Done, @GB. The thread is open.
This is too long for me, @GB and @Kate. But I may pop in once in a while to see how Yang Zi’s and Deng Wei’s characters are progressing. (Lol. I hope I’m not betting on the wrong horse here.)
Enjoy the show!
79 Comments On “Lost You Forever: Eps 1 to 6 Open Thread”
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Thank you @Packmule3 and @GB for suggesting!
Brilliant.
I’ll add some thoughts here a little later today.
I have just this morning read comments about this show on ‘Koalas Playground’.
If you read the first paragraph a high level of enthusiasm communicated about this show from someone who has translated the novel. She says she feels she isn’t writing enough about this show based in its quality!
It is on 33000 points in China’s ‘Hot Buzz Ranking’ – very high apparently whatever that means!
https://koalasplayground.com/2023/08/03/tencent-celebrates-lost-you-forever-crossing-33000-on-the-hot-buzz-ranking-becoming-a-how-high-can-it-go-hit-c-drama/
Another tidbit…
Apparently Qing Shui Town took six months to build. The team started work on the construction in 2021.
Quing Shui is where Wen Xiaoliu lives and works at the ‘Rejuvenation Clinic’ with Mu, Freckly and Skinny.
I wasn’t aware of this but was struck by and greatly enjoyed the level of attention to detail in the scenes in Quing Shui.
It must have been fun to film there and some of the cast commented on what a happy time it was.
It reminds me of the satisfaction of watching Hobbits in their homes and village in Lord of the Rings.
Thanks so much @pkml3! Your bet is as good as mine! I’m sure I’ll keep changing my mind about which guy the FL should end up with. They will all have their flaws and strengths, and they are all delish!!
Hi @Kate, I’m finally back from my rounds of having to go out to do stuff.
I’m managing, despite the distractions and interruptions to reach Episode 5. I’ll get back with more impressions later.
@GB –
Here are some brief notes about the background story in Episode One.
I am sure you will have noticed oodles of things I have not picked up on but I thought I would get the ball rolling.
SPOILERS
Episode 1
There are various kingdoms with various royal families and powerful clans.
The opening scene takes place at Zhouyan Palace on Xyan Mountain the seat of one of the Royal Families.
We see a happy scene with two devoted playmates and their Grandma.
Studious young prince (Cang Xuan) and cheeky, quick witted young princess, Xio Yao, Haoling Jui Yao. She is his ‘younger sister’ and is his cousin, in fact, daughter of the King and Queen of the Haoling Kingdom.
We see some of their interplay and care for one another. A treasured relationship.
There then follows a sequence of tragic events which relentlessly and completely alter the course of their lives, tearing them from this childhood idyll,
He loses his Father in battle (betrayed by a royal uncle). His Mother avenges her husband and kills herself at the funeral having said goodbye to her grieving son. Poor little soul!
She gives him a Ruomu flower to give to his future love before she takes her own life inconsolable for the loss of her husband. Flowers are, of course, very symbolic in this show. I found this in Wiki:
In Chinese mythology, Fusang refers to a divine tree and an island which are both located in the East, from where the sun rises. A similar tree, known as the Ruomu (若木) exists in the west, and each morning, the sun was said to rise in Fusang and fall on Ruomu.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusang
The young princess is the daughter of the King and Queen of Haoling.
Following the death of the prince’s parents the Queen of Haoling (also a military mom and Princess General) tells the royal Grandma that she has divorced the King of Haoling and will stay on to take care of the children. This divorce, I think, hints at a key plot reveal that I haven’t yet encountered in the first 21 episodes.
Military Mom is also killed in a crucial battle. A profound sense of abandonment for the poor young Princess and Military Mum had promised to come back for her. This event is key for the young princess’s identity and loss of confidence in people being there for her. We will see this play out powerfully in the main story.
Grief, abandonment and the two children are torn apart as the young Princess is sent to Mount Jade for her protection and to cultivate her powers.
The young prince cries on the mountain top as the princess is spirited away in an air-born carriage.
Beautiful performances by our two young leads. Re-watching it hits home even more because of what you know they will go through.
So much of this show is about letting go…
Then there comes a three hundred year leap! I’ll stop here for now.
It is worth taking careful note at the potted history we get at 39′ 25” into Episode 1.
The Quing Shui tree sprite (?) is relating historic events and gives us this very useful potted account of the rise of the powerful Xian kingdom and the weakening of the kingdom of Chenrong.
The last minute assignment of Military Mum (Queen of Haoling) to battle against General Chi Chen of Chenrong led to a fight that resulted in both their deaths.
I think we will learn a lot more about this event later in the show.
Episode One continued
Back to the present day. Our FL (Yang Zi) is now a man and works as a fertility doctor in Quing Shui town!
Wen Xiao Liu is clearly aware of his past identity. He scornfully corrects key details in the tree sprite’s account of the royal family history and the separation of the two orphans hundreds of years ago.
Our young Prince has been forced to leave his family home and is now a hostage prince in the Haoling royal family. He has a close relationship with the second royal princess of that family but is still searching for his lost childhood friend.
He, and his sister, are approaching Quing Shui town…
Quick clarification – Wen Xiao Liu is the masculine ‘form’ of the woman Xia Lao.
There is still a woman deep inside the male identity that Xio Yao now embodies.
XY is aware of this at times as are other discerning individuals too.
@Kate, thank you for your information and your thorough notes, with comprehensive summary. They’ve added a wealth of information that I didn’t take note of or research. I confess that I did nod off from time to time, and your notes woke me up to the fact that I missed some important bits. LOL.
So much happened in just the first episode alone!! It took me ages to pause and make my own notes as well, to get the names right and figure out who belonged where.
Of the side characters, I find the grandpa King of Xiyan to be one of the worst parents. He allowed one son (9th uncle to Cang Xuan) to get away with killing thousands of soldiers in order to get his own brother (4th uncle to Xiao Yao) killed.
Cang Xuan’s mother, Chang Pu, I personally feel, was the most misguided of women, in thinking that avenging her husband’s death and then killing herself was the right thing to do. And in front of her own son!!! I found it selfish (self indulgent even) that she let her grief overcome her/take priority over her responsibilities as leader of her clan (of Ruoshui) and mother of Cang Xuan.
Yes, the flower motif is strong in this show. We have sweet, red Poinciana flowers on the huge tree, and red Ruomu flowers that seemed to sprout from a creeper that magically grew over the tomb of Cang Xuan’s father, Xiyan Zhongyi. The flower motif on foreheads is also the means by which we will see Cang Xuan tries to locate Xiao Yao.
Thank you for giving us the significance of the Ruomu flower. It has ties to the Fusang tree or mythological tree of life, since the same sun that rises and shines on Fusang continues to shine on Ruomu, somehow binding the two together at the beginning and end. This elicits a sense of the ‘forever and ever’ that comes in the title and in the promise that the children had to make, to trust and care for each other.
I felt very much the unfairness of how the weight of responsibility for a whole clan/kingdom was laid on the shoulders of young Cang Xuan. His grandfather was still alive but the poor boy is told that he’s the only man left to protect the kingdom.
I thought that the show was clever to give a voice over narration of the happenings of 300 years with some animation, to fulfill the show-not-tell rule of dramas, and to quickly bring us up to speed. It was also a way to demonstrate to us that while Xiao Yao appeared to be so different person in the form of Wen Xiao Liu, she had not forgotten whom she was and the details of her parting with Cang Xuan.
Hi @GB,
Thank you. I picked up a lot of this second time around. As you said, so much happens in Episode 1 that details become a blur.
I so agree re the hard-heartedness of the Grandfather and the misguided actions of Cang Xuan’s mother. Shocking!
Had this been a present day drama the whole theme of it would have been Cang Xuan’s psychological and emotional recovery! Never mind all the adventures and battles.
Agreed – that narration was needed. The tree sprite is a very useful person and plot device in what is a multi-layered story.
One can only sympathise with the little chap who is Cang Xuan.
Thankfully, as you know, there is far more light and shade in the next episodes!
But the detail of that first episode is helpful as I discovered when I got further into the plot and was not clear about who was who.
I like the set up of some aspects of the characters in their childhood, which we then will see played out when they are adults.
SPOILERS of course
SPOILERS
Xiao Yao is the feisty, attention getter, great talker and good-hearted loyal friend, who prefers to capitulate in order to make up with Cang Xuan when they quarrel. She claims to be taller than him and a better fighter, and she is. She taunts him into proving his ability to be the older brother by saying that he is afraid to lose. (We see later that she uses the same taunt on another character).
Cang Xuan was the gege who was kind towards his younger sister. He accepted XY’s apology by accepting her token of the tail of the Nine-Tailed Fox, only to return it to her because he knew she loathed to part with it. We see that as an adult he will dote on and over-indulge his next meimei.
Xiao Yao’s mother, Xiling Heng, writes and then hides the Classics of Herbs and Classics of Poisons, using her magic. (Maybe we’ll see those classics again later). It is noteworthy that XY has inherited her mother’s talents with herbs and poisons as she takes on the role of ‘doctor’.
Before XY leaves CX behind, she tells him to water the Jasper Mulberry tree with wine, and then when wine is made from the Mulberry Tree, to wait for her before he drinks it. It is likely this suggestion/promise that gets CX to set himself up in the wine-making business LOL.
Perhaps he hoped that the presence of mulberry wine might draw XY to his store, since she was a great foodie and the first to offer him a flask of mulberry honey/wine to help him chase away his sadness. LOL the innocent kids did not know that adults drank themselves drunk to forget bad stuff, and could have gotten themselves super drunk!!
Do you know @GB the way you describe Xiao Yao… those characteristics show up again and again in the story. She’s a strategic capitulator. How interesting!
I hadn’t noticed the hiding of the Classics of Herbs and Classics of Poisons…mmmm
Yes, great point re the Mulberry wine. It is used later in the story in a number of ways.
I’ll add some comments now re Episode 2
We can go as slowly as needed @GB… I’m in no rush.
SPOILER
Cang Xuan looking at second sister dancing under the plum blossom tree, showered with white blossoms.
He is then showered with white and with red blossoms – the red blossoms coming from his memory of life with his first playmate, Princess Xiao Yao.
This is great visual story telling – we don’t need a narration of his feelings at this point.
The whole sequence with our FL, as Wen Xia Liu, taking care of the tortured, barely alive, Ye Shi Qui – is moving and tells you a lot about both people and the relationship they will have.
Ye Shi Qui’s innate kindness when so ill and frail in preventing hot wax from a candle falling on Wen Xia Lu as he/she sleeps (how are we going to describe the FL here??), is striking.
Then, of course, the key moment when Ye Shi Qui realises that Wen Xia Liu is a woman: ‘He is a woman’.
Story so well told again… WXL can’t hide embarrassment when taking off Ye Shi Qui’s clothing. Nicely done with their images reflected in the water of the bath but softened by the steam rising from the surface.
And the ‘reveal’ as our handsome stranger steps out of the hospital… WXL can’t help staring.
ps I forgot to mention the healing quality of our FL’s blood which is used to save Ye Shi Qui’s life.
This is another big theme of course and plays out in many ways!
Ep 3 – after this I will break.
SPOILERS
Our very well defended female lead makes the poor guy – Leaf Seventeen aka Ye Shi Qui – work hard to get her to agree that he can stay.
This is part of her brusque defensive strategy – she doesn’t allow people into that tight knit group with ease. They are her family.
‘Who exactly are you?’ Mu asks Ye Shi Qui (Leaf Seventeen). YSQ is hiding happily in the safety of this little family and terrified his true identity as a noble be exposed.
He looks at his reflection mirrored in the water of a pond near the river… and will only answer to Ye Shi Qui the name he has been given at the Rejuvenation Centre. An echo of another moment where he and the FL in a man’s form, can be seen in the awkwardness of mutual attraction reflected in the water of the bath tub and blurred at the same time by the steam coming from the surface.
Again we see her, WXL’s bravery, care and compassion in the actions she takes despite her brusque and jocular manner. She takes great personal risks to look for rare herbs in the territory of the Chenrong army.
In this territory lives a powerful demon called Xian Lu.
She is followed by the, clearly, quietly devoted Ye Shi Qui. I love the simplicity of this time together. He is wordless but considerate.
He is of course quite unlike the next man she meets – Xiang Liu. strategic commander of the depleted Chenrong forces and a nine-headed serpent demon, to boot. Xiang Liu is played by Tan Jian Ci in an imposing, quietly threatening and yet wistful manner. Mostly imposing and threatening at this point in the story!
The encounter and ensuing relationship between them is unusual and at times very puzzling. Is it abusive? In many ways yes… but we are dealing with a serpent demon! XL doesn’t hold back from the unexpected or brutal. ‘He is ruthless and acts without regard’ explains the FL to Ye Shi Qui.
XL is also aware that the man before him is a woman. FL gives away her essential female self by singing to attract a special mountain creature, Fei Fei who can be sold.
Poor little Fei Fei…
‘Who are you exactly?’ XL asks our FL in male form. XL knows that all is not as it appears with the man he has captured in the forest. Just as XL himself can take on different forms.
‘Who are you?’ is also the question our lead character will ask herself at various points in this story. The interrogation takes her and us back into her history. She answers: ‘I am just an abandoned person with no-one to rely on. I couldn’t protect myself’ and we are back with her childhood trauma.
We discover in a later episode that her account to XL of her background creates a link between them – even though you wouldn’t know it from his behaviour!!
Hi @Kate, just a quick comment before I run off for most of today with several things to do.
You said
Yes, I like to see if the Writer is consistent in how characters are portrayed. So far, so good, because I forgot to mention that indeed those characteristics of XY show up again when she’s an adult, even within the first 5 episodes.
Another similar act of hers… she’s awfully strong. She carried her brother, CX when they were children after he got bullied, and she carries the almost dead Ye Shi Qi (a Princess carry! No less!!)
If we take the style of being carried as a sign of whom she’ll end up with, the more romantic is the ‘Princess carry’ of Shi Qi. So perhaps the romance is to blossom between these 2. (I’d be perturbed if the serpent got the girl!!!)
With CX, it was the brother-carry LOL.
But really, I do not mind who gets the girl in the end, as long as the girl got to choose!!!
Good points @GB – yes, see how you think the writer continues to build on what we know of our central characters.
I have to say that as the show progresses the appeal of the serpent increases! LOL
Talk some sense into me please!
I also love the shy smiles of Shi Qi and his thoughtfulness.
I have managed to get hold of Koalas’s translation of the book! It is on the Koala’s Playground website. I may do some extra reading.
Please give yourself time just to enjoy this show, btw, @GB with no pressure to add comments until you feel the desire to.
I will comment on episodes episodically…perhaps in threes.
I’ll also look out for your comments as and when.
I’d rather you simply enjoy a good chunk of the show IF it continues to appeal and then we discuss later.
NO rush dear @GB.
I’m on holiday at the moment – staycationing – so have a little more time than I usually would but am also wanting to be very relaxed.
ps I have changed my mind. Having commented on opening episodes, I’ll take my lead from you for a good pace for any comments.
I want this to be super relaxed.
My dear @Kate, I did have the thought that the Serpent would start to become a bit more winsome… that’s the crunch!!! Root for the guy who seems so cool, despite his obvious failings (like cruelty)… or for the not so exciting but dependable, loving guy? That’s what makes this kind of show so delectable to savour. We know we shouldn’t, but our ‘hearts’ gives us the FEELS for the ‘wrong’ guy!!
That’s not to say that the ‘wrong’ guy might not actually become better (it’s best that he becomes better regardless of the FL, rather than because of her, but show will generally make falling in love with her the springboard for his great conversion) and therefore more in line with the kind of person we don’t mind our daughters hanging out with LOL.
That, to me, is the test of whether I could really approve the character as acceptable boyfriend material. Would I introduce him to my daughter? Hmmm. But as a viewer, I can ship him any way I wish.
Not to worry about my pace, dear Kate. I’ll read you as you post or not, and add my thoughts as I write them. All easy going and relaxed. That’s how I want to enjoy this show.
Now back to the show and to see if any ideas start percolating!! 🤔🧐🥸🤭
@Packmule 3 – I have mis-posted with wrong name as you will see because my comment is awaiting moderation. Please delete.
@GB – really like your comments.
There is a lot to the serpent demon and I will write more when we are further in!
Done, @Kate!
I don’t have my laptop so I’m unable to change your username for you. Thsnks.
Thanks @Packmule! I need to pay attention when I post.
Sorry to interfere in what seems like a rather personal discussion but wanted to chime in that I’m loving Lost You Forever in every way. Glad to see an OT here and reading your comments. I’m up to date so having this OT was a pleasant surprise on days where the show will not be uploading further episodes.
Some thoughts on our FL’s early relationship with Qiang Liu and with Shiki (from the early part of Episode 4)
There is a dramatic stand off between the usually meek Ye Shiki and the Chenrong soldiers and Xiang Liu. Unexpected strength and determination of Shiki… unafraid in this context. He is clearly concealing great power.
Qiang Liu quietly appraises the scene and lets them go… He is amused and intrigued by the two of them hiding their fundamental identities – one a high level deity and the other a woman.
Then a lovely, tender scene as the injured FL piggy backs on Shiki who carries her through the forest.
Our survivor FL can’t understand Shiki’s persistence in finding her. She doesn’t understand the way he loves her and has committed himself to her.
There is an unnervingly unconditional, unguarded quality to this devotion. I say, unnervingly, because I wonder at Shiki’s ability to be wise in relation to the FL who is a survivor in the end and may or may not be able to respond to his love.
Does that make sense?
He takes care of her wounds in a cave – their quiet closeness is refreshing and so restful in the context of the story. They have both cared for and shared wounded bodies with the other.
As Shiki puts the antiseptic powder on FL’s back, he hesitates – just as she did – when it comes to touching her back directly. He knows this man is a woman.
When we compare the early relationships between our FL and QL, on the one hand, and Shiki on the other…
At this stage she placates and fears QL but is also profoundly honest with him about her questions of identity and the deep pain of abandonment when he presses her. QL is intrigued by her and is in some way moved by her description of abandonment and suffering.
With Shiki, she lets her guard down – although the guard goes up and down depending upon how threatened she feels by potential closeness – and is chatty and relaxed. She isn’t trying to impress. She is clearly fond of him. The nature of that fondness is ambiguous. Her being taken aback by his body, and newly handsome appearance in Episode 3, tells us that this is not the fondness she has for Freckly and Skinny!
@Wapz
Please join in if you want to. That would be great.
It’s such an interesting show. Too much to discuss really.
I am also up to Episode 22 but have gone back to the start again which is proving rewarding!
ps I hope more people will join the discussion.
The more the merrier!
Hi @Wapz, please join us. This is an open thread and we would really like more commenters to chime in so that we get more ideas and discussion!!!
I’m going to rewatch Ep 2 so that I don’t write nonsense LOL.
The indignity of being Wen Xio Liu (second part of Episode 4)
The number of times we see WXL (our FL in a man form) on the floor being whipped, pushed onto the ground by Cang Xuan to recover the antidote for a poison, dropped from a height, forced to placate, to submit.
WXL laughs to himself in Episode 4 as he lies on the floor winded by Cang Xuan’s power. Shiki was supposed to block CX but has disappeared unexpectedly.
The laughter on the floor isn’t jolly laughter though. WXL -our FL- is laughing because her experience of being let down by Shiki has reaffirmed all her beliefs about people and her life experience.
Cang Xuan moves to help WXL get up and is met with bitter anger and pushed away.
EPISODE 2 – SOMETHING NOTED
Cang Xuan does so much for A Nian without complaint, and indulges her so completely. I feel that he is constantly trying to make up for the fact that XY disappeared while waiting for him. She had gone missing when no one had come for her and she had left on her own to look for her father in Haoling (so says the Storyteller Tree Spirit).
As @Kate pointed out, even seeing A Nian twirl under a white Plum Blossom tree made CX think of XY under a red Poinciana tree. Yes it was beautifully filmed with the appearance of red petals joining the white, added by his memory.
He admits to not being able to sleep when he thinks of XY, regretting that she must think him useless for not being able to locate her.
When after he’s had a long night out, A Nian does not want the breakfast that XY bought for her, he takes the trouble to cook for her from scratch. But he is thinking of XY and how she also was a picky eater, not liking mutton or flat bread. He had not been able to cook for her then, but now he was able to cook for another sister. He even wonders what food XY currently likes to eat.
It seems that most of what he does for A Nian, are actually done with XY in mind. It remains to be seen if his devoted love for XY are for a sister or for a lover.
THE FLOWER MOTIF AND XY’S HEALING POWERS
Not only do flowers play a part in CX’s and XY’s past, but we see that Beggar Shi Qi has deity power to make flowers bloom. Although practically dead, he holds a lone red flower stalk in his hand. (In a later episode we will see that flowers wilt according to his emotions).
There were no other flowers about. This means that he had the power to take a dead stalk and bring it to life in his hands. XY makes a note of this.
She deliberately makes the relationship with the Beggar transactional, by saying that she stepped on his sesame seed cake, and asked what compensation he wanted. That gave her the way in to help him, and to princess carry him home, to heal him. LOL.
From the start, she did not want to get close to the Beggar. Perhaps it was because he was not a mere mortal like Mu, Pimply/Freckly and Skinny, but a deity of some kind. She did not trust easily and in case her patient wanted to be free, she did not want to create any ties that would bind him.
It seems that unknown to her mortal friends, XY’s healing powers come not only from her talent with herbs and poisons, but from her blood. As a last ditch effort to save the Beggar whom she finds had shielded her from hot wax, she gives him her blood to drink.
Beggar’s recovery is amazing. When he is able to get up and out after a bath, we see that he stands under branches abloom with yellow flowers.
I forgot to mention, that looking at the flower in Beggar’s hand, XY remembered a very similar red flower that had been outside a cage in which XY as a child, had been imprisoned. She had tried to reach the flower but could not.
The sight of the flower, and the Beggar’s distressing appearance, may have awoken a sense of solidarity with the Beggar in XY’s heart.
XY acting and reacting – what moves her towards Xiang Liu (Ep 4 final chunk)
It is clear re-watching this episode that part of XY’s early dynamic with the serpent demon involves reaction to feeling let down by Shiki.
You see the expression on her face as we hear the bird cry and see Xiang Liu approaching carried by his faithful giant bird (humorous touch… I think he calls him fluffy or something similar!). XY has a ‘Who cares? Why not?’ daredevil expression on her face.
XY is more open to Xiang Liu in the context of her personal pain. He ends up being something of a ‘bad boy’ confident.
From a great height they discuss XY’s behaviour towards Shiki. Xiang Liu is very perceptive in his questioning. XY is mad at herself for trusting Shiki.
Then this strange and fun scene when XY falls back into the water below from a great height – expressing her freedom from depending on anyone -not Shiki and not even Xiang Lu when she is being carried on the giant bird??
@GB –
I hadn’t picked up on Cang Xuan’s ‘replacement brothering’ to the extent that you underline it here. It’s a pity that the object of his devotion is such a brat… but you hinted earlier that her character may well be the result of his guilt-driven indulgence of her.
I really like the detail in your reflections on Episode 2 and the connection between flowers, Shiki’s deity powers, and XY’s openness to him.
I had forgotten Shiki’s impact on flowers and nature and also the solidarity evoked by the red flower and memories of seeing one outside of her cage.
Perhaps, too, she needs clues in nature to steer her decisions after the uncertainty of human behaviour.
Hi @Kate, I like your idea that XY might need clues in nature to help her decide whether to trust a human being or not. I assume that flowers blooming around a person means that person is likely to be trustworthy.
As you mentioned earlier, XY has abandonment issues and a lack of trust. Her questioning of Shi Qi before allowing him to stay on as her servant included a question on when he would leave her.
That’s why she was so angry with herself for trusting Shi Qi, only to find him gone into hiding to save himself. She could not really blame him for wanting to hide, but it hit a sore spot for her since she was abandoned in her time of need, again.
I’m moving on to rewatching Ep 4. I know what you mean, and agree that the way she was with Serpent, was probably fueled by her emotional upset over Shi Qi.
I may have a note on identity after Ep 4 or so.
Surprise bite! (end of Episode 4 and start of Episode 5)
This is a show that goes there … isn’t it?
I was shocked the first time this happened. I had been lulled into a cozy, comedy place and then Xiang Liu asserted his serpentyness!
It is important that we are aware of XY’s healing properties – the impact of her blood.
There are also erotic overtones as we see later.
Looking forward to your comments on Episode 4 @GB!
Hi @Kate and Everyone, I just putting odd thoughts down although I’ve yet to fully rewatch Ep 6 and 7 to check on points.
EPISODES 1-5 (with bits from 6 and 7)
SORTING OUT THE DIFFERENT LEADS AND AGENDAS
There is a particular similarity between the Xiao Yao/Wen Siao Liu, Shi Qi/Tushan Jing, and Jiang Liu (Serpent). They were mistreated as children or adults. We get to see flashbacks of them remembering a time when they were either imprisoned in small cages, unkempt and beaten, or abandoned and left for dead.
Cang Xuan was also abandoned but not mistreated to the same extent, although it seems that he was turned out of his kingdom and taken by the Haoling Kingdom as a hostage until the present day. He was still in danger of being assassinated by either one of his uncles. I wonder what his useless grandfather is doing, if he’s still alive.
The reason Xiao Yao had to change her name and hide her identity remains a mystery. She was supposed to have been with the Queen Mother in the Jade Mountain, but we only hear of Cang Xuan searching for her, and maybe her grandfather and her father might have tried.
But there’s some reason that Cang Xuan is not telling the Xiyan people that he’s still searching for her. XY herself seems to know her own origins but she claims to want to spend her life as a simple physician. However at one time she had been happy to cultivate her spirit powers and from what we saw when she was a child, she would have been a powerful deity.
We later hear that her power was limited by something that her captors (nine-tailed foxes?) fed her.
Cang Xuan pretends to be a wine-seller but he’s out to get the Xiyan throne by overthrowing the Chengrong rebels, while secretly searching for Xiao Yao. His relationship with A Nian is a bit strange. He keeps saying that because she calls him gege, he should reciprocate as a brother and take responsibility for her and all her offences. But he has evinced no actual affection for A Nian. Instead his thoughts turn to Xiao Yao.
Tushan Jing had been stripped of his noble status about 3 years(?) Before he met XY and decided to remain incognito. Perhaps being found too soon would mean that he’d be targeted once again. His Tushan family seems to be descended from the Nine-tailed Fox. Instead of seeking to return to the family he had chosen to hang around XY as her servant indefinitely.
Of the 4 leads, only Jiang Liu has no need to hide his identity. It’s interesting from MDL that his surname is Fangfeng and given name is Bei. He belongs to the Fangfeng family which might all be descended from serpents. He seems to be loyal to the Chengrong rebels but his own motives and agenda are not clear. When XY suggested that he could get more power by affiliating himself with Xiyan, he had rejected the thought with disdain. In Episode 4 when he was to be taken alive to be given the choice to work for Cang Xuan, he had killed the soldiers, making it clear that he refused to be captured and used.
Despite being cruel and ruthless, and not being above using coercion to get what he wants, he had a streak of fairness in his dealings with those who were non-partisan. Instead of a majestic name, his great white Eagle is called Chubby LOL. He has evinced a curiosity about XY, who is unlike any of the people he has about him. Aside from XY, he seems to have no one to talk to.
Among the characters Jiang Liu, Tushan Jing and Xiao Yao are the most interesting because they are not what they seem, and more mystery still surrounds them.
@GB and everyone who is watching this show
Lovely to wake up to these reflections in a different time zone!
Happy Sunday to you.
Great linkage of lives and themes @GB.
Other translations of the ‘Chubby’ the Condor’s name include ‘Furball’!
Xiang Liu’s loyality to the failing Chenrong cause – what is he going to get out of that? – tells us something about the principles he holds. He won’t be bought out.
Yes…’Furball’ ‘Chubby’ is not the name a heartless demon would give to his condor companion pet/ride/messenger.
A few additional points. According to Koala (of Koala’s PlayGround) Cang Xuan and his sister also travel in disguise. There seem to be so many assumed forms in this show. I guess they must do that because of all the danger to their lives.
I don’t know where Koala gets that information from unless there is something in the novel that clarifies this. But their primary identities are not known and, of course, XY doesn’t recognise CX until a critical juncture in the story.
Fangfeng Bei is a character who appears later in the show. No spoilers here – there will be more to say.
THOUGHTS ON THE IDENTITIES OF THE DEMON AND DEITIES
The UnrecognisedThe irony is that CX who is so sincerely searching for his Xiao Yao, cannot recognise her in Wen Xiao Liu. He has so fixated his idea of her as the young girl with the peach flower emblem on her forehead, that it never occurs to him she could masquerade as a man. Of the three men in her life, only he cannot penetrate her disguise, when she sits before him talking, eating and drinking.
The question arises: why does XY herself, never attempt to make contact with her brother, CX, whom she must know has been looking for her? She too fails to recognise him in the identity of a wine-seller, although he uses the name Xuan.
Identity embraced: Xiao Yao has managed to transform herself into a man who has lived for over 20 years in the small town of Qingshui. One assumes that she has never manifested her spirit powers among the mortals there, but surely the people should be wondering why she never ages. When asked who she is, she sticks to the name of Wen Xiao Liu. She claims to want to continue as an ordinary physician, and to witness her found family continue peacefully into their old age.
As a child she had suffered a disease where she could not recall her face and was frantically asking herself, who she was. In Episode 3, on top of being Wen Xiao Liu, XY gains an added identity of being Jiang Liu’s person, the one who would work for him and obey him. She chafes at this new role in private but to Serpent’s face is all smiles and accommodation.
Identity unwanted and identity negated: Tushan Jing does not want to return to his real identity. Even when the maids of his noble household recognise him, he chooses to go back to Xiao Yao twice, wanting to remain as Ye Shi Qi. He wanted to keep his new identity, rather than go back to the privileged life of the nobility. However XY tells him that in their world there is no Ye Shi Qi.
Hearing the name ‘Tushan Jing’, Cang Xuan seems to recognise it.
False Identity Acknowledged: XY needs to get Tian Er redeemed from the brothel for Skinny. XY goes to CX to ask for a favour, knowing that despite his appearance, he and A Nian are not ordinary mortals. She does not care about their real identities but knows CX has influence over the brothel or Tian Er and can smoothen the way for Tian Er to be redeemed. He agrees to help, confessing to also being curious about XY’s identity.
We later find out from Tian Er that she had been paid her a huge sum to get information about XY from Skinny, for an unidentified man.
The Preferred Identity of Being Ordinary: CX asks his servant, Sang, who he would be if he was not a prince of Xiyan. He observes that his own parents had not wanted to be royalty. They had wanted an ordinary family life, to enjoy a peaceful life , but had failed to realize it.
Sang : “Good people get good returns. Your Highness, you will definitely find Princess.
CX : “If I truly can find Xiao Yao, living an ordinary life with her in Qingshui Town would be nice as well.”
We find that like XY, CX would also prefer an ordinary life.
Another similarity between them, they both thought/suggested that Serpent should work for Xiyan. Hmmm… interesting? Significant?
To be continued…
Continued…
The Pretense that can become Truth: XY and Shi Qi watch Skinny and Tian Er behaving like a happy couple. XY observes that the marriage is an interesting gamble.
XY : “Tian Er doesn’t believe Skinny will sincerely spend a lifetime with her. Now what she shows to Skinny is all pretense, but Skinny doesn’t know about it. If Tian Er is nice to him, he will be nicer to Tian er. When Tian Er sees that Skinny treats her better, then the pretense will be mixed with sincerity. In the end, as time goes by, the false will become true. But this process involves risks. Tian Er is gambling with her heart. If Skinny reneges, one of these two will die certainly.” (This is a prefiguring of what we will get with XY and Serpent?)
XY continues thoughtfully : “My life is long. I can wait for the ending.”
Shi Qi : “Tian Er is very brave.”
XY : “People scorn trading pretense for sincerity. You, on the other hand, appreciate it.”
Shi Qi : “Even if it’s pretense, she has bet her future, giving that person a chance to trade sincerity for sincerity.”
(I wonder when we will see this played out. Probably in Season 2???
Will it be XY, who is definitely very brave as well, who will gamble with her heart with Serpent? [The synopsis suggests this…] Or will she bet her future on Cang Xuan? [The synopsis says no, I think] And what role will Shi Qi play? His life is also long. Will he be the 3rd wheel and watch the ending?)
The Identity of the Hidden Gender: In Episode 6, when XY with her injured leg, stands up to hop around Shi Qi for fun, she’s the playful boss with her dependable servant. But when she falls against his chest and feels his arm around her, she becomes aware of him as a man and that she is a woman. He, being fully aware that she’s a woman, decides to take the opportunity to get closer to her. We get a Princess Carry reversal now when he throws away her crutch and carries her home against his chest. XY is stunned into silence LOL.
She goes into her room and finds herself flustered. Shi Qi remains outside looking shy but pleased with himself that he’d taken the opportunity to carry her. I like that we get to see both their expressions concurrently on either side of her room door. They are kind of cute. XY has to slap herself to remind herself of the identity she has to maintain, which means that being physically close to Shi Qi unmans her LOL.
Shi Qi, who is already in love with XY, probably guessed that he was causing her a great deal of discombobulation, (love that word!) but decided to shake her up. We see that he paused to deliberate his next move before throwing away her crutch. In all the 6 years he was with her, he had never dared to change her stance with regard to him. Perhaps this was when he was beginning to try to get her to admit that she was a woman.
@GB,
This is great. As ever. I love your analyses.
It does also raise some questions for me about how we approach this thread both as a series of reflections and as a conversation.
At the moment, I am trying to match your pace in watching the show – and of course in different time zones that is tricky. This is such a watchable show that sticking to a number of episodes doesn’t work well. I went through it so quickly.
I am interested, for instance, in what you thought re Episode 4.
I think my best option will be to re-watch and take notes as I go along and understand that you will be watching at a goodly pace.
Then when you comment from different Episodes I will be ready with my notes of which episodes things come from.
I am trying to avoid commentary from much later episodes getting mixed in. I have to keep checking I am in the right bit of the story.
Good morning @Kate
‘Furball’ for that huge, fierce bird is cute too!
I’m not clear about how CX ends up as a hostage prince with the Haoling bunch. They simply trust him to take care of their princess and let him hop around the kingdoms with her. It’s rather strange.
They must know that he’s still working to get back his proper position in Xiyan, and having their princess dragged into it might not be a good idea. Of course he would not mind having her along, as a camouflage for his real business of spying on and defeating Chenrong.
Yes, they are not giving their real names, and hence are in disguise, but they do not disguise the fact that they are deities with spirit power.
Yes, Xiang Liu seems the kind that cannot be bought. He’s a smart strategist. I wonder what they pay him to keep him as their military advisor.
A Theme? – I was noticing that (and perhaps you mentioned this as well) a theme of this Show is that mortal or immortal, people are all about the same. There was no real advantage in having a long life. In the end we see that all kinds of people whether human, demon or deity have a childhood, want a happy family, can enjoy life or suffer, can get sick, can be killed. In Episode 6, XY says that it was the humans with their short lives that were more favoured by heaven, but she didn’t say why exactly. Only that the unchanging moon and beautiful scenery could get boring over time. Perhaps the shorter life span was a blessing to allay boredom!!!
Hi @Kate, would it be easier for us if we asked @pkml3 for more than 1 thread and split the episodes by thread?
I find that after a while, I tend to group a whole lot of episodes together to consider a theme or a thought that runs through several episodes. I usually post those types of comments on a much later episode thread.
Was there a particular aspect of Episode 4 that struck you?
Do you know it would be easier to do that. Yes @GB. Good thinking.
This is such a thematically rich show that I suspect we will struggle in one thread to keep the commentary and conversation working well together.
Re Episode 4 I wanted your take on XL’s asserting his serpentyness! Were you surprised by his biting approach to XY? I wasn’t expecting that development.
There is a scene in the novel later than this which indicates there is more to this than bloodthirsty serpent behaviour.
EPISODE 4 – MY ROUGH NOTES
Shi Qi is pretty awesome as he takes on the guards in order to save XY from Serpent. It’s obvious that he’s pretty powerful since he can take down so many men quite easily.
SQ is upset to see that XY has been tortured. He says firmly that he wants to take her away. Serpent is interested in this servant who can walk into the army camp unscathed and starts to examine him.
XY quickly intervenes. She won’t let Serpent look Shi Qi in the eye/set his sights on him and take him. Shi Qi is her person. LOL. Serpent respects that and says that she’s free to go.
Serpent and Shi Qi both know that XY is a woman and they both have their own stakes on her. From the first, they had already started to look at each other as rivals over XY, although for Serpent, it was not as a romantic rival…. yet.
It’s obvious to Serpent and XY that Shi Qi is a high ranking deity and that both SQ and XY were trying to hide their identities.
As XY tries to make the piggyback more a task of carrying home food LOL (is she embarrassed to be carried? Or is she teasing SQ that he’s just carrying home a dead weight with no significance?) Shi Qi says he wants her to just be herself because it’s XY that he’s willing to carry. It’s obvious to viewers that he’s been in love with her since the time she had saved him, but because both of them are hiding their identities, he cannot confess it.
Out of respect for her, he does not wish to touch her back with his hands and wraps a clean cloth over his hands in order to spread the powder medicine over her injuries.
Another statement of IDENTITY that I missed earlier…
XY to SQ: “I know that you’re Ye Shi Qi. I hope you will always be. But that is impossible. But as long as you don’t leave me, you’ll be Ye Shi Qi.”
We know that in 4 short episodes XY will be proven right.
(might be continued later…)
@GB – responding to your responses.
I need to check this but, apparently, the suggestion in the novel is that CX and his sister are in another form not merely using different names. That is not clear from the show and perhaps the show doesn’t do the same thing as you argue.
I do wonder why CX is so concerned to defeat Chenrong. They are a spent force. The only reason can be his desire to regain power and the throne. He is not a free character. None of the characters are free, that said, to do as they please.
His goals – as you say – get in the way of him seeing some fundamental things around him. Again, we see his assumptions getting in the way of his recognition of XY.
He feels to me both honourable and compromised.
Re Episode 4,
Yes the rivals for XY’s allegiance in a powerful stand off.
I loved seeing YS expressing some of his power.
I also lOVED the piggy back scene as Shiki carries the injured and (slightly embarrassed?) XY back. Such a tender scene with some key dialogue.
Thank you.
Oooh @Kate, analysing his serpentyness would be fun. It calls for a deep dive rewatch!
@pkml3 after initial rewatching we have a desire for more threads LOL.
@Kate, How about 6 episodes per thread, ending with just 3 episode for the last thread? Let’s leave this thread as the Open Thread that has Discussions on Episodes 1-6.
That would leave us with Episodes
7-12
13-18
19-24
25-30
31-36
37-39
So we need 6 more threads. Does that sound OK, @Kate?
Good thinking @GB! This sounds great.
Thank you for your thoughtfulness.
Many thanks indeed @Packmule3 for the new discussion threads for this show!
Much appreciated.
THE ALLURE OF THE NINE-HEADED SERPENT DEMON (notes from Episode 5)
There will be plenty of time to appreciate our MLs but I want to draw attention now to the early allure of Xiang Liu!
When I first encountered XL I was quite nervous of his scenes with people because of his unexpected and occasionally ruthless behaviour. I was scared they were going to get eaten or sliced through with an ice sword.
But he is as follows:
– Graceful and ice cool under pressure
Xiang Liu dances in battle. He is focused and thoughtful rather than agitated. I love his stillness and lack of redundancy in the way he communicates. This impression is helped by the use of an eery-sounding wind instrument which highlights XL’s otherness.
– Mesmerising
XY is drawn towards him despite herself – you can see her resisting and then succumbing to his allure in the scene in Episode 5 where XL visits her room after his battle with CX’s soliders.
– Vulnerable
We see him wounded and unable to defend himself in the presence of mischievous XY.
When he is feeding from XY he is also vulnerable – he needs XY even though he talks about polishing XY off for a good nourishing meal!
– Perceptive
Oh my goodness he sees right through people and the self-defensive ploys of XY. I find his acute observation of people very attractive.
– Surprisingly human??
Not sure about this one. Does having a Condor called ‘Chubby’ ‘Furball’ count?
Does it count that he has to put up with the indignity of XY drawing on his face when he is wounded and unable to stop her?
While we are still in the early episodes here is a rather nice trailer special about what went into the making and filming of the episodes in Quing Shui:
https://www.viki.com/videos/1237758v-making-of-specials
6 months to get planning permission and 7 months to build (correcting my earlier note).
MORE ON XIANG LIU
According to Koala (of Koala’s playground) all of Tong Hua’s leading men have been almost perfect. Xiang Liu represents a departure for the writer.
He is ‘an incredibly difficult male lead’ and to understand him requires not just the reading between lines but is like ‘the searching in the mist for a hint of something more.’
https://koalasplayground.com/2014/02/22/lost-you-forever-chapter-4-gathering-is-the-hardest-parting-is-the-easiest/
I would add that having an ML with that quality of elusiveness works well in the context of the mystery that surrounds most of our characters – their fundamental identities and purposes in this story.
MORE on XIANG LIU
Koala also describes Xiang Liu’s relationship with our FL as ‘so hot and disfunctional’ with all the ‘blood sucking and how close they are to wanting to kill one another’.
She adds too that she wouldn’t have it any other way!
Perhaps Xiang Liu will not make it into our top boyfriends list…But there is so much more to come in this story.
@Kate, Thanks for all the information and the early allure of Xiang Liu. I knew that the preferred guy would be the bad boy. It’s just really is so alluring although in real life, ill-advised!!!
I’ll visit Koala’s Playground later. Below is the broken up and shortened recap of the scenes leading to the surprise neck bite, with my notes/comments/questions.
RECAP OF EPISODE 4 SCENE LEADING TO THE BITE
XY is humiliated and in a rage after SQ’s disappearance just as she’d depended on him to block CX’s attack. She tells SQ most loudly and emphatically not to follow her as she goes off by herself.
She sits at the lake’s edge. SQ comes anyway, seemingly unable to keep away, whenever she goes off by herself. And so does Serpent on Chubby. (I wonder what brought him over. Did he sense XY’s anger or was he just bored?)
Astute observer that he is, XL notes the chill between XY and SQ when she ignores SQ and comes up on Chubby. As they fly over the lake, he proceeds to question XY on why she’s angry with SQ. He seems to have a great deal of curiosity about her.
She claims to be angry with herself for thinking to depend on others and while XL thinks it natural for people to have thoughts of depending on others, XL says she is different because she has no family ie no others to depend on. At her most desperate times she’d depended only on herself and should have continued to think that way now as an adult.
XY : “Even if I fall, the only one who can catch me is myself.” She raises her hands and does a blind backward fall off Chubby into the lake below.
The swim seemed to have lightened her mood. She starts challenging Serpent to a swimming competition. She uses the same way of taunting him that she’d done with CX when they were children.
XY : “Can you swim? Do you want to have a competition?” (She’s one girl who was never cowed by the boys, and also irrationally unrealistic. In what dimension does she think she, with her shorter body, can beat a long and lean Serpent in a swimming competition?)
XL : “With you?”
XY : “If you dare. You’d better not use your spirit power.”…”Why, you dare not? Cant’ be. You dare not compete with me?
(One of her ways of interacting or allaying boredom or possibly finding out how far she can go, is to provoke non-stop.)
XY : “Are you afraid of losing?”
Despite his air of unconcern, Serpent can’t help but take her up on her challenge. But he deliberately words it as if he’s deigning to grant her wishes LOL.
XL : “Since you’re begging me, I agree.”
XY is taken aback : “When did I beg you?” (She’s just gotten herself into trouble here. He’s redefining the situation. It’s not that they are entering a competition for fun but that he’s being magnanimous in joining in the swimming competition.)
XL : “Didn’t you?” LOL
XY capitulates : “Alright, alright. Let’s say I begged you. Let’s start.”
(I’m wondering if she’s just bored. She wants a playmate. Or if she’s trying to find out if Serpent has any weaknesses that her poisons can penetrate. Maybe all three?)
To be continued…
Loving this @GB – waiting for the next instalment! (No pressure of course).
I really like your highlighting of XY’s coping mechanism being provocation…
And the many possible motivations because XY is no fool.
Continued…
On the shore, after the swimming competition, she says she lost and grills a fish for Serpent.
XL : “When you were young, you lived in Haoling?” (He continues to be curious about her.)
XY : “Must people who swim come from Haoling?”
XL observes astutely : “Not really. Swimming can make you feel joyful and relaxed. It must be related to your experiences when you were young.”
XY : “You’re a nine-headed serpent demon, you can think with nine heads. It’s extraordinarily powerful. Even your words have depth.” (This is mostly serious, but might there be a taunt in there?)
XL : “Don’t you know this is a taboo topic?” (This is a warning, but XY either does not bother, does not think it’s a warning or deliberately pretends she does not notice it.)
She has hit on a sore point with him. It seems that he does not like to be reminded of his nine heads. She gives him a quick look, makes a decision and places the fish over the fire. She sits close to him, nudging him familiarly as if they are bosom buddies rather than lord and servant. She’s taking liberties and he seems to impassively accept her nonsense, but his annoyance is building up, although he hardly shows it.
She questions and taunts him about his nine heads. (I’m laughing at her enthusiastic arrangements of stones to represent the patterns his heads might form LOL) And she goes on about his nine heads, while keeping a straight face. It’s hard to tell, even on my 3rd viewing, if she was just being careless with him or was deliberately testing the limits of his patience.
His patience snaps and he uses a spell to mute XY. He places his hand gently behind her head but then pulls her head forward hard and warns : “Actually, I prefer to eat mortals.” (By eat, we don’t know if he means to swallow his prey whole as snakes do, or whether he means to suck their blood. But serpents usually just bite people and not suck blood. Maybe he’s a vampire serpent?)
He strokes the side of her head and sounds like he’s teasing : “Someone like you is just enough for each of my heads to take a bite.” (This reminds me of Fairy and Devil when Devil threatened that he liked to eat fairies roasted or cooked any way, even raw. LOL.)
His seductive touch is deceptive and gives no warning of his intent. In a move that shocks viewers, his fangs appear and he bites her neck.
From Episode 5, we find out that this which might have been a one-time event to teach her a lesson in provoking him about his nine heads, but instead the bite informed him about the secret in her body ie that her blood had healing properties. After this, he resorted to sucking her blood whenever he needed a pick-me-up LOL.
@GB – I so enjoyed your two part recap. Thank you.
I laughed with you about the ‘enthusiastic arrangements of stones’… Still laughing. XY really pushes the envelope doesn’t she! Her motivation is unclear. Is she being a clutz or a strategist??
The mood is so light-hearted…we, the viewers, are NOT expecting the next development.
He acts without warning. As you say, to teach her a lesson initially… But now another secret has been revealed.
@Kate, that’s a good point. Maybe XY keeps provoking in order to cope with whatever is bothering her. She’s got abandonment issues, had some kind of trauma that got her wandering around in mountains unspeaking for years. Or maybe she really was sick, or was under a spell.
Taking it that 300 years had passed, we don’t know how long she suffered and why. At which stage was she again abandoned. Why was she not in the Jade Mountain undergoing the cultivation with the Queen Mother? We see her as a child looking dishevelled, and dirty outdoors.
Maybe she was too long alone in the silence and when she forced herself to speak, she lost some of her filters and started saying whatever came to mind. Anyway, her many facile questions aimed at the nine heads got her into more trouble.
Once XL tasted her blood and realised that unlike the wine, it had no poison but instead tonic or healing properties, she was done for. Now he won’t leave her alone. She’d not expected that he’d really ‘eat’ her, of course, but her endlessly poking made her lose more in the process.
Of course it also gives us several erotic scenes of Serpent stuck on her neck LOL. 😂
@GB… yes, well I’m building on your point re XY as agent provocateur – I hadn’t always understood that.
Yes – your hypothesis makes sense.
And… even when happy, she provoked as a child to get attention… remember the first scene of all with her older brother?
Yes, we are generously supplied with scenes with the serpent hungrily ‘stuck on her neck’ Haha. There is clear evidence in a later episode that these are more than painful encounters. I’ll find you a bit from the novel when we get there. LOL
Ladies, I stumbled on this cdrama last night and binge watched all 22 available episodes. loved nearly every minute even if I didn’t love all the characters. I hope they can redeem serpent guy. I think I like him the most but the relationship is dysfunctional and they both got issues. But they are great to watch! I will look forward to your thoughts on later episodes.
@Kelley,
It’s such a delightful show isn’t it? Just draws you in.
I’m with you in liking serpent guy the most… dysfunctional as the relationship is!
Do please come and feed in your comments whenever you feel inspired.
I am hoping more people will enjoy the show and join this discussion.
Hi @Kelley, isn’t the show great! It’s one of those that engage our attention and our hearts from the start. I’m glad that you’re enjoying it like we are. Do come back to give us your thoughts on our 7 dedicated threads. We’d love to hear from you!
COMMENT ABOUT SCREENPLAY – CHANGES FROM NOVEL
Hi all,
@GB and I covered a lot of ground over the weekend! Very enjoyable.
Tong Hua the author of the book is also one of three writers on this show.
I noticed an article on Koala’s Plyaground about complaints from Chinese viewers about some changes in the tv version.
These concern changes to the coverage of Ye Shiki’s character and that of Xiao Liung’s character. [ I won’t post because it has too many spoilers or at least follow-up discussion spoilers.]
Interestingly, they/she have added more detail about Xiao Liung (aka serpent guy!) – actions he takes (including kind ones) that are not made explicit in the novel.
On the other hand, Ye Shiki/Jung loses some air time and some scenes – including scenes which demonstrate his great intelligence.
There is some discussion about the reason for this. If Jing loses air time will it affect the viewer perceptions of the character?
XL is the author’s favourite character, apparently.
I suspect that they have fleshed out XL simply to make the narrative work better in a filmed version. IF XL’s character is too elusive it might not translate well into a tv series where actions and what we see are so important.
I think, too, that us hearing XL’s thoughts from time to time is part of this fleshing out of this character for tv.
I would be very surprised if there would be changes planned to the overall story – according to Koala, this account is 95% faithful to the novel so far.
ps I meant to add at the top of that comment – I am now recovering from the initial push! LOL
Oh dear – I keep getting the names mixed up! Apologies.
Xiang Liu is the name of His Serpentyness!
The writer Tong Hua is also one of the lyricists for this show.
Here is a link to the current OST – not sure about the quality of the translation of these songs.
https://youtu.be/sPONMDVfXms
Just want to drop by and admire your discussions, @Kate and @GB. 🙂
You’ve offered great points to chew on. Keep them coming please.
Ooh thank you @Packmule3 for your kind comment!
@pkml3 I join @Kate in thanking you for your kind words concerning our many words about this Show. It’s our pleasure!! This is one of those shows that are so much fun to write about and analyse again once more.
Thanks for always giving us the many threads and spaces in which to spazz and groan together. Watching with like-minded friends is fun greatly multiplied!
I am so torn about starting this drama. I missed out when Fairy and Devil was all the rage last year and all the hype has me wanting to jump in so I can be a part of the live-watch with this drama. I expect this first part to stay consistent and really good, but I’m leery of part two after hearing that 14 episodes have been cut! I don’t see how they can do that without really messing up the flow of the drama. I’m also afraid of boarding the wrong ship and being frustrated with the ending. I typically don’t suffer from SLS but I think this drama carries a serious risk lol.
Hi @Stacy, we think the 14 episode cut may not be externally imposed after all and be more of an internal production decision.
The gap between seasons may be more problematic.
I got into this show because it so engrossing. I suspect I will be in tears at various points.
It would be great if you did decide to watch – even if you dipped your toe in and watched the first 2 or 3 episodes…??
Hi @Stacy, I believe that the Second-lead-syndrome will be strong in this show, therefore you’re probably right!! LOL. However it’s hard to tell who is male lead 1 or male lead 2. Let’s say the bad boy is the Second Lead, then yes.
I try to be stoic about it. Not all the people who tug at our heartstrings are actually good boyfriend/girlfriend or husband or wife types. They are great to look at, swoon over and dream about, but h*ll to live with LOL.
I feel it will be the case with the Second ML. In the interview the actor was asked if he preferred a happy or sad ending. He really didn’t know but decided that maybe sad would be more ‘beautiful?!?!’ Either way, he himself says, he would cry LOLOL.
I guess I will want him to be happy somehow and getting the girl is not the only way to be happy.
Reasonably and rationally speaking, the other male lead will make the sounder, more steady partner for life. Like I said before… I may like the Second ML but I’ll probably only introduce the other male lead to my daughter!!!
@Kate, I’ll also be out of the house most of Wednesday and Thursday, but I’ll come by in the evening to relax here and read and try to watch and write my thoughts. Will see you then!!
Heh! Decided to just say that I rewatched Episodes 1-3, and liked the Ye Shi Qi scenes up to the point Xiang Liu shows up. Poor Shi Qi starts to fade away by comparison. LOL.
The charm of Shi Qi for Xiao Yao really was that he waited for her no matter what. As XY goes off to catch the Feifei, she says to herself that no one would wait for someone else forever. She really expected that SQ would go off by himself after getting tired of waiting. However he would ultimately go in search of her and bring her home.
Another thing that struck me this time is that Xiang Liu voluntarily removed his mask in front of XY and she somehow recognised him as XL.
@GB – just off to work – but I agree Ye Shi Qui is where the good stuff happens and then they constipate the plot as far as Jing is concerned and he comes off ‘impotent’ as a man, As you say, you can’t have a colourless lead competing against a very colourful lead.
I don’t know if this is hearsay – but apparently a lot of actors turned down the role of Jing. Deng Wei has done an excellent job of inhabiting the space he’s been given. We’ll see more anon…
@Kate, yes I did hear that the role was not attractive to many actors. It’s a good role for Deng Wei to grow with.
Episode 4 Note worthy points
– XY didn’t believe that there was no one who could successfully poison XL. She vowed that when she managed to take XL down by poison, he’d die by her hand.
– This episode sealed the promise that SQ made to XY. He promised that he would listen only to her. As long as he did not leave her, he’d always be Ye Shi Qi.