Sorry that this is delayed. I’ve been busy with work. 🙂
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Our BOD regulars are great at spotting the themes! Here’s an excerpt from @Old American Lady’s post. (@OAL, I edited the typos.)
Hi Everyone, is it only me, but did anyone else see the overwhelming theme of mothers and their relationships to their children. I just finished watching the subbed episode on Netflix, and from the beginning to practically the end there were mother issues. Songhwa’s mother’s call, showing reflected pride and nosiness. There were all the patients’ moms, SH’s mom’s smothering attitude, the baby’s mother, IJ’s mother figure to Uju (disappointing to the kid), the seizure kid’s mom, the security guard’s mom, the motorcycle victim’s mom, Jang’s mother’s accident (how does a fellow get all that time off?), and of course Rosa, PaBo’s mom — the latter two moms being the key to the endgame. It may seem abrupt but so is life.. The unexpected happens.. parents age and become ill.. We sometimes are blind to their needs because of our busy life. So we have the set up for the end of the Winter Garden.
Now let’s get to Jang’s claim that she beat God. Not so fast — JW is set to propose to her in the Cathedral, and the shot was set up to show what I think was a statue that reminded me of the Pieta. JW has not taken off his rosary bracelet. If he were to marry Jang, it seems that she would have to share him with God; That is the significance of the place he chose for the proposal. And to prove that God is still in the picture, Jang was unable to meet PaBo because God intervened with her mom’s auto accident. Lesson-You should not have the hubris to mess with God.
Yes, mothers’ love is a theme of this episode. Thanks, @OAL, for listing them.
To me, the giveaway was the background music. It’s called the “March of the Toy Soldiers” and it’s from Tchaikovsky’s “The Nutcracker Suite.” This is played in the opening act of “The Nutcracker Suite” when the family and guests gather for a lavish Christmas party. This music selection is perfect background music for the busy day about to unfold in the hospital, just like the Haydn’s “Trumpet Concerto” was the classical piece in Episode 3.
With the classical music softly playing in the background, Minha asked the twin brother if he had washed his hair. He’d been so busy he had no time to observe personal hygiene. This scene segued into Jang’s stringy wet hair. She and the rest of her team still had 10 to 15 minutes before Ikjun’s rounds began. A male nurse suggested having coffee but the twin sister nixed that idea because there wasn’t enough time.
Then, like the geezer that she was, Jang bragged that 15 minutes was enough for her to grab a meal and a dessert. The head nurse chimed in, saying that she could even brush her teeth within that period. Jang volunteered to get coffee for them all, but the male nurse and the twin sister hastily offered to do it. Before another word was said, the staff nurse came in with the coffee.
“Perfect timing!”
They began drinking coffee like a corps de ballet waiting for the big act.
I’ll stop here for a second and comment on a few things:
1. Perfect timing
This is another subtheme in this drama. Perfect timing is about having the good intuition (some would attribute it to luck, though) to make the right move in the right situation at the right time.
In this opening scene, the nurse was shown to have perfect timing. Unwittingly, she arrived just when they were discussing who was going to get coffee. At the end of this episode, the gods were shown to have perfect timing, too. Knowingly, they intervened when JW was about to propose to Jang.
Moreover, I think this “perfect timing” is also in the minds of the director and writer. They’re keenly aware of the countdown – only 5 more episodes to go till the finale – and they must feel the pressure of running everything like clockwork in order to finish strong. Perfect timing is critical for them, too.
2. Filler Shots
Jang crunching on ice (this sound is so annoying) and receiving another coffee were filler shots. If the director edited these out, he could have more screentime to give to the main casts, SH and JWan.
3. The Hair joke
It began in Episode 1, when she complained about blowdrying her hair on a rainy day. Later, she was gifted with hairclips by a grieving mom. I thought it funny that her untidy hair made a lasting impression on the mom. Next, in Episode 3, her perfectly coiffed hair was disheveled by the wind. Here in Episode 7, her hair looked washed by she didn’t seem to have combed it.
To top everything, just when she was dabbing the finishing touch of makeup for her date with JW, she was called away to attend to her mother.
I think the director’s been making a joke of Jang’s slovenliness.
To continue…
I like how the director focused on a certain object to transition from scene to another. He made it looked seamless.
For instance, Minha’s comment on the hair of the twin brother segued into the shot of Jang’s hair. Jang’s coffee moment segued into SH’s coffee scene. While he was drinking coffee in in his car, he cranked up the volume of “The Nutcracker Suite.” Then, he sped up with the music blaring.
To me, the director was implicitly connecting driving skills and the ballet music. As Songhwa entered the garage, the image of her skillfully parking her car reminded me of a ballerina finishing her pirouettes with grace and confidence. I knew knew that Songhwa was a dab hand at parking.
This was perfect timing again. The director synchronized the music’s ending with Songhwa’s arrival. The crash of cymbals was in time with the breaking of her vehicle.
Immediately, her phone rang. Her mom was calling. Note how there was no background music while she was on the phone with her mom. This told us that the director wanted us to pay attention to this conversation
Songhwa: Hi, Mom. What’s up? It’s so early.
Mom: (defensively) Can I only call you when something’s up? Are you at work?
Songhwa: I just got here.
Mom: (gossiping) Hey, my friend’s daughter is joining Internal Medicine. No. I think it’s Cardiology. She’s joining that department at Yulje. She was going to work at the Jongno branch after becoming board-certified, but she’ll actually work at your branch for a few months. Will you see her often at work?
Songhwa: No, I rarely work with cardiologists.
Mom: (chuckling then changing topics) By the way, I read another article that mentioned your name. Yoo Gyeongjin thanked you again during your interview.
Songhwa: (glances at watch)
Mom: She said she was doing great without any postoperative complications even though it was a difficult surgery. Was her surgery that difficult? Did it take long? How many hours?
Songhwa: No, it didn’t take long. I have to go do rounds, Mom. I’ll call you later.
Mom: All right. Okay.
After she hung up, the music played again as she lined up for the elevator.
My comments:
1. Songhwa’s mom and Jang’s mom
Her phone conversation with her mom was being contrasted to Jang’s phone conversation with her mom in Episode 5.
Jang’s mom called up at an ungodly hour of 4:00 am. She said she was missing Jang. Jang however sensed that something was amiss. To me, Jang should have followed this up with phone call later after her surgery to check on her mother. Nobody calls at 4:00 am.
Jang: Are you still up? Did something happen? Why are you calling so late?
Mom: Nothing happened. I just missed you.
Jang: It’s 4 a.m. right now. You should be asleep.
Mom: I’ll go to sleep now that I’ve heard your voice. Everything’s okay with you, right?
Jang: I’m doing fine. Mom, did you fight with Dad?
Mom: Of course not.
Jang: You’re sure, right?
Mom: Yes. GU, you’re out of side dishes, right? Do you want me to send you some?
Jang: No, I still have a lot left. Mom, you’re sure everything’s okay, right?
Mom: Of course, everything’s fine.
Jang: I’m getting a call. I’m going into surgery now.
Mom: Okay, go ahead. Don’t push yourself too hard. I love you.
Jang: Me too.
Note: when Songhwa cuts short her phone conversation with her mom, she often promises to call back at a more convenient time.
2. Proud mom = reflected glory
Anybody can see through Songhwa’s mom.
First, she wanted bragging rights. Songhwa was already a professor, and was more senior than her friend’s daughter. I doubt that Songhwa’s mom was really concerned about the welfare of her friend’s daughter. If she was, she would have insisted that Songhwa befriend that newbie and make her feel welcome.
Second, the violinist’s surgery took place over a year ago, but Songhwa’s mom was still basking in the reflected glory of her daughter’s accomplishment…which is pretty normal. The mom was a proud parent. On the other hand, Songhwa undoubtedly saved more lives after that surgery, but she wasn’t the type to crow over her successes.
Her irritation with her mom’s curiosity about her work is normal, too. It’s obvious that whenever her mom inquires about her work, she also fusses about her successes. Given Songhwa’s low-key personality, she would certainly loathe her mom making a big deal. She would be embarrassed.
These feelings are relatable because no adult wants that kind of adoration or pressure from their parents. If I were in her shoes, I would want to tone down my mom’s expectation that I was perfect at my job.
3. Songhwa is close to her mom.
However, let there be no mistake: Songhwa’s closeness to her mom has been established since last season.
In Episode 2, she wasn’t embarrassed to tell her mom that she and her boyfriend broke up because he cheated on her. Later in the episode, her mom greeted her on her birthday, and she thanked her mom for bringing her into this world. Her mom said that if she had known it was this lovely to have a daughter, she would’ve had another one. She then teased her mom that she wouldn’t mind having another sibling 40 years her junior. The mom jokingly said that her father would flee.
In Episode 10, when Uju got sick, she called her mom up to ask for advice. She was amazed that her mom was better than a doctor. She said that she had respect for all moms.
This episode, despite showing a typical mother-daughter friction, she was patient with her mom’s health complaints. Her mother, like JW’s mother Rosa, was anxious about her health. While Rosa took care of her health because she didn’t want to be a burden on her kids, Songhwa’s mother worried about her health because she was a bit hypochondriac.
Songhwa: What can I do though? I booked an appointment for her with a neurologist. I think what she needs now is reassurance, not a diagnosis.
In sum, she kept regularly in touch with mom. She was the one her mother relied on to deal with her health concerns. She’d been filial daughter.
To continue…
As soon as the classical music was turned back on, the audience was treated to a smooth camera relay. After Songhwa lined up to get on the elevator, JW was filmed getting off the elevator on the other side.
He was accosted by his #1 admirer, Jaehak whose white coat he borrowed. He walked into a hall and on the other side, SH came out of the hall, fixing his own white coat. Trailing behind him are Minha and the twin brother.
Minha informed him that his appointment was delayed. SH said he skipped his breakfast, and Minha promptly invited him to have a quick breakfast with them. SH agreed and they made a U-turn to the cafeteria. As they turned a corner, IkJun appeared around a corner, ready for his rounds.
He was surprised at the number of people joining him in his rounds, and Jang explained who his supporting cast were.
The “Nutcracker suite” continued to play nonstop in the background.
Then, the camera tracked IJ leading his small retinue to a room. But instead of showing IJ’s patient inside the room, the camera shifted to the pediatric room of JW.
His nurse was prepping him for their next patient. Note: JW’s day started earlier than his other four friends.
Nurse: Next is Hanjun.
JW: Is he here with his mom again?
Nurse: Yes.
Soon after the nurse spoke, the music ended with the same crash of cymbals that we heard in Songhwa’s scene earlier.
JW: Hi, Hanjunie. How have you been?
HJ: Good.
Mom: (at the same time) He’s been well. But he didn’t exercise, so he’s gained quite a bit of weight.
JW: Well, but everything looks pretty good. HJ, does your stomach ever feel tight? Do you ever feel dizzy?
Note how JW would address the question to the child, not the mother.
HJ: Well…
Mom: (answering first) No, never. No dizziness, but he occasionally gets headaches. But it goes away as soon as he takes his medication.
JW: I see. The ultrasound results look good too. HJ, you need to lose a bit of weight though. You don’t like to exercise? Do you play any sports?
HJ: (opening his mouth)
Mom: (beating him to the answer) He likes baseball. Watching baseball, not playing it.
JW: Excuse me, mom. HJ can answer these questions, too, you know. HJ, you’re in sixth grade now, right?
HJ: Yes.
JW: Mom, he’s certainly old enough to tell me how he’s been doing and describe his condition.
Mom: Gosh, no. He may look like a big boy, but he’s still a kid.
HJ: I’m not a kid.
Mom: What?
Then, the boy and JW devised a plan to help him lose weight. They agreed to schedule another appointment in three months. The mother wanted a monthly consultation, but JW vetoed it. It wasn’t a good thing, he said. He asked the child if it was okay with him to see him in three months.
Note: the background music restarted. But this time the “Nutcracker Suite” was exchanged for a light-hearted piano piece.
HJ: Of course, Not having to come in often is a good sign because it means that I’m recovering optimally. Don’t get me wrong. I like you very much, but I’m happy that I don’t have to come in so often.
JW: All right. Let’s make sure we don’t have to see each other so often.
HJ: Okay.
Comments:
1. Perfect timing
As you can see then, the perfect timing was related to the background music. The scenes were edited so that the end of the music would synchronize with the start of Songhwa’s conversation with her mom as well as the start of JW’s conversation with his patient and his mother.
That’s how I knew that mothers would be the main topic of this drama.
2. On mothers
Both Songhwa and JW were irritated by the mothers. It appeared as if they found motherly love overpowering and burdensome.
As I said, Songhwa didn’t want her mom too inquisitive about her work. She found her mother’s interest in her job annoying. Likewise, JW didn’t want HJ’s mom to interfere in his doctor-patient consultation. He found the mother’s presence intrusive. Both Songhwa and JW would like the mothers to be less involved in their children’s lives.
I find it interesting that the writer connected these two characters’ interactions with their mothers in the opening act.
Speaking from experience, though, when my sons hit puberty, I was asked to leave the exam room for a portion of the well-child check-up. Their pediatrician would first go over any physical, mental, and psychological concerns together with me and my son. Then, I’d step out of the room, while my son and the pediatrician had their own private consultation. After they were done, I’d go back in. As a parent, I was never made to feel like I didn’t have a voice in the health decisions of my adolescent child.
That’s why I bristled at JW’s medical approach — or rather Writer Lee’s perspective on what constitutes an adolescent check-up.
Sure, a teenager was old enough to describe his condition, but the pediatrician wouldn’t know which condition to focus on, if the parent didn’t raise specific issues of concern, e.g., suicidal thoughts, eating disorders, weight problems, drugs, school bullying, alcohol, sex, etc.
I found JW’s medical approach runs counter to the old adage that “mothers know best.” At the very least, mothers should be heard. What JW should have done was to get both the parent’s and the child’s perspectives and then ask the mother for permission to speak with the child in private.
3. Speaking of mothers…
There was one mother who remained silent throughout this episode, but whose impact was most supreme. Did you see her?
JWan: What’s the song for this week?
JW: “To You”
JWan: Darn it. It’s a love song.
JW: Ha! What are you doing this Sunday?
JWan: (perking up) Why? Are you going to hang out with me this Sunday?
JW: No, I have prior engagements. If you’re staying home again…
JWan: Then, what?
JW: Can you get some groceries?
JWan: (No comment)
JW: I’ll do it if you don’t want to.
JWan: I’ve got plans. A school reunion.
There! On the table. She knew what JW was planning to do on Sunday but she kept silent.
She was there, too, when JW was suddenly left at the altar…errr… at the portico of the cathedral. She was silent, too.
But just because a mother is silent doesn’t mean she isn’t working behind-the-scene….
I don’t know if ShinLee are going to kowtow to the WG and IkSonger fanclubs, and change the endgame to suit these ships. But I do know these:
1. Jang asked JW to ditch his Catholic faith on Christmas Day. Of all days!
2. Jang said not a word to correct Minha and IJ when they congratulated her on beating God.
Minha: I congratulated her for beating God.
IJ: (snapping his finger) That’s right! GU beat God.
Jang: (crickets)
If I were Jang, I would have told them to shush.
3. No matter how hard the writer tries to rehabilitate her character, I won’t forget Jang’s lack of pity for that distraught mom in S 1, Ep 2. She was a THIRD-year resident then; Hardly a newbie.
Jang: It’s highly likely that he’s having hemorrhagic shock.
Mom: Then, what should we do?
Jang: His pulse is weak. We believe he may have a thoracic and brain injury. We took him up for CT.
JW: (stops to listen to her)
Jang: But we’re not sure if he will last. There’s a slim chance we can save him. There’s no hope for him.
Mom: (begging her) Doctor, please save JuHwan. If he’s gone, I won’t be able to live.
Jang: Did you perform CPR?
Mom: Pardon?
Jang: Did you do chest compressions?
Mom: No.
Jang: He could have lived if you had done that.
Mom: What?!
She exhibited neither compassion nor pity when she blamed the mom for not saving her own child.
Now, the statue behind JW in the Cathedral is a replica of the famous “Pieta” by Michelangelo. (If you haven’t been living under the rock all these years, you should know what “Pieta” means and what it stands for.)
Try to imagine Jang asking Mary, the Mother of God, those same shameful questions she asked that mom in the ER.
“Did you perform CPR? Did you do chest compressions? He could have lived if you had done that.”
Do you see what I’m saying?
Jang has been an abominable character to me ever since that moment, and nothing she has done in all these episodes has convinced me to change my mind. I would have overlooked her unkempt hair, protruding ears, sullen face, and her 101 other faults, had she displayed even just a smidgen of “pieta” for that mother.
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Next up, a post on schematics. 🙂
As mentioned in the comment section below, this statue of Mary was seen in original music video of the OST featured in Ep 4, “Let’s Forget It.”
@packmule3, ❤❤❤ as I read your words, these images flow fluidly in my mind, the music rings in my ear… you make reading such an enjoyful venture. Hmmm…. shin pd sure has his strength despite his screwed mind to play around his viewers, not to mention the weak writings we saw here and there and the major creative diss on this GU character. Whatever she did, she is just stuck in that lame bubble, no substantial progress. General kviewers are getting bored with her same old same old flicks onscreen. Stunted. That is what LWJ is giving this one character. Lame fillers, not going anywhere, draggyyyyyyyyyy for a purpose. Unfortunately, with such writings LWJ makes GU dragged the whole series into her black hole for the majority part of S2. Yeah, great job. /sarcasm
Hmmm… I may need time to recalibrate about shinlee… hmmm… 🤭🤭🤭 🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️ 💨💨💨
I did like that first montage with the Nutcracker Suite playing. And I did notice the theme of mothers. Unfortunately the slickness of the initial scenes wasn’t reciprocated in the later scenes with mothers. It felt like he was overemphasising the point. With the screaming ER mother. YunBok’s sudden reflection about her mother.
And I agree that the relationship between SHwa and her mom is the complete opposite to Jang and her mom. What mom rings at 4am? Unless it’s out of sheer desperation to hear her voice? Something is not right there.
And yes to Jang’s rehabilitation. Just can’t buy it no matter how hard they try.
Thanks,@packmule3!!! So very enlightening as always. I learned points I didn’t see the first time around before. (And @Miracle23, I agree with your comment about how easily the images form in one’s head as @packmule3 describes the scenes 🙂 )
Good point about Jang’s previous despicable response to the mother’s distress. I understood before that her reaction was awful, but presented in this light, I see more clearly how awful it was.
And I agree that it was really in bad taste of her not to shush/react on the “beating God” comments of IJ and Minha. I completely understand that people have different or no religious beliefs. But Jang is in a relationship with a man who feels very deeply about his God. She shouldn’t pull him away from his God (on God’s birthday heehee, too, good point!). And she shouldn’t think, or allow others to think (I wonder if that was how she described it to MH when she first told her the story?!) that she has beaten God.
In passing, since the Tchaikovsky piece is mentioned, can I just say that the incorporation of classical music into the show is also excellent??
I remember in a previous episode (last season, I think?), in another “long, continuous” shot of the doctors’ different activities, another “military march” played — Schubert’s March Militaire. 🙂 (I notice these things because I was a classical music kid growing up.) Even the other classical pieces subtly inserted are so, so nice. I wish they would also include those in the official OST/playlist.
Oooh, I wonder if the continuous shot / Schubert’s March Militaire / Tchaikovsky’s March of the Toy Soldiers is another one of those parallels we recently talked about in the alfresco thread. 🙂
@packmule3 @OAL 💝💝🍰🍰🍰 reading this makes me want to paddle harder for the last 5 episodes. Jang had already committed the unpardonable sin when she positioned herself alongside GOD to be chosen from. She also had committed some of the sins, e.g greed, deceit, arrogance , and folly.
After reading this, suddenly I had the feeling that ShinLee won’t be so stupid to reward this character without any punishment. Yes, they might have some strange idea about Catholic, but using GOD as an option is nevertheless a sin in every religion. The highlight of the (silence) Mother who witnessed all is making me shivered.
@nrllee Mafia game rules 🕵️🕵️♀️
Thank you, @packmule3.
@Bulmagoku, yes, to the mother witnessing all – at the church, represented in the rosary bracelet and even as a statue on JWon’s desk at work.
@pandamilktea nice pick up. Which ep was March Militaire played in S1? I only recognized the Nutcracker Suite March of the Toy Soldiers because I watched the ballet.
@nrllee, oh, boo. I checked back. It wasn’t S1. It was in S2, Ep. 1 (at the 23:00ish mark.) 🙂
@pandamilktea the only bit of classical music in S1 (that I remember) was when SH was listening to the piece in his office and IJ came round and did his classic train announcement 😂. I still laugh at that scene. It was brilliant. That’s the other difference with the 2 seasons. I watched eps over and over and didn’t mind. Here I haven’t ever rewatched. I may have watched certain scenes to catch stuff I didn’t get with first viewing but more often than not I just give up after watching it once.
Awesome, @pandamilktea. Here’s another list in the making then. Pachelbel’s Canon in D is the important one.
Ep 1 Schubert’s March Militaire
Ep 2
Ep 3 Haydn’s Trumpet Concerto
Ep 4
Ep 5 Mozart’s Sonata for Two Pianos K448 (thanks to SH’s iphone, lol) It’s the Allegro movement.
Ep 6 Beethoven’s Symphony No. 5 (while Songhwa had the food inspiration)
Ep 7 Tchaikovsky’s Nutcracker Suite, March of the Toy Soldiers
@pm3 biggest and softest cookies for pt. 3 🍪🍪🍪🍪🍪
@nrllee 100% echo your thoughts. S1 was something else, and S2 is something else ://
@nrllee, I read the first sentence in your last post and I literally laughed out loud. 😂 Even mere remembering the scene is funny. 🤭 Off the top of my head, the classical pieces I remember played in either season are that Vivaldi (?) piece (train announcement), Canon in D, Marche Militaire, March of the Toy Soldiers, and Chopin’s Raindrop Prelude (played very faintly during SH’s dinner with his mom, the one interspersed with that WG scene with the passing train) 😊 (Sorry. Geeked out for a bit there. 😅🙈)
Ok I am just gonna read the list of these classic scores with ☺☺☺ I am not really into classic songs though I listen to some remakes by The Bond quartet and then Canon in D. Awesome one, @pm3! Shinlee are really into these classical music…hmmm… who would have thought…🤭🤭🤭
Trivia for Bitches… (because I know we love these factoids)
The Mozart piece, K448, was the one made famous almost 30 years ago because a study was released that said children who listened to Mozart improved their cognitive ability. So parents (like me, hahaha) started playing Mozart in the background for the kids.
To be honest, I didn’t read the scientific paper and all that stuck in my head from that hype was “ANY Mozart piece = improved mental ability.” That’s how I ended up getting to know even Mozart’s “dirty” music. hahaha.
What’s Mozart “dirty” music? It’s called “Leck mich im Arsch” K. 231 or in today’s slang, “Kiss My Ass.” Yes, Mozart was a genius.
https://youtu.be/C78HBp-Youk
Anyway, google “Mozart Effect” if you don’t want to believe me about Mozart’s effect on the brain.
Dear Friends, sorry I haven’t written in a while. How have you been?.
My heart felt for Yun-Bok when she got that the brother’s unwelcomed pressure on them was the same she put on Doctors when her mother was ill. She cried as that simple tragedy of human condition.
That was also shown (now as a farce 😉 ) when the wailing mother in the ER was a pediatrician in another clinic XD .
For me it was unnerving that in their conversation Rosa seemed to make sense, and after seeing SH’s mother reaction my eyes widened in terror acknowledging that Rosa was indeed the voice of Reason among the two of them. Poor SH. It makes me respect and love his character more.
SH’s mom strikes me as a person that never had to fight for anything in her life and has always been in a comfortable position, so both her husband’s infidelity and her daughter’s passing must have gotten her with less tools to work around them than people that had experienced more difficulties. Now I get how compassionate SH really is just by doing his best not to become another stressing agent but a soothing pressence.
She also seems like a person to which trivial problems are amplified due to their high standards and overall orderly world.
She crossed me when she didn’t forgive MinAh and even got offensive to her despite her profuse apologies. A lady that saves lives and works like a warrior.
Do. Not. Mess. With. The. Bears. DX
I agree completely. The rehabilitation program on Jang does nothing for me to like her more because she only became kind as a response to JWon, because she didnt want him to dislike her. It’s selfish and self,-serving.
Thank you packmule3 for bring back those scenes to us : the unforgettable scene of Mom-should-have-perform-CPR that made me lost for words on Jang.
And followed by the playing a competition with God scene too.
I previously thought that I could change my mind about this Jang if the writer make a character development of her. But still not convincing enough with all the rehabilitations they’ve been showing us until now.
I can only hope that they’re just wise enough to do the “follow ups” about those scenes in season 1.
So there is a dirty mozart song too! Ah, I just know.. thanks packmule for the link on the video, I read some comments on that video that they were joking to make that song a wedding song. Hahaha
Makes me imagine that there must be at least someone who accidentally put that song as their wedding song thinking that it was Mozart’s beautiful piece not knowing the meaning of that song.. 🥲🥲
Another great post, as always! 👍👏 Yes, I noticed too the Mother theme and the statue on the desk (the first time we see it since WG began…hidden but present like you said!).
This was the first time I recognized the classical music of the beginning and I always associate this piece with Xmas (so I was a little confused). But I liked your association. And in a way, it was in Xmas that WG began and this Xmas song marks the beginning of the ending.
LIke you, i don’t think GU can be redeemable. I don’t know if she is truly a gold digger (the associations between her and Professor Cheon are there for sure, like people have been pointing out)…i think She Will simply go away to Mokpo hospital, after relying on IKjun. Let’s hope is sooner that later!!! 🤗
Dear @Kattie, first of all welcome!!! 😀 .
Monday I was reading your Posts about GU (aka. Maggot). You asked why people were so on the side of Maggot. The thing is that we are reading behaviors and values in this Posts while a lot of the Winter Gardeners are fulfilling a fantasy: the one of getting the rich, handsome and pure-hearted Doctor even if they do not work on themselves as persons and are nothing to write home about: technically competent but that’s all.
On one of the protected Posts I asked the hypothetical question on those WGers having someone behaving like Maggot in the dinner with IJ, MinAh, SH and JWon a few episodes ago but for Thanksgiving/Christmas. Then it devolved in Rosa chewing Maggot for her bad behavior and repenting for forcing her upon her own son 😉 .
So many thanks to you @packmule3 for inc,using my comment in your wonderful discussion of mothers and children, music and timing. I have learned so much about the creative process from your posts and you have enabled me to see so much more than a superficial view of these dramas.
Part of the delight of this discussion was how the classical music was used to enhance the story. The stops and starts were fascinating when one thinks about how music or the lack thereof is used to enhance the story, characters and atmosphere.
I am very fond of the music from the Nutcracker. My earliest memory of it came from when I went to nursery school in a settlement house. It was used in a variety of ways including at nap time and dance time. As we didn’t celebrate Christmas or go to the ballet my visceral memory of it came from my happy moments in nursery school. Hearing it here made me appreciate all the more.
@FGB4877 Thank you so much! 🥰 Great reasoning – it is the need for the fulfillment of a fantasy. That lunch scene was so bad 😖
@FGB, great point on the fantasy! And with Jang being, well, a slovenly plain Jane — the wet, barely-combed hair in the morning; the messy hair all day; pens and binder clips (!!!!!!) as hair accessory (ngl, this is my greatest pet peeve about her lol); the always-dour expression; the bland personality) — I wonder if it plays a large part in the romance fantasy. A plain, shabby, bland girl finds an excellent, handsome, ultra-rich, ultra-kind, awesome-dad-material guy.
Hey, when I was young, I really enjoyed a lot of romcoms, chick lits, and one or two romance novels, too. (Obviously, some KDramas also fit in this category. 🙂) But the good pairings 👏 always 👏 organically 👏 made 👏 sense. 😒
@Pandamilktea: yes, the slovenly plain Jane that was redeemed since this handsome, rich, capable and pure-hearted man saw something special in her that no one (not even her) had discovered in all of her existence.
Remember that in Season 1 Min-Ah had yet to receive her first kiss of that year while Maggot still had to receive her first kiss in her whole life, so we are pretty certain that she was not popular to say the least 🙄 … hmmmm… wonder why…
Personally I can easily love a physically Plain Jane, but someone telling a distressed mother that her child could have survived had she given him CPR?… that is a hard pass.
Beauty if possessed eventually fades but stupidity and black-heartedness is a lifelong sentence, both for the person that is lacking and for its close ones.
A dear old friend once said to me “La ignorancia no duele… ¡pero como jode!!!” [meaning: Ignorance does not cause pain but hell if it causes damage!!!]. That is Maggot.
It fits the Cinderella story doesn’t it? Just rehashing what I wrote a while back.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ue0ikmEGnWXSdUVrWjhO6zarWQ9oGLyo7WhQZSAEXHU/
The other Cinderella
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gu83eE0muYWyeXUN-nmDX-N5aXXz1j6GpmM3e3IAKzQ/
@FGB and @nrllee, I love the Cinderella analogy. However, I will never buy Jang as Cinderella. Sur e, she looks plain and seems to be a hard worker, but she lacks the one major quality that makes Cinderella special; kindness. With all the coaching from PaBo or the attempt at rehabilitation by Shin Lee, Jang has not learned, indness or empathy. She parrots the words and actions, but we get no evidence that those lessons have been internalized. It all seems calculated, even buying coffee for her residents. She is a mimic. And she can’t even be counted on as a physician-she wanted to do the big liver surgery in all probability to impress, but she proved to be a real imposter coming in without the minimum preparation needed, even when she was always inserting herself in surgeries as an intern.In my opinion she is the ultimate phoney and without any saving graces.
I also think that the WGs, in service to their fantasy, would hope that she gets a make over and emerges as “beautiful”. However true beauty as we know from all of our literary tropes, requires the qualities of kindness, compassion with all that follow through that makes for inner beauty. SHB who plays Jang can easilybe glamorize. I’ve seen her in previous works and she looks good. But as written, to date, the character has not been credibly shown to evince true beauty. She lacks those qua,qualities, that would make the WG fantasy real. Most of all, any physical or behavioral rehabilitation seems to be superficial, at best.
As the fantasy pertains to Songhwa, Cinderella may have looked shabby but she was always beautiful and that enraged her stepmother and stepsister jealousy. Apart from Songhwa tripping the bad man, although Jang did her track athlete best to catch him (and failed, darn it), have we ever seen any real interaction between the two. I would think that Jang would be jealous of Songhwa. So Jang would be the stepsister. Songhwa has inner and outer beauty. We also know that she has been viewed as a woman by at least two of the four male friends. It has also been unclear whether PaBo was the third potential suitor but Rosa hinted at it. If Jang knew that, the green m I never of jealousy would hit her and coupled with Songhwa’s reputation as a surgeon, humanitarian, I can imagine that in a making drama, Jang would do everything in her power to sabotage Shwa. That is why my candidate for Cinderella is Songhwa.
@OldAmericanLady, basically Cinderella is a very capable and good person that has been overlooked. She is bidding her time to shine. Also someone that does not complain about hard work and appreciates all the people around her that makes everything possible.
Here mice equals interns 😀 – do you remember that Cinderella treated the mice with care and respect while SHwa refused an interview since the German journalists decided to sideline SeoBin and the other interns?. SHwa is very capable and check all the boxes but we haven’t seen her in a romantic situation, as a romantic lead. She is the eldest sister of the Lacking 5 (the wise one) 😉 , so she is still going under the radar 😀 .
Hope to read all of you soon!!! 😀
Amazing analysis on the theme of the ep @pm3 @OAL 👏👏👏
The presence of the mother during Junwan’s conversation with JW followed by the failed proposal. Without saying anything, we can conclude God didn’t approve of the relationship. I also just realized how ironic it was for Jang to ask JW to leave god and choose her. I don’t get why some people think this is romantic🤢🤢🤢
@nrllee i love the cinderella analogy for our princess songhwa, and how DLL is the link between them. Although Jang’s whole storyline looked like a fairytale, she is definitely not princess material because no matter how many make over she gets from the outside and inside (credits to the writers), we can see right through her. She is not kind, caring and sincere. Nothing she does is from her heart.
Not everyone, even the nice character, get a happy ending in prison playbook so i am seriously hoping we can get a malpractice case from her. It is a good way to ties in her lack of development and poor empathy as a doctor.
Thank you @pm3 for this post! Thinking back, mothers have always been important and existing in this series, even the first episode of S1 had that mother consoled by SHwa in the elevator. To see it getting highlighted in this episode feels like we are on the verge of something really important.
Thank you @Packmule3 and @AOL for this insightful analysis of mothers.
I wonder if we are to see and hear some more about Jang’s mother (apart from today’s ep 8). I must say, considering Jang’s cold and unaffecionate personality I was surprised that her mother was somebody who would end a phone call so casually with an ‘I love you’ and Jang saying it back – of course. As @Packmule3 says it doesn’t need to mean that she is close with her mother, but still somehow, stereotypically, I wouldn’t expect her to grow up in a home where family members express their feelings so openly (we were speculating about her having an abusive father though). And then the line: Now I’ll g to sleep when I heard your voice – that was something rather tender I would say. We didn’t get to see any follow up of this conversation though and as you said it was rather weird for the mother to call at that hour (Jang is presented as a hard working character, so her mother must now that trait of her personality, right, why would she call at that hour then? – it should be something important but we didn’t see what). Anyhow it was some discrepancy there, in my oppinion. But maybe I’m overthinking here.
And I agree on Jang being made seemingly unattractive (ie. even not paying attention to her looks, apart from going on a date with JW but that comes later) is adding to her tropey false cindirella character. Or maybe a female version of the frog prince – who can reveal their true beauty when kissed by a loving princess/prince, here JW. This is also adding fuel to this ridiculous worshipping game by WGers.
@Linnea, Jzng’s been kissed by our handsome prince so much that it’s making me nauseous. She hasn’t changed one bit. And when it comes to fairy tales my vote is for Shin Lee, who are the greatest trolls that ever ,ived. I really want to put them under a crumbling bridge. That will serve them right for messing with our minds.
There’s no housekeeping post for Ep 8 yet and I can’t enter the Alfresco thread but I am soooooo having opinions about tonight’s episode which makes me wanting to skip the show altogether.
*spoiler alert*
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ShinLee seems to be pretty set on setting everyone as couples. WG, Iksong, Bidulgi and GomGom. So unless there are major plot twists in the next four eps, looks like that’s the way they are going to wrap the show. No plans for Season 3 yet, right? Looks like probably this is it for them all. It sucks but well, we’ll see.
No DLL and seems like that children’s hospital is just a pipe dream for now. And I agree with some posters on how they are doing character rehabilitation on Gyeowool tonight. Really pushing hard for viewers to like her, like, “like me like me like meeeeeee”.
That being said I do find the irony of tonight’s ep interesting, ie we worry so much about Pabo and his mom and yet, it’s Shaw’s mom who got Parkinson’s. Of course, Ikjun the opportunist swooped in and pretty much seized the moment to be Shaw’s man. Ok that’s another topic but still, the irony on the mother’s story is interesting.
Tonight’s ep is about mother’s anyway.
I probably will skip watching the drama until the end of the final show and continue on reading the views here, which I love as it’s pretty much dissenting what general international fans think. Love you guys
@Fly,
Huh? There should be a Housekeeping thread. It should have posted last night. 😂 Let me check what happened.
@OAL you’re so right, haha, after being kissed so many times she haven’t changed at all. And our lovely prince from season 1 is slowly changing into an ugly frog himself, and I don’t mean his looks of course.
Just a postscript.
I believe it was @nrllee who first spotted this. (Correct me if I’m wrong…)
In Episode 4, the song was “Let’s Forget It.” The lyrics went like this:
Lyric:
That’s why @nrllee determined that Jang being a no-show at the cathedral was already foreshadowed.
Also, in the protected tweet on “OSTs,” I mentioned that there was a Marian/Mary statue filmed in the music video of the original song. I find it interesting that the director spotlighted the Pieta in this episode.
I’ll edit the thread and add the screenshot there. 🙂
Yes @packmule3. IJ even looked straight at PaBo when he sang those lyrics. That’s as deliberate as it can get? And he looked at SHwa when he sang about forgetting the birthday gifts…his failed “proposal” (ring) to SHwa from way back?