the war?
This scene makes us think… a long time.
13:12 – Sigma offers the anti-SLA medicine to So-Jin’s father. However, it takes one a month. I have doubts that his suitcase could have contained 240 vials of this medicine. (for a period of 20 years).
Is he going to get supplies from the future? Has he asked a secret laboratory to create more samples?
Good sinister BGM during this scene.
15:00 – The mother wakes up, again a very good BGM. Spatial, grandiose, chilling.
Note that the BGMs commented on episode 7 and 8: a significant number is different from the BGMs of the previous episodes, of as good quality.
The Various Artist disc of this drama is going to be excellent and varied, if they take the trouble to put all these BGM in it.
And alas, by experience, they don’t !!! On W, 3 excellent BGM are not on the disc, while they are better than other compositions that are there.
I have many other examples like that, of BGM which are missing, on other dramas.
17:25 – Investors meeting. Scene already seen in flashback the previous episodes. Except that here, we see Sigma clearly in the crowd.
I went back to watch Episode 1,
at 37:03, Kim Dong-Hyeon shakes hands with Tae Sul!
at 37:10, in the general shot, we see Sigma (in small, unrecognizable actor), isolated on the table on the right.
at 37:32, general shot, we see Sigma next to Kim Dong-Hyeon, table slightly to the right. This time, we can recognize the actor, if we really pay attention!
20:05 – Scene on the roof, 2010, at night. Kim Dong-Hyeon thanks Sigma for the avalanche of money that fell into his life.
I feel like the point of the scene is for Kim Dong-Hyeon to say “my wife is pregnant”, and then add “it’s a boy”.
After that, Sigma looks at the man for a long time, a little too long.
As if to say: “and yes dad, you are a bit stupid and naive, but the reason I did all this is so that I could be born in a family with a lot of money.”
If that’s the case, Sigma was born in 2010.
20:50 – Sigma replies “enjoy it, it’s all going to burn soon.” And he gives a worrying smile.
21:05 – 20/09/2020. The drama helps us by specifying that it is the current day. Phew, thanks!
Kim Dong-Hyeon is on the run, in possession of documents concerning Tae Sul.
He calls his wife and asks her to leave the country.
She must take “Seo-U” with her. We suppose that it is her 10 years old son.
And possibly “Seo-U = Sigma” as a child.
Kim Dong-Hyeon wants to tell Tae Sul not to meet “him” (he means Sigma?).
End of the scene, Kim Dong-Hyeon is caught by his attacker in a car. Blinding headlights. Cut.
We don’t know if he is killed or kidnapped.
26:30 – Seo Hae tells Tae Eul that the day of his death is 31/10. (2020 I guess).
Out, it’s the same date as the nuclear war!
29:11 – Tae Eul says that Kim Dong-Hyeon died in an accident a week ago!
This allows us to place the current date again: 27/09/2020.
31:07 – Broker Park interrogated harshly in an ICB cell.
His real name is Park Hyeong-do.
We learn that he is indeed from the future.
He survived the nuclear war because he was imprisoned for murder at that time.
The first lieutenant of the ICB takes out Park’s family picture (his wife is pretty he says).
He threatens to visit them. Of course, his family in the present.
A pretty ugly way to blackmail. But can it really work if time cannot be changed?
This makes broker Park laugh (because he knows it’s unchangeable and his family is safe?)
But by the way, I thought that the first lieutenant of the ICB had to spend a year before recovering from his injuries?
32:34 – Meeting of top-models, and only them besides the boss, in the ICB office.
ICB knows that Seo Hae is with Tae Sul, but they decide to put the case aside for now.
Or at least, they just want to capture Seo Hae if the opportunity arises, without forcing.
The chief makes it clear: custody! And not murder!
34:20 – Sigma visited Kim Dong-Hyeon’s family twice.
The last time was a week before Kim Dong-Hyeon fled and died.
Sigma had an argument with him.
Sigma is an artist, he makes paintings, a city that burns!
35:40 – Transition, the exact view of the painting becomes real, Seo Hae and Tae Sul look at the city from a rooftop, at night.
Tae Sul manages to triangulate the spot from where a half-abstract painting is painted, lol!
With the naked eye, by calculating all the parameters. Even the little guys in the hong-kong movie Snipers can’t do that.
If you give him a Picasso painting, I’m sure he’ll tell you where it was painted from, lol!
With one look he manages to find the exact window!!! Thooooooo! ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)>⌐■-■
37:24 – It was apartment 904! Sherlock Holmes can go sit down and knit by a fire.
He checks the picture of the painting one last time, in the windowless hallway, in front of the closed door.
“It’s probably there.” ┗(≧∀≦)┛
Then… he guesses… that… the door… Is open!
39:00 – This is indeed the same luxurious apartment as before (2002? When Sigma was burning the dough on the brasero).
Still as little furniture.
39:11 – Two busts with paint on them. (Represents gods? Or Tae Sul and Seo Hae?)
One bust is a man (dark), the other a woman, with orange paint on it.
39:55 – Clear view of the painting of Sisyphus. Tae Sul thinks that Sigma means Sisyphus.
40:13 – Seo Hae asks “why was Sisyphus punished”. Tae Sul doesn’t have time to answer.
Ha ha, we don’t know the punishment as used in the drama (there are several explanations why Sisyphus would have been punished in the mythology, and it’s not clear exactly why).
40:43 – Someone tries to enter the apartment: black shoes with thick raised heels.
Tae Sul runs after the individual, and Seo Hae is consistently 10m to 50m behind him. Running is not her specialty ^^.
41:20 – The fleeing man, if it’s really him, is a henchman of So-Jin with a scarred face (I guess in real, he’s covering the escape of So-Jin herself).
Indeed, the guy is tying his shoelace again, bent over, at this point. What an idea for someone who is running away?
41:34 – We see that the henchman has flat shoes. He wasn’t the one trying to get into the apartment!
42:33 – Seo Hae’s big boo-boo needs to be treated. Well, big boo-boo, so to speak.
Just put a bandage on a hand cut by a commando dagger… hum hum.
OST song, not great, but should please some fans…
46:16 – Seo Hae is sleeping (normal, she finished her mission, lol).
Tae Sul uses his military software able to recover data since 20 years.
Seo Hae’s family filmed Seo Hae riding a bicycle with a smartphone.
This data was collected, stored, where? Social networks? Government spying system NSA style?
There are even videos from inside the apartment. Had put to film ?
BGM on this scene: very good but classic. Very similar composition to two dramas, same harmonic progression, Road Number One and Jewel in the palace.
48:43 – We learn that Seo Hae was born on 30/09/2012. (a Sunday)
This also allows us to know the current date 30/09/2020, since it is his birthday today.
Thank you!
49:28 – Transition, in the future, it is also Seo Hae’s birthday. But for what age?
She treats herself to a trip to the carnival.
OST: very good song.
Beautiful scenery.
Very nice scene on all levels.
51:30 – Now she can talk to a skeleton. Dead from what? Burned? Bacteriological attack?
Because if it’s by radioactivity or burns, we have to see that the potato chips package didn’t burn, lol!
52:48 – A rabbit in computer graphics. Very well done. Then a wolf, ditto.
Again, she does not decide to kill… this delicious rabbit.
Too bad for her, the wolf will enjoy the rabbit stew instead. ahah.
54:40 – The father is still wounded, probably from the previous fight, confronting the punks.
This gives the excuse to go to the secure building to get the antibiotics, then run away, then finally arrive at the grave.
56:10 – Seo Hae assaults a building controlled by… who exactly?
She uses her grapin, but fortunately, no ugly stunts on green screen this time.
01:00:22 – Beginning of the gunfight scene, shorter, but better and more nervous than the previous one.
Interspersed with a good sequence of Gunfu at 01:01:10.
01:04:30 – Very good BGM, already commented in episode 7.
01:06:12 – Close up of Seo Hae’s watch. Of course, it can’t be the same as the one Sun gave her, since this event hasn’t happened to Seo Hae yet and she hasn’t gone back in time yet.
01:07:30 – Seo Hae looks at a map. I assume it’s to get home from where she is, not to find the tomb.
I think that the discovery of the tomb is fortuitous, but following a set of random events impossible to predict. She had to flee the armed troops where she could, run into the woods, fall into a temporary shelter, and then get out and walk around a bit outside to find her bearings.
BGM powerful and mystical at that moment. Something impossible and transcendent is about to happen (discovery of the grave).
01:08:21 – Yet, not yet. First some really beautiful general shots!!! Great art. Whether it is the stadium, or the view that recedes to locate the cliff where Seo Hae is (in fact, a building covered by the forest, which explains that she was lying above a window in the shelter).
And there, there is a different music, rather of type “achievement”. She finds her diary and reads it. “Happy Birthday.” And it’s just her birthday.
01:10:00 – The BGM gives way to silence to give the effect of gravity and anguish.
Voice over of Seo Hae from the diary.
Opening of the grave. Gitch, memory flashes. Here terrifying sound effects, based on a distorted beating heart.
And we note: Seo Hae cries.
Followed by a song (rather pleasant and appropriate). Very good performance of the actress… at the same time, a scene of crying for PSH, it is the base.
In my opinion, the almost impossible sequence of events leading Seo Hae to discover her diary in an impossible to find place, precisely her birthday, and the proof of the unalterable and invariant side of the time loop.
“Please protect the one I love”. Confirmation that Seo Hae will eventually fall in love with Tae Sul.
The two shots with the picture: one shot with zero inscription, the other shot with the inscription “misogamist”.
I can’t believe it could be a mistake by the props man on this.
I mean… Since they gave the photo with the inscription in the scene, it’s obvious they have both photos. How can you be wrong about that? It was shot on the same day, under the same conditions.
What sense does this voluntary error make?
To show the dichotomy between two possible variants of the time loop?
Can we relate this to what is said by the voice-over?
End episode 8. My personal opinion:
The first half of the drama ends with the most beautiful scene in the drama. From the moment Seo Hae wanders in the nature, to the very end.
Goosebump!
@WEnchanteur – your enthusiasm and dedication to this k drama details are so contagious!
Ep8 Sigma’s arm has the bar code and it showed “1”, best seen at 01:21. It protrudes the skin so it looked like a scratch. He is the first person to be teleported from the future. There’s also another look at 02:44.
Reading the rest of your other observations.
@Janey, oooh Ok, so the red debris was a red ONE ?!
But why he got that ? Who writed it on the shoulder.
So it means also, he’s the first one to go ? Let’s say, 2 month after nuclear war ? Then time travel is more theory “19 years, 4 months, 25 day” fixed gap ?
Then, he is not Sun nor the other guy son ? damn.
What I do here is not complicated. And it’s really much easier for me to write down timecodes.
I just watch the episode, and I note something that catches my attention, that may not have been noted here before.
So, by writing down the timecode, I know where I stand, even if I have to rerun the scene.
Of course, I can only do this during a rewatch, because the first time I watch the episode, I just want to be surprised by the story, stay focused in the ambiance, and not be interrupted.
Who controls the uploader from the future? There is a system with the barcodes and it seems to be centralized (not sure if there’s only 1 machine or more). There’s data that also gets passed on or intercepted by ICB, e.g. ICB did face scan of SH while trying to escape in the red car and got her name, uploader barcode and other info on the screen.
On Sigma’s apartment, is it the same as the one when he burned the money. I was expecting they will see a room full of TV screens but it’s not there in the apartment. I have a feeling that the screening room is of a different time, not in the present but in the future? There was a time he had Tsan captive in the screening room.
The guy with the knife, I believe is a Sigma henchman. Sigma (the shot was blurred and dark so just my hunch) ran up the top of the building to throw bricks. The knife guy knew the sigma sign on the ground. The brick hit the henchman but in the next shot, he was gone. 42:09. What happened to him?
@Janey,
We have to find a shot on Sigma shoes now, so we can compare. 😉
Where is the henchman ?
Ah ha, I didn’t pay attention he disapear. 2 times I watch and didnt noticed that.
The guy was probably teleported in a tex avery cartoon. lol!
Ep 5 50:46 has a clear shot of the logo of the Control Bureau. Do you think it looks like the Sigma sign but rotated at 45 degree? Would it suggest Sigma and Control Bureau is linked?
Hi @Viva, interesting. I went to look… think the timestamp is not quite right, but I found the logo anyway. One on the employee name card of Jung in colour (Timestamp 1:10:11), and the other on ICB’s wall in line drawing (Timestamp 1:11:13). The line drawing looks more like an upright M , but when turned on it’s side, might look like Sigma.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FzmaJye5Du6itdhbG3FDPLTjgx1zETW0/view?usp=sharing
So is Sigma the off-shoot or the genesis of ICB or do they have little connection except for knowledge of the Up/Downloading, are the questions.
@WEnchanteur
How strange! I said the exact opposite in the other thread on Bloopers and Easter Bananans.
I juxtaposed the Uploader transporter device and noted that Show had made it look different rather than kept it looking the same.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Z-Jn74yJE3FlCnSPUDVrg0AMCAxRx3CF/view?usp=sharing
I believe that production-wise it would have been the same device, but I felt that Show was suggesting that Sigma used a different Uploader from SH. Or an Uploader that had been upgraded since his time or since her time, (depending!!).
*WEnchanteur
On Episode 7 you wrote:
I too had a question about this door. And I posted a link to the screenshots of it on the Easter Bananas thread. A props failure in terms of no lock at first … SH’s father had to push the door shut and turn the wheel handle. Therefore how the door can be locked from outside so that no one else can open it, is the question. Anyone can turn that wheel. But if it’s locked mechanically from the outside, then how about the people left inside? They cannot get out!
However when SH returns alone and needs to enter it, a digital lock has magically been installed in Episode 8. *Tut tut!*
Hey Everyone,
I have watched Episode 7 and I will try to catch today with Episode 8!
@GB, Hi,
I compared on the screenshots you posted for confirmation (it’s easier with this, thanks).
It’s the same, we can recognize almost all the details.
Some lamps are brighter than others, the light is not 100% the same though.
In episode 1, the uploader is seen from further away, at ground level. The scene is well lit.
In episode 8, the uploader is seen from at least 5 meters closer, from above. The scene is darker and obscures details or makes them coarse.
So you can’t see the railing, either because the view is too close or because the railing was added later.
There are also the details related to the use, the top part and the circle in the heart of the machine.
I suppose that these are mechanical parts hidden in episode 1 because the machine is not in use.
We can see that these elements are animated, and are probably retracted (and invisible) in the machine at rest.
@WEnchanteur, I know what you mean. I expected to see it looking exactly the same, because an Uploader should be an Uploader, unless like a car there are different models or brands…. However I expected that production-wise, it would make sense to reuse the same props/room. They should have looked exactly the same.
What I saw instead, was that it was made to look slightly different. I wondered whether there was a reason.
We know that the assassins were downloaded very badly into the conference venue. For one thing, they had to contend with lots of objects indoors. But even without those, ALL of them looked grotesque, ill-formed and not likely to survive for long. @pkml3 was guessing that they came through another Uploader that was faulty.
What’s the significance of there being more than 1 Uploader? Some people have access to good, approved, public, government or big corp operated Uploaders. But there are splinter groups or individuals who are desperate enough to use unofficial channels, probably to maintain secrecy, and who come with their own agenda.
In the case of the assassins, they were prepared to work a suicide mission to kill Tae Sul. It was a group agenda. They might not even have been ‘bad’ guys, but just a group wanting to work for the higher/greater good, to kill Tae Sul and to stop the war, for example. This was the suggestion to SH by Park, I think. ‘Why go the difficult way of keeping him from making the Uploader – just kill him.’
So if there is a group out to kill him, it does not seem to be an Official Body, like the ICB or government. It’s not everyone who wants him dead.
We do see in Ep 8 that Tae Sul died, but not early enough to stop the war, I guess.
Strangely, Seo Hae gets the opposite (wrong???) message in more than one instance, ie she thinks that TSul must be kept alive to stop the war. She said everyone is out to kill him … ICB and especially Sigma. However, even Tae Sul says it’s not ICB, since they could have but didn’t kill him.. Also Sigma came to get TSul to make the Uploader, not to kill him. So the SH who wrote in the diary may have been mistaken!!! Was that why she failed in every loop? Because the diary led her wrong?
Anyway, that Uploader device is somewhat intriguing and it led to this thought.
@GB, it could be also:
– Tae Sul build a well functionning Uploader.
– Sigma just build a badly done one, because he’s not the creator, and use stolen plans, or the transfert contract tech.
In this way, the loop can remain, even if Tae Sul don’t build his own machine or die.
About the two pictures at episode ending 8, I think about juxtaposition. Like a previous (or next ?) loop had no “misogamy” wording, and the ditto about the picture with the words. Juxtaposition style directing, a bit different from the roof train scene, but same kind of trick.
So, now, I really don’t know what theory is on run. Every time I think it’s fixed loop, then another detail prove it’s a “variations” loop (last time because the bullet in the head), then again fixed one, then again variations one. 😉